Pain medication

[Dana]

I want to know why all Doctors think that if they help keep you from suffering from chronic pain by giving prescription drugs such as Vicodin or other narcotic pain relievers, they think you automatically become addicted to them. Not everyone has addictive tendencies. I had taken Vicodin for 3 years straight before moving out of town away from my understanding and sympathetic doctor whom, after numerous tests on me realized the serious problems with my spine. He had me on Vicodin for 3 years to ease my suffering. When I moved to a different state, I ran out of my pain medication and just stopped taking vicodin. NOTHING HAPPENED TO ME! NOTHING! I did not get sick, shake, sweat, vomit, turn to other drugs or alcohol..........NOTHING! I just suffered constantly with pain. I waited a few months before seeking another doctor in my new town. He treated me like a junkie and told me to take Advil. That was two years ago. Well after two years on Advil, I now suffer from easy brusing and stomach problems. So why do most doctors want to see a patient suffer instead of help them ease their pain? So.......narcotic pain medication is addicting! Big deal. In this day and age with all the new meications to help pain, it is a shame so many of us are allowed to suffer everyday of our lives. So its addicting......isnt that the patients problem anyhow? Cant the doctor at least try and see if indeed these patients show signs of addiction like going through the medication too fast and looking for refills when they shouldnt need them yet? Why cant a doctor give the patient the benefit of the doubt first?
Oh well......advil will do me just fine. I would rather take that then be treated like some drug addict. It may only help me 10% of the pain but at least I dont have to answer to someone that has no idea how I suffer and I dont have to feel like some drug addict. Please answer me.
Thank you
Dana

[mike w]

hi: i have been taking oxycontin sence dec 99 it is helping me with the pain im in from my cancer. i own a small business and i cant take sick days because if im not there things wont get done. i was concerned that i was becoming a druggie and asked my dr. about it, his reply was- im a much more prouductive person with my pain med (oxycontin 20 mg x2)than when im not taking them, and he was right. i can work all day and only need to worry about work not my pain to. i wish more dr.'s would think for the person they are treating and not for themselves.  regards mike w

[for Sick and scared/beware of Vicky!!]

Hi Mike
Sorry to hear about your cancer. That explains it though why your doctor is treating you with pain medication. Because you have cancer and it is a proven fact that cancer causes great pain. I on the other hand suffer from chronic back pain due to three herniated discs in my lower back and they come up with this theory that alot of people have dics out and suffer from no pain at all. They also think it is easy to fake pain when you have back problems.
Take care
Dana

[Chad B]

One bad apple spoils the bunch.

[Ronnieg to Dana]

Dana,
First of all you shouldn't have to suffer. I am going to give you a web site that has a section for Pain Reps in your State.
Basically you email this person and he or she will get back to you and give you a list of reputable physicians in your area.
No one should have to suffer and no one shuld have to take Advil for any length of time as Advil is quite a bit more dangerous than opiods.
THere are an estimated 25,000 deaths per year from patients using NSAIDS (Advil).

Here is the site, simply copy and paste it in your browser if it isn't underlined when I get finished with my post. If it is underlined then point your mouse on the web  site and double click.

Good Luck

<a href=http://www.widomaker.com/~skipb/PlacementReps.html>http://www.widomaker.com/~skipb/PlacementReps.html</a>

[to doc dan from joe]

Sorry to change the thread but I can't post a new question.  I understand that going cold turkey from pain meds can last several days, I was wondering if the withdraw effects last the entire time (i.e 24/7) or do they come and go?  I've noticed for myself that when I have a "good day" (i.e less pain) requiring fewer pain meds I can feel those awfull withdrawal symtoms set in but I cant tell if they would gradually subside in a few hours or would that nasty feeling stay with me untill the pain makes me take another pill?? Since my pain varies every day I go through withdrawal several times a week.

[Amber to J.B.]

I've gone through withdrawl more times than I can count and for me the agony of withdrawl is constant and lasts almost exactly a week and gets just a little bit better everyday after about the third day. The feeling of withdrawl doesn't come and go, but sometimes you just don't think about it as much if you're occupied with something. The worst part is trying to get to sleep at night. I hope I've helped you somewhat.

[for Sick and scared/beware of Vicky!!]

I never thanked you for giving me that website. I went to it the same day and found tons upon tons of info.
I realize now that just because someone is suffering from chronic pain and needs more then advil or tylenol,  that doesnt mean that they are drug addicts!  There are plenty of them on this that are addicts and there also alot of folks that are confused because since they suffer from pain they are dependent on the pain meds....thus confusing themselves thinking they are addicted. Thank you again for your help. Now I wait for the list of doctors that care about ME and my well being.......this should be interesting!!  I have yet to find one!!!

[Jerry]

I, too was and am now a long time user of pain killers; vicodan
being the most current.  I know exactly how you feel. They can't
give you anything for chronic pain that works unless It comes
with the stima attached "addicting" woooooo!  No kidding, but
what is the difference that my wife takes zoloft, or remron, or
paxil, or any of the other anti-depressants that are too numerous
to mention. Is that not an addiction? She can't get off of these
new generation drugs, any more than a street junkie can get off
heroin.  At least I am taking something, that if, they wouldn't
fill it full of Tylonel or some other equally usless analgesic;
is a natural substance and if taken in the proper doses will
not damage your liver, stomach, or other organs it is, or would
be a substance that occurs naturally in nature,if they did'nt
screw with it.  Twenty years ago valium was the drug of choice
for Jr. executives and housewives who were under stress. They
were called "mothers little helpers". The some lady with an
additive personality overused her medication, wrote a book,
the medication became taboo. Ask your hmo for a few valiums now
and check out the looks that you get.  It is my prediction that
the current wave of new age medicine that messes with the levels
of naturally occurring subanstances in the brain will be the worst medicine that this country has ever known.  What is the difference if you HAVE to take every day for the rest of your life and addiction?  I'm sorry for rambling, but some of these
"care-givers" have never experienced chronic pain so you will
never be able to take a dose of an opiate like you can a dose of
Zoloft.
ever invented

[Ronnieg to Dana]

Dana,

What name do you use at the MGH Site? I will look for you over there as I frequent that site and only drop in here occasionally.

Peace,


Ronnieg

[Ronnieg to Dana]

Dana,

I forgot to give you this site as I bet I confused you. This site has an many forums including addiction and Chronic Pain forums.

I asked you your name in there and realized that the site I gave you was for something else. But please check out this site as the people there for the most part really care about everyone.

<a href=http://neuro-mancer.mgh.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number=2&SUBMIT=Go>http://neuro-mancer.mgh.harvard.edu/cgi-bin/forumdisplay.cgi?action=topics&number=2&SUBMIT=Go<a/a>

Good luck with your search in finding a compassionate doctor.

Ronnieg

[The Big EZ]

I might be able to help some of the pain sufferers here.
e-mail me:
***@****

good luck

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Oh yeah, EZ?  Hows that?  Care to elaborate a bit???

[Gina]

We are all ears! Please let us in on your secret.

[tom to Amy, Vic girl]

I hope you're not going to make a narcotics connection over the internet! At least get a semi-anon hotmail account under an alias first.

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Hi Tom, yes, I keyed in to that, never fear, hence my interest in additional information...Anyway, I get my meds from legit sources (ie my doc) so havent yet had to turn to such methods thankfully!

So last night I went to the ER with yet ANOTHER horrible migraine(have CHRONIC, intractable in most cases migraines) which had been going on for about 5-6 days. (That is how I got into this whole pain medication mess in the first place) and I was given Dilauded (Hydromorphone) 4mg IM. Wow, that knocked me on my ass!  I didn't like it AT ALL. Made me throw up about 4 times, plus I couldn't walk straight and was hallucinating.  It sucked.  Have any of you ever has this medication for pain?  Anyway, the doc gave me an Rx for these pills, and I want to know if the same  things will occur with the pills.  I want to take them for pain, but don't want to wind up sitting up all night scratching and brushing away bugs that are landing on me!  :)

Any info would be greatly appreciated!  Peace...

[Mike P. to Ken]

You know...this is the pain sufferer/addict in me saying this...but I'll trade you 2 for 1 in your favor Lortab 7.5's for your Dilaudid. Call it obnoxious or whatever but sometimes to get my back/adhesions to settle down and me some sleep - I have to take 4-5 Lortabs...Not great on the liver everyday...One of what you have, as a reserve would be beyond my wildest dreams when I'm in dire pain...And I'm not kidding. Of course, a drug that strong isn't really "fun" it kills the pain and knocks you out...but sometimes that's the best thing. I hope you don't take my offer the wrong way...but it drives me crazy sometimes knowing that the correct drugs for my pain are out there while I'm taking what someone else might need that doesn't necessarily work for me...or works better for someone else...I doubt you're up for this...but it never hurts to ask - right? And by the way - I'm not a cop:) Vicodin gurrl - maybe we can make each other happy? I know - pathetic plea on an internet board...Mike P.

P.S. - don't jump on me because this isn't the place for blah blah blah...I don't talk about this to anyone else, anywhere else - so YES it is the place to talk about it.

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Well, don't think I really want to get into drug dealing/trading, etc... at this point, sorry to disappoint.  Far as I can tell, these Dilaudid pills aren't doing crapola for me except nauseating the hell outta me. Dont seem to really be relieving my pain either.  How can that be?? From what I have heard today this is the strongest painkiller on the market...Am I screwed or what?  Honestly, Vicodin works much better for me and without the added benfit of massive nausea! Talk to y'all later...

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

I've had Dialudid IM and oral and didn't much care for it either. I also got nauseated pretty bad and nodded out frequently. I was a total veggie!  I was used to morphine and at least I could function well on it.
Dilaudid is very similar to heroine in my opinion as far as strength of painkilling effect.
I think that if you are used to hydrocodone, you should stick with it. Just my opinion.

[tom to Vic Gurrl]

ever see the movie Drugstore Cowboy? Dilaudid was portrayed as the narc or all narcs, better than morphine, demerol or even heroin. Of course, they were mainlining the stuff, which I understand makes all the difference with Dilaudid. I had a pill rx for the stuff once, but it did nothing but nauseate me and bring on a terrible, protracted headache. I hated Dilaudid in the pill form. Other people have said the same thing. I'm really surprised you got an rx for Dilaudid at all, Vic Gurrl, especially from an ER. I know there are some heroin junkies out there that would gladly take them off your hands.

Since they're pure Dilaudid, I imagine you could pulverize a modest amount and snort it, just to see if the stuff had less side effects when it didn't have to go through your digestive tract to get into your bloodstream. As long as you were careful with the dosage, what harm would there be? I mean, it has been prescribed to you. I know that oxycontin is great snorted.

Don't get me wrong, though. I haven't done this and am only thinking out loud. Do what you think is wise.

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

In Germany they were called "cold shakes" as they would readily melt in cold water- get the picture? Not that I would ever do such a thing but I have witnessed it. Left to the inexperienced the cold shake tablets could end you up in the morgue via OD express!

[Vicodin Gurrl to Dan]

Well, here's the story...As I said before,I have HORRIBLE migraines...have for years...have tried practically every therapy available, massage, relaxation techniques, ALL of the "triptans" (a class of drug normally very effective for migraine) as well as calcium channel blockers, beta blockers, etc...I also have an active RX for Butalbutal (Fiorinal) and Midrin. NOTHING works.  I was getting to the point that I was frequenting the clinics and the ER at leat 2x weekly for Demerol/Phenergan injections.  Demerol is a nasty drug. I have permanant lumps under the skin in my hips from receiving so many injections. I met with my doctor and informed her that I no longer wanted Demerol and she really had nothing more to offer me.  Two days later, I had a whopper of a headache.  My sweety poor guy, so supportive) took me AGAIN to the ER where we waited an agonlizing 2 hours to be seen (and I am an RN at this hospital...guess it isnt really all about who you know!). By the time I got in to see the doc I was coming unglued from the pain.  I refused Demerol and asked for morphine.  He told me it isnt very effective IM, and offered me the Dilaudid injection as this headache had been lingering for 6 days. You heard the rest in my previous post. Then he referred me to the pain clinic and gave me the Dilaudid pills to take home in the meantime (WHY hadn't someone referred me to the pain clinic before this???).  He was an AWESOME doc, didnt treat me like a "drug seeker" and didnt make me answer 500 questions before he treated my pain.  Too bad they aren't all like him.  Anyway...thanks for listening.  And thanks for the advice Tom and J.B.  Take care folks...

[Mike P. to Vic Gurrl and tom]

I apologize for coming on like a fiend if I did...I have read numerous times how much you like Vicodin - I have those...they're "ok" for the pain...sometimes I wish I has something stronger for days that I want to rip my spine out...Yeah, knock me out, whatever...just make it stop...I've never even tried Dilaudid...my aunt gets Dilaudid suppositories for her fibromyalgia and she says they only work slightly better than her Percoset...I honestly didn't mean to come off seedy, or back-alley drug deal...Just thinking, like tom said, out loud...I have what you need and you have something I'd love to have on hand...I don't take any offense to your not wanting to. Honestly - Nothing ventured nothing gained. You don't know who I am anyway, and that is obviously a problem. If you saw me - Long hair, tattoos, Harley the works...you'd say - "Oh yeah, doper..." But looks are deceiving. I'm actually a college grad with a highly respectable job (not that that makes someone NOT a doper)...just a bad back and sever adhesions on my side from intestinal surgery. I know - you don't give a ****...:) but I did want to kind of explain myself after I read my post and your response. Like I said when I posted...don't take it the wrong way...It was just the old story of "I've got fire and you have beef...Let's have dinner" kind of thing. Thanks for not biting my head off. If anything, don't throw them away, in case you change your mind:) - but THE MOST IMPORTANT THING that no one else has mentioned - don't take them if you don't like them...they will increase your tolerance for opiates 20 fold. Your Vicodin will seem like aspirin after 15 or 20 doses of Dilaudid and you won't have anything that helps you. Really. If it doesn't work for you pain-wise, it'll do more harm to you tolerance wise than good. Just some helpful advice there. Thanks for understanding me...I hope...

Hey tom - did you get my e-mail? I mailed you at patflann...you know the rest...I wasn't sure if the account was still active...but if it is I'd like to hear from you...You know, I was thinking - Propoxyphene, Darvon, I've been told is in the same family as Methadone...So in essence...you've kind of been doing the MMT treatment accidentally...probably helping yourself even at 16 a day Mg's wise over the Methadone...If taking the Darvon doesn't end your cravings for opiates, I'd say it's still a definite mental thing...the Darvon, since it's in the same family and is a much longer acting opiod than say Hydrocodone...you may do yourself a favor and just stick with that...I only butt my nose in because I've read your interest in MMT to Dan...And maybe he can help here. If Darvon is in the same family as Methadone...and say 65mg's of Darvon = 3 milligrams of Methadone or something...you may be able to save yourself some money etc. OR if the Darvon "therapy" isn't working for you to begin with - what's to say that Methadone will do anything more? Especially if it turns out MG wise to be a stronger opiate that what you are taking...Might turn out to be counter-productive for you - actually increasing your opiate intake over the Darvon...Something to think about...Tell me to shut up and mind my own business though if I'm intruding...Really...Thanks all for the ear - Mike

[Von]

I know exactly what you mean about pain meds and the stigma associated with them.  I'm fortunate to have a doctor who refuses to succumb to the "opiaphobia" many doctors have about prescribing pain meds.  My doctor says that so many people are undertreated because of this stigma and paranoia about prescribing pain meds that actually work.  I have taken Vicodin ES for 3 years, and have no plans to go off of them.  I just hope and pray I don't find myself in a situation like you experienced, having to find a new doctor.  I know I'd have trouble finding a doctor to prescribe what I've been on for years, and it's very unfair.  It's ridiculous that you have to take OTC drugs for your condition.  Have you tried seeking out another doctor?  I hope that you can find a more reasonable physician, people shouldn't have to suffer when there are so many effective pain meds out there.  And no one should be treated like a drug addict just because they take pain medication.  My God, why make the drugs if people can't access them?

[robw]

Where can i buy some Dilaudid or  Demerol?