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Suboxone Taper
This past Tuesday my Dr. started me on 12 MG of Sub that he wanted me to do for 2 weeks, and I think taper down gradually. My DOC was vicodin. Anyone that has gone the sub route, can you tell me if you were successful with it, and how exactly you tapered? From talking to a few of you I know that this is highly addictive (physically) b/c there's no high from it. Any suggestions and advice would be great. I go back to have a follow up appointment with my psychiatrist on Thursday.
I do agree with Lisa. And I do say all the time, that my experience was my own and know I did things the wrong way with sub. Lisa - lovemypillhead was looking for sub tapering advice on another post - I couldnt really help cause I did it the wrong way. Maybe you could help?
There ARE success stories out there Jdawn. Believe me. Not everyone suffers worst then they would have with their previous DOC. I did a 21 days sub treatment. And I started out the first day with 16mgs then by the 2nd day I dropped to 8mg. By the end of the first week, I was only taking 2mgs a day. When I stopped, I was down to .5 mgs, every 3 days. In the end, I only took it if I couldn't sleep. Then after that, I got through it. And it was NOT that bad. Please do not think that all everyone said to you will Definitely happen. Because everyone is different. And everyone's experience is circumstantial. So you don't know how long they were all on it and at what dose. There are members here who have had good experiences with it and have gotten through it. I am going on one year clean. So I got through it. My w.d was not that bad. But again, we are all different. If you need anything, just ask. My only advice, is don't let your dr talk you into high doses of sub. And do not take it longer then one month. If you can get by only taking it for a couple weeks do that. The shorter length of time you are on it and the lower the dose, the easier it will all be on you. Drs have no clue how strong it is and are very quick to push it on people. Most drs don't take insurane and only will accept cash, so that's why most want you to stay on it. The sub market is hugh and drs are getting certified left and right to prescribe it. So just be careful. Stay at a low, low dose. The least you can get by with. And only stay on it for a few weeks to a month max. I think a month may even be too long. You do what you have to do. Its your body and your addiction. We can only tell you our experiences. But I notice here there are alot of people who feel negatively about sub and in turn tend to scare people and I think that is wrong. I am telling you what I know to be factual about sub, and that's stick to a low dose for a short time. Other then that, all the things written above are based on personal experiences. Good luck and if you need anything, just ask..
Lisa
Lisa
trying2help -- wow that is a horrible story and very scary. My doctor was pretty knowledgeable about it, except he promised no withdrawal from it. He was wrong.
As someone who has gone cold turkey off of almost everything at one point or another (except methadone) I will say hands down suboxone withdrawal was the worst for me..6 to 7 days of oxy withdrawal, for me, was a walk in the park compared to 60 (yes SIXTY) days of suboxone withdrawal.. I say this as a real person with a real addiction and as someone who has used and LOVED suboxone while using it for over two years and has come off of it completely and suffered because of it. Everyone is different though and we all have different opinions and experiences. This is just my personal experience.
As someone who has gone cold turkey off of almost everything at one point or another (except methadone) I will say hands down suboxone withdrawal was the worst for me..6 to 7 days of oxy withdrawal, for me, was a walk in the park compared to 60 (yes SIXTY) days of suboxone withdrawal.. I say this as a real person with a real addiction and as someone who has used and LOVED suboxone while using it for over two years and has come off of it completely and suffered because of it. Everyone is different though and we all have different opinions and experiences. This is just my personal experience.
Wow....that is actually a horrible experience with suboxone.
In "real" life, I have NEVER talked to anyone who had a bad experience with it....only on MH.
How do u feel now?
In "real" life, I have NEVER talked to anyone who had a bad experience with it....only on MH.
How do u feel now?
I think the suboxone-bashing is mainly due to:
MANY doctors make false promises/assurances to patients regarding suboxone. I don't think they do this on purpose, I think they just don't know what they're talking about yet. I don't think they have enough experience yet.
I'm currently on suboxone and if it wasn't for this site, I probably would still be on my initial dose (20mg/day). My doctor (who runs 20+ clinics in my province) told me A LOT of stuff that turned out to be false. I mention the 20+ clinics only to emphasize the point that he had A LOT of experience with suboxone/methadone/AAROD/etc and a lot of the things that he told me were COMPLETELY FALSE. I've paid this doctor over $10,000 in the last 2 years (for 2 totally separate procedures) and for that money, I expect him to know something. I was taking a high dose of oxycontin (minimum 800mg per day) but he knew that before answering all my questions, so I don't think it's fair to use my dose as an excuse (which he does sometimes). Here's a small list of the stuff that pisses me off (and possibly pisses off other people with their doctors):
-my doctor told me that the procedure would be painless and easy (even at my dose). ******** - I WANTED TO JUMP OUT OF THE 4th STOREY WINDOW (and it wasn't until he gave me 4 needles of valium in the butt, that I relaxed and eventually passed out).
-my doctor gave me my INITIAL subox dose too early in the procedure. My body had not yet undergone MODERATE WITHDRAWL symptoms, but I guess my doctor had other stuff planned for his day because I 100% remember him asking me how I felt, me telling him that I was totally OK, and him saying that the w/d's were already underway and it was time to start. Obviously I said "OK.". Who am I to question a specialist?
******** - HE LATER ADMITTED THAT HE "POSSIBLY" GAVE ME MY DOSE TOO EARLY, AND THAT "POSSIBLY" CAUSED THE ENSUING HELL.
-before the procedure, my doctor said that he would have me off suboxone in 16 weeks. He said he would make the first reduction in dose 2 weeks after my procedure. Then he would keep reducing it every 2 weeks until it was gone. He said coming off subox was extremely easy and NOTHING compared to oxy. He said AT WORSE, I would feel A BIT tired.
******** - FROM READING NUMEROUS POSTS ON THIS SITE, ITS EASY TO SEE THAT GETTING OFF SUBOX IS JUST AS HARD, IF NOT HARDER THAN OXY.
-i had my procedure on Sept. 17-18 2008. I am currently in my last year of university, hence was worried about returning to school after the procedure. Would I be able to return to school immediately? How about studying? What about my concentration level? How about memorization? etc, etc. Well good ol' doc said there would be ZERO problems and he had NUMEROUS patients who went back to very stressful jobs THE NEXT DAY.
******** - I HAD A HORRIBLE TIME ADJUSTING TO MY NEW "LIFE". I wasn't able to sit through an entire class and take notes, until a month after the procedure. I wasn't able to put in "10 hour study day's" until approx 6-7 weeks after the procedure.
Do I feel as though he LIED to me... yes. I understand that doctors can't predict every side-effect or problem. But the troubling part for me personally, is that he usually tries to reverse the issue back to my heavy oxy dose. When I bring up how bad the procedure was, he brings up the fact that he had never dealt with someone who took 800mg of oxy a day (what about the 7 x 80mg guy???). When I bring up how hard it was to adjust to school life, he now tells me that after a procedure like I went through, my brain and subsequently my emotions are very raw, therefore making it seem like a hundred things are coming at me, when normally I'd be just fine.
He has answers for everything, but unfortunately his answers are NOT consistent with the ones he gave me BEFORE the procedure.
If someone were to suggest that he was in it purely for the money, how could I disagree??? Sure I'm probably being too harsh on him, but shouldn't he know EVERYTHING about a drug before advising a patient to start taking it?
MANY doctors make false promises/assurances to patients regarding suboxone. I don't think they do this on purpose, I think they just don't know what they're talking about yet. I don't think they have enough experience yet.
I'm currently on suboxone and if it wasn't for this site, I probably would still be on my initial dose (20mg/day). My doctor (who runs 20+ clinics in my province) told me A LOT of stuff that turned out to be false. I mention the 20+ clinics only to emphasize the point that he had A LOT of experience with suboxone/methadone/AAROD/etc and a lot of the things that he told me were COMPLETELY FALSE. I've paid this doctor over $10,000 in the last 2 years (for 2 totally separate procedures) and for that money, I expect him to know something. I was taking a high dose of oxycontin (minimum 800mg per day) but he knew that before answering all my questions, so I don't think it's fair to use my dose as an excuse (which he does sometimes). Here's a small list of the stuff that pisses me off (and possibly pisses off other people with their doctors):
-my doctor told me that the procedure would be painless and easy (even at my dose). ******** - I WANTED TO JUMP OUT OF THE 4th STOREY WINDOW (and it wasn't until he gave me 4 needles of valium in the butt, that I relaxed and eventually passed out).
-my doctor gave me my INITIAL subox dose too early in the procedure. My body had not yet undergone MODERATE WITHDRAWL symptoms, but I guess my doctor had other stuff planned for his day because I 100% remember him asking me how I felt, me telling him that I was totally OK, and him saying that the w/d's were already underway and it was time to start. Obviously I said "OK.". Who am I to question a specialist?
******** - HE LATER ADMITTED THAT HE "POSSIBLY" GAVE ME MY DOSE TOO EARLY, AND THAT "POSSIBLY" CAUSED THE ENSUING HELL.
-before the procedure, my doctor said that he would have me off suboxone in 16 weeks. He said he would make the first reduction in dose 2 weeks after my procedure. Then he would keep reducing it every 2 weeks until it was gone. He said coming off subox was extremely easy and NOTHING compared to oxy. He said AT WORSE, I would feel A BIT tired.
******** - FROM READING NUMEROUS POSTS ON THIS SITE, ITS EASY TO SEE THAT GETTING OFF SUBOX IS JUST AS HARD, IF NOT HARDER THAN OXY.
-i had my procedure on Sept. 17-18 2008. I am currently in my last year of university, hence was worried about returning to school after the procedure. Would I be able to return to school immediately? How about studying? What about my concentration level? How about memorization? etc, etc. Well good ol' doc said there would be ZERO problems and he had NUMEROUS patients who went back to very stressful jobs THE NEXT DAY.
******** - I HAD A HORRIBLE TIME ADJUSTING TO MY NEW "LIFE". I wasn't able to sit through an entire class and take notes, until a month after the procedure. I wasn't able to put in "10 hour study day's" until approx 6-7 weeks after the procedure.
Do I feel as though he LIED to me... yes. I understand that doctors can't predict every side-effect or problem. But the troubling part for me personally, is that he usually tries to reverse the issue back to my heavy oxy dose. When I bring up how bad the procedure was, he brings up the fact that he had never dealt with someone who took 800mg of oxy a day (what about the 7 x 80mg guy???). When I bring up how hard it was to adjust to school life, he now tells me that after a procedure like I went through, my brain and subsequently my emotions are very raw, therefore making it seem like a hundred things are coming at me, when normally I'd be just fine.
He has answers for everything, but unfortunately his answers are NOT consistent with the ones he gave me BEFORE the procedure.
If someone were to suggest that he was in it purely for the money, how could I disagree??? Sure I'm probably being too harsh on him, but shouldn't he know EVERYTHING about a drug before advising a patient to start taking it?
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