Stadol NS

[Linda64]

I started taking Stadol NS in 1992 and in May of 2001 I stopped it.  I am having bladder control problems and wondered if this was maybe a symptom of the damage caused by this drug?  I was certainly addicted to this medication and was using at least a bottle a month for the last 2 years I took it.  Anyone with other symptoms from long term use of Stadol NS please comment.

[OxyDout]

CONGRATS ON BEING SOBER!!

God I wish I was more knowledgeable, but I'm not.  If I remember correctly, Stadol is the Nasal Spray........ I have been on vicodin and probably about 160mg of oxycontin for the last couple of years, I have improved a lot over the last 5 months, now I'm sober more then I am high, which is a great thing, I'm starting to slip a little, but I have to keep my head up.  Anyway, I to have noticed at points a lack of blatter control.  I"m a male.......so let me add a little humor to this.  Example: I would go to the urinal go to the bathroom, zip up my pants when I thought I was finished only to have th most annoying drops of pee rub up against my pant leg, it is awful!!!!!!!! although i haven't noticed it as much, I believe any pain medication will definitely have a direct relationship with the blatter.  It would only make sense seeing that when your too high you can't pee and then when your coming down you can't control your bladder to the best of your ability........I hope this helps a little, the best of luck and keep up the hard work.

GWH

[The Dude]

You might want to go to www.google.com and type in "Side effects of Stadol."  GOod luck.

[OxyDout]

don't take this the wrong way, but I have noticed some of the negative posts you have written, I can't figure if your trying to come across as a parental figure or if your just yelling........ why is it that you post here if you don't abuse any drugs or drink??? I"m just curious, I'm not angry, I'm just interested.

GWH

[skipper]

Lachoza:
i guess i'm kind of curious like GWH. you seem to have a large
hunk of something on your shoulder. are you co-dependent? i'm
not the most tactful person who ever will address you but *a
little bit of honey will draw a lot more flys than vineager!*
i've found that some days my attitude is my biggest problem.

keep posting and keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[Witchywoman]

Ok, I have something to share.
I was a bit reluctant to say what I'm about to say, due to recent difficulties on this board, but as Schlub so often reminds us, we are as sick as our secrets. It was this board that helped me get clean and it is this board that will help me stay clean.

Yesterday I came within moments of relapse, but didn't take the pills.

After a couples therapy session with my husband, which broke open the major painful issue in our 12 marriage, we had one of those all night, crying yelling screaming destructive fights.
I came to work the next day but had to go home early, as there was no way I could focus.

I felt so utterly hopeless, and isolated and ashamed.
I picked up the bottle of pills I still have and was so tempted to take some. I knew that temporary emotional relief of my pain was just moments away.  I even had the pills in my hand.
I prayed and cried. Why the hell I didn't get on the phone to one of my addict friends is beyond me. I didn't even think of it. In that state of mind I'm not thinking clearly obviously.

After a few minutes of playing with the idea of taking them I put them back in the bottle and went to sleep instead. I was shaking with fear. It was my 7th monthaversary of being clean yesterday. I reminded myself of how horrible my life was when I was a slave to those pills. I used those pills to dull the pain of the marriage issues (hubbie wants to have an open marriage, I don't, it hurts, lots).

I am embarrased that I came that close, but I also know that if I keep it a secret, I will be more likely to succumb to it next time I get tempted. I haven't even had a craving in ages, so this shocked me.  

I also feel ashamed that I was afraid to tell you guys how close I came to relapse. I was afraid that those here who don't like me would be unsupportive, or that I"d disappoint those here who may like me and may even gain some hope from me at times. But the hell with it. I have to be honest. I need you guys. I want to stay clean, pain or no pain. I have to have a clear head to be able to make marriage decisions. And just one pill would turn into a mountain of them, I know.

So, thank you for being a place I can come to talk about this, and for being there in general. I need all of you to stay on the path of freedom. And I also need to throw away that damn bottle of pills.

love,
WW

[skipper]

ww:
wow you really got me off-guard but hey thats ok by me.the point
here is we all have a past, a present, and a future. i promise i
will never judge you as an addict.  straight, clean, on the nod
strung out, turning blue we have all come through the same needle.
as one who has a past full of transgressions (to say the least),
how could i judge anyones addiction? did you know the part of you that is most worthwhile is the part that never was or will be an
addict? addiction is a sidebar in your life, period. i do agree
with you ditching the pills (flush em down the toliet, i have.) see
the addict in me wants to communicate *that it's a whole lot easier
to avoid temptation than it is to resist it!!* but there is a whole
lot more of you than what almost took some pills. stay focused,
call me or anyone else....see i don't want this forum to lose the
part of you that is not an addict!

i mean it about calling someone
oh yeah - get the angel on your shoulder
kip

[Witchywoman]

Thanks my friend..your words mean a lot.
Did you get my email from a few days ago? I am not even sure I have your correct email address.

I'll flush the pills tonight as soon as I get home today.
I have had them since detoxing. I had even more actually but a full, sealed bottle of 100 vicoprofen got stolen a few months ago. I noticed when I went to the medicine closet to get my claritin one day. I chalked that up to my karma for having raided other people's medicine cabinets myself over the years. Not something I'm proud of, but I did it a few times.

My rational, and my hubbies rational for keeping them is that we live in Earthquake country, and what if one of us or a neighbor gets seriously hurt in an earthquake and there is no access to meds that could help.

I've gone along with that, but that is not a good enough reason to put my recovery at risk anymore. Yesterday really scared me.

I need that angel! Thanks for being there.
love,
WW

[skipper]

ww:
ya can't get to heaven without walking through hell...you've
walked there long enough...you don't belong there anymore.

   turn 7 months into 8 - i dare you!

keeping angel on your shoulder?
kip

[dunit]

Hey, remember me? you are the one I admire!!! You are the one I am going to be in 6 months!!! After 20 years of this HELL-- and with my slow withdrawal this time with the help of the Bup,which I belive to be my saving grace, I will, with the help of God, my family and my own willpower be totaly drug free!!  
I agree with Skipper, get rid of any temptation, I KNOW there would be NO way I would stay clean if there were as much as a
ty-3 in the house! That's like an alcoholic keeping a bottle of his favorite booze on the kitchen table. WHY tempt yourself?
I guess there will always be urges that we will have to fight--maybe even 10 years from now that urge will hit you when you're weak and not up to fighting the battle--BUT YOU CAN DO IT! you have said you have a great support group, which is something I need to find, and there is always this forum. I've been too busy to post in the last week, but trust me I read what you guys post everyday--and that is MY daily dose of encouregment!
Bless you all, everyone of you is special--keep the faith

[Seamstress]

You didn't do it and that's what counts. Sometimes instead of one day at a time, it becomes one minute at a time or one second at a time.  I was going to ask you why you had the pills in the first place but then read you were going to throw them out.  Good call.  Of course, I'm sitting here with a refrigerator full of beer from a party I had at Xmas. I need to follow my own advice.  I keep thinking I'll have some people over and let them drink it up rather than waste it. How's that for rationalization?

Weren't you going to check out NA?  Did you ever do it?  If nothing else, you'll get lots of phone numbers for times of crisis.

[1fortheroad]

hi everyone - sorry to hijack this thread, but my email isn't working, and i needed to share something with schlub...and whoever else is interested.  i told my husband everything about relapsing and how completely desperate i felt.  we decided i should hop on a plane (which i did monday) and go to this clinic in fl which helps people detox (outpatient) with buprenex.  you go to him 2 days in a row, and then he sets you up with a schedule of buprenex, which you taper off of for approx a period of 7 weeks.  he was such a great dr., and he explained to me (as no one has before) what has happened to my brain from abusing opiates and exactly what he will do to repair the damage.  using his program helps repair the damage much more quickly than if you were to quick cold turkey.  amino acids are also part of it, so some of the medical community agrees with thomas' recipe.

i am so thankful and relieved that i have done this.  thanks to this forum, i was able to come clean with my husband who couldn't have been more supportive.  thru my drug addiction of the past 2 years, i have managed to **** away much of our savings.  so, the fact that he was willing to spend the money for me to go to fl, was something i wasn't even prepared to dream about....just like schlub says, it's our secrets that kill us.  AND, people will surprise you when you let yourself be vulnerable and honest.  sorry this is so long, but THANK YOU schlub for all your advice and for telling me about this clinic in fl - i hope you are still doing ok - peace everyone!!!!

[littleguy]

WW,

Just wanted to say that my thoughts are with you today.  It certainly makes more sense to focus on what you did not do rather than on what you considered doing.  And, cravings surely do not make you any less of a success.

Keep the Faith!!
littleguy

[cindi]

As Karen said,  you didn't do it, and that's what counts,  can I ask you   have you ever decided on 12 step groups?  not that that is the answer for everyone but for some people they do help..You above all people should know that the underlying reason for wanting to us is what really has to be adressed.  Using won't make the problem go away.  the marriage problems will still be there and the 2 or 4 pills will escalate and not only will your problems be the pills once again but everything else will snowball and you'll be back to square 0ne.  We have watched you come a long way,,and give out advice and  be there for others,  WW, you are human..and you are an addict..you slip...but this time you caught yourself before you fell..first of all get rid of the pills..and get back up and move forward..and why should we, on any board judge you  why should we? we are all in this togehter, That's not we are about..we don't judge,,no matter what you may think we are all here for each other,, putting any differences aside that any of us may have had,,and to help each other,,offer support and..encouragment.our faiths are very different but still i will keep you in my pryers and thoughts.                love,
cindi

[Seamstress]

Amen, Cindi.  Principles before personalities.  We'll do anything to keep each other clean. And we're all only one pill or one drink away from active addiction so we need this support. From everyone for everyone. Most of us know what it's like to relapse and so far, WW has not had that painful experience.  And I would do anything within my power to make sure she never does.

[Witchywoman]

Wow, ok here I am at work waiting for my first client and having to redo my mascara from crying after reading your caring, supportive posts.
Thank you. Thank you for being able to put the history behind and just being there for me and saying the exact things that I needed to hear to stay on my path. Thank you for caring, no matter what.

I did flush the pills, and didn't take any. Last night I actually was not even tempted to take any. I just wanted them out of my house. They felt like the Devil to me.

Yes, I was going to check out NA, but never did. Still the same old excuses..mostly fear that my clients will see me there. I want to find a group that is just for therapists, I know they exists, I just need to put more energy into finding them.

I'm still very depressed. I went to bed at 7pm last night and slept through till 6. My husband is not reaching out like I want him to, but I know what it is like to be around a depressed person and feel helpless to pull them out of it..but still...a soft touch, a 'hey do you want to talk' would help.
But that is all part of the problem.

This whole issue of nonmongamny is what began my addiction to begin with. It's a long, long story, but the bottom line is that it hurts like hell, and the false euphoria of narcotics was the only thing that ever dulled the pain enough to keep me functioning. Ha. Functioning! As if addicted living was functioning. Who was I trying to fool? Just myself, I guess.

Again, thank you for being there. I'll turn those 7 months into 8, I promise.

I love you all, and I need you all.
love,
WW

[The Dude]

NO, I have no hunk on my shoulder, nor am I trying to be condesending in any way.  I'm sorry if I come off like that.  I used to be addicted to every drug known to man and I am recently clean.  Sorry if you all took anything the wrong way.  Maybe it's just the words that I use that sound overbearing or "parental."  I'll try and be more polite.  I've just been through alot of the same stuff you guys are going through now and I want to help.  Maybe it's tough love?  haha  Anyways, sorry about that.

C

[OxyDout]

Don't sweat it, I thought you had never tried drugs and you were just venting about how dumb we all were, its hard to interpret over the computer, i appreciate the post.  Thanks again, and keep posting.  

GWH

[skipper]

hey:
sometimes the best laid plans....istarted a detox that i intended
to last until next tuesday. well i really and literally fell off
the cart, so to speak. this morning i was at the pool a work. i had a decent, but somehow odd swimm. i did my nonstop mile a little slower than usual. i attributed this to my stomach being shredded by 800mgs. of motrin. well i saw it (my swim) to its completion. now i usually have to sit for a minute to let my head clear from all the endorphines i generate while swimming. as i was sitting on the side of the pool admireing the perfect stroke and utter grace of the swimmer in the lane next to mine. i turned my head a little too far to check out this young woman's flip turns. they were absolutely perfect. well i felt a pop and a crunch in my neck. these noises happen a lot, so i didn't pay it any mind. i stood up and started walking alongthe movale bulkhead to the pool deck. i felt a very hot sharp wave of pain from my neck that went all the way down to my finger tips. the next thing i knew a very small life quard was try to slide a rescue board un -der me. i guess i passed out and fell into the other side of the bulkhead. fortuneately, the small space wasn't being used by the aqua exersise group. i can't even describe the embaresment and
pain i felt. i finally made it back to the locker room. the swimm coach in charge today knows of my spinal pain and associated problems with my my neck problems. i guess he is going to try to slip buy without filing the required "incident report." something
like this could get me banned fro use of the pool. i went back
into the locker room somehow got dressed and drove home. i had a
small stash of oxy my wife had hidden for emergencys... well i'm
back on (at least for today). i'm really discouraged and angry at
myself for not being able to ride this detox out to he day i had
set. oh well the beat laid plans of an addict. sometimes it feels
as if disapointment is the only way i interreact with myself. no
tears though, just a grim determination to do beter next time. i
really feel as if i've let myself and a whole bunch of other
people down. ****, ****, ****! i am so digusted and disapointed
with myself. now i'm half jacked on **** (dope) and right back at
square one. has anyone else been having this kindda of stuff seem
to sabotage the few good intentions that they try? oh well, i
guess tomarrow is another day....
keep the angel on your shoulder
kip
PS i doubt anyone thought i was perfect, but if they did i guess
i set them straight....hell i'm just a **** up

[skipper]

Lachoza:
first of all allow me to welcome you to this forum. ther will al-
ways be room for just one more addict here! please accept my appol-
ogy for my less than friendly and helpful words. i believe that the
addicts on this forum should support each other as no one else is
going to. sarcasm has it's place, just not what i thoughtlesly sent
your way. please forgive my !!
keep posting and keep an angel on your shoulder!
kip

[Witchywoman]

Kip my friend, what other choice did you have? You have a very serious neck condition that causes unrelenting pain, and you did the right thing.

My friend, for all the supportive kind words you say to me, including yesterday's words of never judging me no matter where I am in my addiction..I have to hold up a mirror and pray that those same words bounce back to you.  Please don't judge yourself. Love yourself. No one is more worthy of love and acceptance than you. Hell, we are *all* worthy of love and acceptance. But you give so much to so many..please save some of that endless acceptance and compassion for yourself.

You remain in my thoughts and prayers, always.

love,
WW

[lanas]

WW--I just wanted to tell you that I really feel for you regarding the difficulties in your marriage and my thoughts are with you.  I too have used the opiates as an outlet for a troubled marriage--it has kept me "functioning" in it just as you related.  But I too am coming to realize that just isn't the way.  And I am totally impressed and astounded and amazed that you have had drugs in your houase and haven't taken them!  WOW!  But I also think it is great you went ahead and got rid of them--that took some amazing strength--strength I'm not sure I would have had (I pretty well know I would NOT have had).  But you are obviously a very strong person and your strength has really helped me in numerous ways.

Kip--I know you had to have been so disheartened but you know you have real true severe health problems--you should not allow yourself to feel like you have somehow failed anything.  It seems you have such a certain level of peace within you that really nurtures so many of us and with such pain, you did the right thing to take the meds--hey! You're only human... with or without that angel.  :)  Stay cool; you're okay.

[GOD]

Don't worry about it, Skip. You're doing great-- 5-6 days of detoxing from OXY is excellent. I have an Aunt who can't go more than 6 hours without her MORPHINE. If she takes a high enough dose, she'll pass out on the couch, and as soon as she wakes up, and can walk again, it's right back to the pill bottle. I REALLY worry about her. I sent her the link to this forum, but I found that it is of little use as she can't use her computer anymore because it's too "Confusing." this from a lady who helped build a multi-million dollar High tech company. She really DOES need some pain relief, but I wish she could do what you do (Checking your real pain level by going without the heavy meds once per month)-- but unfortunately, she doesn't have it in her. that's what I really admire about you.... Even though you seem to have access to any drugs you require, you STILL PORPOSELY SUFFER to find out where you are in physical recovery.

From a former ALKIE and current semi-Junkie (Ultram)--

Keep the angel on the right hand side!

Jess

[jennyfla]

Hey guys,
Sorry to butt in!!!!
I'm having a big change going on in my life, starting very soon.
My doctor was arrested two-days ago, and this is a better time than any to clean up!
There's no way we can afford the pills on the street, and can't make it solely with my husband's script alone.
This is the end, and it's long overdue.
I'm scared to death, wondering how awful withdrawal is going to be.
I'm going to try some buph, and anything else i can get my hands on and try to get through it.
I can't take time off of work, i still have to take care of my three children, so basically, wish me a lot of luck!!!!
I'm know i'm strong and i know i have a lot of determination, and i need to do this, so that's what's going to be done.
I couldn't even fill my valium script because my dr's license was pulled, so now i have a script for 90 v's, and it's no good.
I still have some V's, but i don't know if it's enough.
Why didn't i fill the darn thing last week when it could have been refilled (****!!!)
Anyway, wish me luck and wish my hubby luck too!
Please say a prayer!!! :)
Lv Jenny

[confused.grl]

Wow i cant believe you can be so strong as to have the botle of pills in your hand and have a craving and not to tke any, wow if i had the strenght maybe i could put all this **** behind me , i have only posted a couple of times but i cannot quit i believe now that i may never get through this , i just cant stop using.

[Witchywoman]

Jenny..try to see this as a blessing in disguise. You've known for a long time now that the time would come where you would have to face this, every since I've known you, you've talked about your doc's possible brushes with the law.
I'll do whatever I can to help you. The main thing I can say is try to work up to really really really wanting to stop.  If you put as much energy into recovery as you have into using, the odds will lean in your favor.

Confusedgirl, believe it or not, when I detoxed cold turkey last august, I had about 200 vicoprofens in my house the whole time.  Everyone told me to pitch them. I should have. But, part of what helped me get through it was the knowledge that I had the choice, hour by hour sometimes, to use or not use.  I wanted to get clean so bad that the pills truly looked like poison to me, but I couldn't bring myself to throw them out. Then they became a non issue. I noticed that most of them got stolen, though I have no idea who did it.  But now, I see the danger in having kept them.  I had  a real close call with relapse. It was just me and the pills, and a choice to be made.  Thankfully, I made the right choice. But the pills are gone now. I flushed them, and my Doc knows to not ever give me any more.  

It was not a good call on my part to keep them around, no matter what the reason.  Even though I felt my recovery was fairly solid, that slamming urge to numb my pain came out of the blue, and it was very very humbling to know that I am just one pill away from exactly where I was before.  I am an addict, and I'll always be an addict, and I thank you all, as well as my closest friends and my Higher Powers for the grace that kept me from using the other night. You may call it strength...it didn't feel like strength to me. It felt like Divine intervention, honestly. I was feeling very weak and beaten down. I was feeling discarded, unwanted and all those horrible feelings that can come up for us all.

My desire to be clean is a very very strong one, but it is not strong enough to keep me clean. That takes a Higher Power. I firmly believe that.

thank you all,
WW

[jennyfla]

Thank you WW, you are always so sweet and i always respect your thoughts.
Real quick, my hub would be mad if he knew i was discussing this, he told me to tell no one for some weird reason.
He's getting very controlling since this happened, making demands that i do this and that and not do this, etc.  They are all things to help me, but still, i feel like smacking him upside the head, he's getting on my nerves.
It is a blessing in disquise, but i am so very scared.
I kind of had a panic attack earlier walking around crying my eyes out.  My oldest daughter was very sweet and could see i was hurting.  I'm not in withdrawal yet just panic.  I couldn't even get my valiums refilled, i have no idea how i'm gonna pull this off!
The burph is 'not available' right now, but i put in an order anyway.
I believe in god very strongly, and you can believe he's gonna be hearing a lot from me here shortly.
It's so scarey, as you know, i have no idea how i'm gonna pull this off, continue working and taking care of the kids.  My oldest will help, and i'm gonna have to rely on her a lot.  My hub, he will help too, but i'm not sure if we will do this at the same time.  Plus, we never agree on how to do anything around here, so that's the last thing i need is conflict.
I think i'll just bow down a bit, let someone else do the work for a while (not my way which i hate), but hey, first things first, getting myself better!
Thank you for offering to help, lookout email!!! :)
PS. you hang in there too!  I know you're going through some rough times right now and know that i'm thinking of you!
Just be open and honest with your feelings with your hubby.  Make sure he knows exactly how you feel and how he may be hurting and affecting your feelings with things.
It may not be so great to threaten that's he's threatening your sobriety, but if you two are close, he should realize that already.  Just don't hold back you feelings, you deserve to be heard and he needs to understand exactly how you feel.  Maybe there's some sort of comprimise that can be made, or some changes that will make you feel better about the whole situation!  Good luck sweetie, and (((HUGS))).  Email me anytime, i'm always here to listen and i will understand your feelings!  :)
Lv Jenny

[Jack Frost]

WW

It is amazing how those hydros dull the pain of a marriage that is broken. You can go home pop a few and just stay in a fog that prevents any intimacy. But you woke up and came clean and now those issues are so painful because you are dealing with them clean. I am so proud of you for posting here, the place you became clean, the place where you have helped so many people with your reasoned compassion and honesty. You are really stronger than you give yourself credit for. As someone said, you are a role model. When I first admitted I had a drug problem you were there immediately, caring and you have never left. I don't think your friends will ever leave you here either.

And thanks for flushing the hydros. Can you imagine doing that 6 months ago - a junkie's nightmare! If you didn't have bumps on your continued recovery you would be the exception not the norm. And a support group is probably a good idea - I like the idea of the therapists group, but any group or friend is a good move.

Kip, I have been at a point where I completely detoxed and woke up one morning and couldn't get out of bed. I ate so much alleve and motrin and was in exquisite pain. So I took the hydros and the pain left. What you did was totally justified. You didn't lose your insight, just your pain. I hope you get back on the wagon when it is time.

Peace,

jf

[Witchywoman]

Jenny, if you can't get the bup, check out the site www.cprflorida.com   They  might even be near you. They do fda approved, medically supervised buprenorphine detox, outpatient. I think you have to see the Doc two times, and you can do the rest at home, while functioning in your every day life.
It is probably expensive, I think the whole detox program is $1500.  but think of what the price of staying addicted and paying street prices are!

Plus, the added help of having a doctor who really understands can help give you the motivation to make it through, and evidently the bup makes it almost painless.

Just a thought, but since you are in florida, it seems like something very worth checking out for you.

Jackfrost, thank you for the kind words, I really appreciate them.
I'm doing better today, feeling more solid, but have no illusions that those feelings won't overwhelm me again. It's good to know you are all here when I need you.

love,
WW

[Hinkster]

Jernnyfla,
  We are with you all the way. Myself and everyone else. Good
luck to you and your husband. I will say a prayer for you, you
bet I will.
Tom

[Ketta]

I'll pray for you and your husband. You can do it. Ketta
p.s. what was your doc. arrested for? I think i missed something. very curious.

[jennyfla]

Thank you for all your support, it really means a lot to me!!!
WW, darn, if i only placed my order when i started talking about it less than 1 month ago.
They say i have to wait about 2-weeks, then the order time on top of that.
I think i might call a dr that i saw back about 1-year ago.  He did a bunch of tests on me because i was getting paranoid that i was dieing. Everything came out fine at the time, and i even broke down and started to cry and told him the truth of what was going on, so he knows my situation.
I think i might just get an appt and talk to him at least.  At the time he gave me the number of a local outpatient treatment facility, which i was already familiar with.
I'm pretty much flat broke at this time, so even if i wanted to buy the drugs on the street, it isn't even possible, that's why it's time to stop.
I panicked last night and was loosing it, but today i feel a little better.  I can't really trust my feelings because, of course, i'm numb right now.
I'm scared to death of not being able to function.  When in withdrawal, even walking is a chore, i remember.  How am i going to care of an extremely active 2-year old!!!!!  She pushes me beyond my limits, i have no idea how i will pull this off.
I'm gonna be doing a lot of praying!!!  The emptiness inside and boredom of not being high is also very much on my mind.  I'm going to try to find a focus!  Last time i did this i was pregnant, so that was my biggest focus.  I stopped, but wasn't physically addicted yet.  Even still, the first month was tough, i felt lost with the drugs/alcohol/cigarettes which all stopped on the day i saw that line of the pregnancy test.  
To complicate everything further, with it not just being me, having my husband doing this too makes it even harder.  I know i must concentrate on myself, and he can take care of himself.  But his actions effect me and if he isn't able to work, he has a very physical job, then i will suffer too.
So much worries, so much to think about, it scares me to death!!!!
Thank you for the prayers!!!
Lv Jenny

[1fortheroad]

hello - witchywoman - you mentioned cprflorida...i just got back from there a few days ago, and it was fabulous!  i was in such dire straights that i booked a flight monday, flew down monday night and was seen at 8:45 tuesday morning.  i am pretty much broke from buying meds, but i NEEDED to do something and couldn't find an outpatient program near me that used anything but clonodine (which doesn't work for me).  the doc down there was very, very knowledgeable and compassionate.  he also gave me a bunch of amino acids, so that "recipe" also has some merit in the medical community.  i would recommend the place to anyone.  think about it this way...think about all the cash we all spend on meds - i know for me, especially in the last year, i have spent thousands...it is sickening to me.  this money was well spent, and i am hopeful that in approx 6 weeks time i will be off the buprenex and feeling ok.  buprenex allows you to feel ok throughout the withdrawal, while letting your brain's receptors heal.  us opiate addicts have receptors that have been worn down to little nubs leaving us unable to naturally feel pleasure - hence the lengthy depression which follows detox.  he also gives a sleep aid, which is wonderful (short-term). addicts don't ever get rem sleep, which is why we are lethargic post detox....we are suffering from chronic fatigue syndrome.  i learned SO much from going to this place, and honestly he is the first person i've talked with that really UNDERSTOOD what i'm feeling and how to fix it.  the rest is up to me, however, and i am going to meetings.  that is a integral part of the process.  i don't like the meetings, and i generally don't buy in to the 12-step thing, but i am going and will continue to go.  sorry for the long post...didn't realize just how long it was until i got to this point...haha

[Seamstress]

Please share the name of the sleep aid.  I am soooo sleep deprived I was considering hitting myself in the head with a hammer.

[skipper]

groovy:
hey, thumbs up and hat off to ya! i hope you have no legitimate is-
sues to deal with!
keep and angel on your shoulder
kip

[1fortheroad]

what do you mean by legitimate issues??  do you mean pain issues?

[1fortheroad]

the sleep aid is called restoril, and it really works well.  he also gave me an antianxiety called oxazepam (serax), so i take taht one first, and then a couple minutes before i go to bed i take the restoril...i have never slept like this before, and i'm not all groggy in the morning.

[1fortheroad]

that last post was an answer to your question.  sorry i addressed it to the wrong name...

[Seamstress]

Thanks groovy.  Are those benzos? If so, be careful.  Don't take long term.

[skipper]

groovy:
please accept my apology. i ment to ask if you had any legitimate
pain issues. my poor typeing (and proof reading skills) are my only
excuse. i too would take offence if someone asked me if i had legit
pain issues i certainly would do a "mentle double take!"

again please forgive what must have been a wierd and distasteful
post. i hope only the best for you in your recovery!

keep an angel on your shoulder
kip

[skipper]

groovy:
again my proof readin (lack of) makes an ass out of me. what i ment
to say was " i too would do a mentle doubletake if i were asked "do
you have legitimate issues?" i know i can be abrasave and sarcas-
tic, i just hope you realise i wasn't trying to be
kip

[Witchywoman]

Restoril and Oxazepam (serax) are both benzos. I'm kinda suprised that your Doc told you to take both, since they are very similar to each other. I'm glad that you are able to get some sleep, but do be careful, as you don't want to end up with a benzo addiction on top of it all, and the body can get addicted to them pretty fast.

I've recently discovered a sleep aid that works very well for me.
It's a nutrional supplement called Gaba.  At first I tried it and it did not do a damn thing. But I learned that it does not cross the blood brain barrier unless it is bonded with niacinamide and inostol (both of which are b vitamins). When I just added a bcomplex tablet to the Gaba, I got a slightly improved effect, but not much.  So then I moved on to the Twinlab brand of Gaba. The capsule has Gaba which is chemically bonded somehow with niacinamide and inostol.  This lets the Gaba hitch a ride over across the blood brain barrier, and at least for me, works extremely well.  I'm suddenly able to get deep, restful sleep, and I wake up feeling refreshed and good.  

Just thought I'd share my experience with this one...it might not work for everyone, but it is worth a try. Just be sure to buy the Twinlab brand, it is called "Gaba Plus" and clearly states on the front label that it contains niacinamide and inostol.  It is non addictive.

WW

[jennyfla]

Thank you for sharing your experience Groovy.  I love you name, by the way!!!  Sounds so positive and upbeat!! :)
WW, thanks for the tip on sleeping.  Groovy, i never knew addicts weren't getting rem sleep, but i do know that i always wake up feeling like complete crappola, thought it was all waking up in full withdrawal!
WW, i remember twinlab products when i worked for a health food distributor long ago.  They have excellent products and i really believe in many of the 'natural' ways of curing what ails us.
I'm in for my 'ride' soon, and i absoluately scared to death.  I couldn't refill my valium script, so i won't have much of that.  I want to be healthy again, something i really used to thrive on.  I used to love feeling 'good' naturally, taking in all that life had to offer.  I used to enjoy the sunshine, the smell of rain, the sound of the ocean and the smell (i can't smell the ocean anymore these days), looking at my kids and smiling, i can't do that these days either, not when my mind is so twisted and i'm in such pain inside.  I remember what i used to feel like and i really am looking forward to getting that back.  It's such a hard thing to explain, but it's the feeling of living.  My life has been centered around getting high, when i will get high next, worrying about having enough to get high, worry about the money used to get high, and feeling horrible about myself for living like this.  I want to look forward to things, enjoy life using my own body's chemicals and not relying on a chemical to make me think i'm feeling good.  Mostly, i want to wake up in the morning without laying in a pool of sweat hardly able to get outta bed because i hurt so much.  My moods are getting worse especially with this added stress of fear.  I snap and think who the hell was that, like i'm possessed.  I'm afraid of what i will do or say next.  I don't want to hurt anyone with my actions (mental), and i want to be a good mom.  Children can grate on your nerves like nothing else, and the last thing i want to do is take out my frusteration and pain out on them.  Again, i just loose my patients easier and can't handle as much, but i would never go as far as to harm them physically don't misunderstand.  I hate that i can't be one of those perfect moms with the patients of a saint these days because you almost have to be a saint to handle three kids.
My 9-year old's been such a great help, i don't know what i'd do without her.  I guess all that good mommy loving has paid off and i'm being rewarded because she's such a great help and understands that mommy isn't feeling very well these days.  I want to get my act together and clean up so i can be a better mom to all of them and not have my 9-year old think that mommy is loosing it, she deserves so much more than that!
I got all long-winded on this one!
I can't wait to have myself back, i've missed myself so much over these past few years, it's time!
Lv Jenny

[1fortheroad]

i know exactly what you mean about remembering how you used to feel - enjoying the smell after the rain, etc.  gosh, i NEED to be back there...i am determined.  i feel so empty inside - nothing gives me joy - i used to get really "happy" when i got a new prescription filled without a hassle, i guess relief is more the word to describe it.  happiness?  i don't think i've felt "true" happiness in at least two years.  narcotics have robbed me...when on the drugs, i would feel tons of energy...nervous, crazy energy and i'd get lots of stuff done.  i thought that was happiness.  i miss being outside and just "being" - i always have a big vegetable garden, and early in the morning i'd go out and work in it...i LOVED it - the fresh dew on the plants, feeling the earth between my fingers.  these past two years, i'd rush thru weeding, watering, etc...my garden still looked good, but i didn't derive any of the pleasure from nature that i used to.  it's weird...my garden had less weeds than it did any other year, but i didn't feel any joy when i looked at it - didn't feel the satisfaction of putting in the work.  sorry for rambling, but like i said...i feel i've been stripped of my soul and spirit.  i hope someday it comes back to me...i always ask how long that will take - no one seems to know the answer...prayers to all you fellow addicts out there...just hang on...

[jennyfla]

Good luck and i hope you make it to finding your spirit and soul again, and i think you will.
I would give it at least 1 month, after that, i think you will slowly start to feel things that you have missed from 2-year back.
It's a short time compared to 2-years really!
I think it's important to find a focus, and really concentrate on it.  Your garden sounds like a wonderful focus.
I always have my kids to focus on, but i need something else.  I always do better with a focus.
Good luck, all things are possible!
Lv Jenny

[1fortheroad]

i didn't mention my 5 year old daughter - she is the REAL focus...i write as tho people know me and know about my life...i love that kid so much.  i look at her and lately feel such incredible guilt...she's seen me sick, too sick to get off the couch and ride bikes or do anything...she thinks i get the flu a lot...great mother huh?  i used to think i was a wonderful mom - i was there for her 100%...at least two of those years were spent taking a lot of vicodin, so i wasn't really there.  i guess i can only be thankful that i realized what was happening when i did, and i'm trying to stop it now. the buprenex really helps - i wish more people would give it a try.  i don't know what will happen when i stop taking it...i'm going to wean way, way down, so hopefully it won't be too painful.  i tried it awhile ago, and i went from taking 5 in a day to none - that was really, really difficult...because it is an opiate - is addicting.  anyway, i am just trying to keep my daughter and husband in mind when things get really bad...they are my anchors and i will not fail them again.

[jennyfla]

I have a 9,6 and a 2, so i can relate to the mommy guilts!
You hang in there and i did talk to someone today from the crp place.   The program sounds real good.
I take oxys so i'd have to be off them for more time.  They would put me on oxycodene first, because with oxys, you have to be clean for 50 hours!!!  I've never gone that long, whew!  Then drive 90 miles, ouch!!!!!
I'm checking with a local dr to see if he can detox me from the oxys!
Good luck and don't worry so much about how you will feel without the buph.  If you're really ready, you will feel great!!!
Good Luck!
Lv Jenny

[1fortheroad]

yeah, it's really hard to stay off the stuff, but if you don't, you will get so incredibly sick you will wish you were dead.  trust me.  i didn't wait when i got temgesic and tried to detox myself...i truly felt as if i would die.

i'm so glad you called that place - they are really very nice and the guy that runs the place knows what he's talking about.  it was so nice to talk with a professional that truly knew how i was feeling, what my fears were etc.  flying down there while in total withdrawal was horrible.  it was so hot when i got there, and i was shivering and sweating at the same time...if your doc will agree to prescribe it, it's a much cheaper way to go...good luck with that.  let us know what you decide to do....

oh yeah, how long have you been on the oxy's?  just curious...

[jennyfla]

I've been on oxys for about 1 1/2 years this time.  I had a pregnancy inbetween my using so i quit for a while, and now i'm physically addicted.  Before pregnany i was not physically addicted and through i wasn't able to 'get' addicted.  A friend of mine used to call me 'miss non-addictive', knowing all too well that i was only fooling myself.
Best of luck to you, stay strong, and you will stay on the right track.
Lv Jenny

[skipper]

ok lets get one thing besides each of you guys straight. the
first thing a person must do after getting clean is to learn how
to love and forgive yourself. one of my favorite junky authors,
WS Burroughs said "the past is fiction." when i first cleaned
up in a 12 step program, i had a sponcer that told me repeatedly
"i'm going to love and care about you and there isn't a *******
thing you can do about it!" he would then talk of the importance
of learning how to love yourself. like it or not i had to let go
of all the transgressions in my past. i trust neither one of you
has been arrested for child neglect or abuse, so the sooner you
let yourself off the hook, the sooner you can return to the real
important things like children, aging parents,ets...
got angel on shoulder?
kip

[1fortheroad]

you're like the "wise" man of the board...you offer sincere/good advice with no judgemental undertones...i like that!!

i never realized how much time searching for more drugs took.  i find myself with all this free time and not a clue how to spend it.  i can't even believe i'm saying that.  before, i'd be running around like a nutcase, always late and always just plain running out of time.  now, the days seem looong!  i must have really been living in a haze, because everything seems so crystal clear all of a sudden.  maybe i'm just losing my mind.  have any of you guys felt like this after quitting?

[skipper]

groovy:
thankyou for the compliment. i can't recall where anyone has re-
fered to me as "wise," outside of this forum. i would caution you
how ever that my ego can blow up to enormous size if too many compliments come too quick!

getting and useing drugs is a very time consuming endeavor that is quickly forgotten once we are on our way to the *warm and fuzzy place!* when i detox time seems to approach a standstill. when i'm useing drugs i usually feel like there isn't enough time to do all the things that need to be done. detox me and suddenly there is all kinds of time... i just don't have the energy and motivation to do anything. i think that most junkys feel this way. i also expierence that coming out of a fog into sharp, bright sunlight.

how goes your detox? when the depression and lethargy hits you,
post to the forum! i can't speak for anyone else, but i know there will always be an ear to listen. addicts don't always have the answers, but we can listen to each other!

any how keep an angel on your shoulder!
kip

[jennyfla]

You're underestimating yourself Kip, you are very wise and also full of knowledge through your own heartaching experience and always willing to share your lessons learned and lend an angel shoulder to cry on.
Groovy, i remember when i quit everything when i found out i was pregnant with my daughter.  Time does seem to have a different speed when sober.  I think it because when you are using, you reach for the drink or drug and sit back or get busy with all this extra energy, me personally, i get myself into a frenzy trying to clean everything in site.  When sober, you know how to relax more, things just don't seem quite as important to get done now.  That's how i felt anyway.
There was always this certain feeling that i would get when not taking or drinking anything.  I can't describe it, but maybe it's just called 'living'.  It's a feeling of enjoyment that you get from doing something or thinking a certain way that seems to be gone now while using.  Things just don't feel or seem the same, it's like a much darker, closed world.  
My mind doesn't think and i don't feel like i used to.  Like i've said before, the sun doesn't shine as bright, the air doesn't smell as fresh, i don't notice the things that use to give me a simple feeling of happiness.  Used to be that the wind would blow a certain way and it would bring on a happy memory of something. These days everything is closed, i don't feel those feelings like i used to.  So i definately think addicts are living in a different dimension of some sorts if that makes sense.
Enjoy your 'time' now, that's the real speed of life!
:)
Lv Jenny

[angst]

i got hooked on the stadol ns back in '93.  i had never taken drugs for chronic pain until then.  i used the stadol ns until '97.  then when my m.d. found it was addictive, and he left me high and dry on wygesics.  i found the needle.  any opiate will cause all body functions to slow down hence the sensation of never having enough time to do everything.  also, many of us were chasing the dope man and lying about it.  it used alot of energy and time.  i do not miss that ****.  i am on methadone for the second time.  i do not have the motivation and creativity i had when i was using.  but i did not have time to do a lot with my creativity when i was using.  i also have a daughter.  she is eleven.  she's watched me kick four times.  she also found me in the kitchen, on the floor, almost dead when i attempted to end this damned cycle.  if it weren't for my  existentialist beliefs, i might find a way out of here.  stadol is just another opiate.  i found the rebound pain worse than the relief.  hope everyone else is fairing better.