new here, anyone here on methadone maintaince?

[drugzalots]

hi all, is anyone here on methadone for getting off drugs?  i had tried everything to get off pills only to fail and fail again.  then i went to methadone and have been on it for almost 2 years.  i couldn't see my life any other way at this point and time.  i do have chronic pain issues, but the methadone does nothing for my pain.  some people do use methadone for chronic pain.  maybe it's all those years of abusing pain pills, i don't know.  i really need to get to a dr. for my pain issues.  funny how when i was getting my pain pills from drs. i couldn't wait to get to the dr. but now...i could care less about going.  even tho i'm in pain and all i'm not sapose to take any narcs coz of the meth, so why go.  but my back has gotten so bad that i can't walk without a walker, and i hate it.  i have no insurance so i feel bad taking any money out for me.  i already pay $168. a month for my meth.  thats a far cry from the $100. a day habit i had before.  but still, i guess i have alot of guilt there with the money thing.  i put my family threw hell, and then some.  but they stuck by my side, and they are behind me 100%, and they are proud of me.  i haven't cheated on this meth.  but, sometimes i want to.  some times i'll just break down and cry like a baby.  weird!  well, i'm going on and on here, just want to know if anyone out there can relate?  thanks!  p.s. sorry about spelling mistakes, but i can't spell for sh**!!

[sharonver]

Welcome to the forum...

There are a few of us on MMT and a few that have detoxed from it. I have been on for 15 years and I am now detoxing from it.
Started the detox about 1 year ago I'm doing it very slowly, I was on 65mg now down to 4mg. I also have chronic pain (arthritis) the methadone did help me while I was on a higher dose. Of course now that I am down so low it isn't helping it anymore.  So when I am through with this detox I will have to look for another type of med to help with the arthritis issue.  Looking forward to talking to you...

Sharon

[longtimegone]

I have been on methadone maint. for many years myself so I can relate to that part. What I can't really relate to is the chronic pain, I can tell ya that even if ya try to get "relief" from something else it ain't gonna be easy. Unless you are on some really low maint. dose of methadone which I doubt if you have been on the program for two years, your tolerance to opiates is through the roof. I've been drinking between 110 - 120mg. of meth a day for at least ten years and whenever I had surgery it was a big problem controling pain and even the anestesia was a ***** to get right, ( i'm sure i spelled that wrong). I have relapsed lots of times while on meth and for the most part it is all for nothing. I couldn't tell the difference after I shot dope or ate oxy's... because of my tolerance. The bad part is I really don't know what to tell ya about how to get relief from your pain if you are on a high dose of meth. There are a few people on my clinic that have real pain issues also but they all go to a pain managment clinic besides going to the meth clinic. I'm sure others on here will have some good advise for ya though!! I just wanted to let ya know there are other people on methadone maint. If I can help ya with any questions or if ya just wanna bullshit I'd be glad to but there are plenty of people on here that will have better advise. Good luck......Jim

[Thomas03]

Post your question to Mr. Michael. He comes around most days. He can tell you anything you want to know about MMT and chronic pain.

Thomas

[Linco]

Hi everyone...I have been watching these boards for several months and the posts have helped me enormously.  I am an older woman who has fought the opiate battle for many years.  My problem now is that I am stuck at about 4 1/2 hydros (7.5) per day.  The worst for me is the nights and mornings when I feel as if my insides want to come out.  Also I have very disturbing dreams.  For the first time, I'm considering contacting a methadone clinic in my area.  My questions are (1) does my daily usage warrant methadone maintenance? and (2) could my pain management Dr. (arthritis) prescribe meth. for pain?  Also, I could get Darvocet which I understand is related to meth.  Any suggestions would be really appreciated.  My life now is filled with depression and guilt.  Thanks for any input.
Linda

[Thomas03]

Hi, linco, welcome to the forum. I'm sorry you're feeling so poorly. Arthritus is an awful condition.

As far as I know, your doctor could prescribe methadone for pain. But my question is, are you saying that you believe your depression and disturbing dreams are caused by the Vicodin, from inadequate pain management, or both? There are time-release pain drugs such as MS-Contin (morphine, OxyContin (oxycodone) and Duragesic (fentenyl patch) that would certainly provide more consistent relief than Vicodin. If the Vicodin itself is causing your depression, I think switching to another narcotic pain killer would not solve the problem.

You should know that a methdone clinic will require you to show up every single day for one dose of methadone. According to Mr Michael, methadone controls pain for about 8 hrs or so, leaving you hurting all night until it's time to go to the clinic again. Also with your arthritus, it might be a challenge to attend the clinic every single day. Once dependent on methadone, you would be facing an extremely unpleasant detox/withdrawal if you should be taken off of the drug.

Have you talked to your doctor about this? Ask him about MS-Contin, OxyContin and the Duragesic patch before you ask for methadone. That's my opinion, anyway.

Now that you're here, stay in touch!

Thomas

[Linco]

Thanks Thomas for your insight.  I have another appt. on the 20th and will talk to my Dr.  In answer to your other questions, I have to think about it but I think my discomfort is the Vicodin wearing off in the middle  of the night (withdrawal) rather than the pain.  It's just that my children don't want me taking any kind of opiate which causes me plenty of guilt.  When they're visiting I have to hide everything.  Oh well, enough whining....
It's nice to hear from caring and understanding people like yourself.     Linda

[blondie129]

Sorry to break the thread here, me and my husband have been reading here for over a year now and it is time for us to post but I am not sure how to start a new post, me and my hubby both are addicted to pain meds, hubby worse than me, I am at this time down to 1 7.5 vicodin per day, I am out so tomorrow will be the first day for me without any, I don't see to much of a problem there, as today before I took one I didn't really feel bad, not sure why I even took it, guess just the habit. Now for my hubby, for about 5 years he has taken lortab, vicodin, and oxycontin, he was up to the about 35-10mg hydro per day, doing whatever he could, and I do mean whatever he could to get them, Wednesday he finealy went to the hosp Er for help, to make a very long story short after about 9 hours in the er, about 6 different people telling us that they did not do drug detox and a few telling us that they did, the er dr could not admit him, and had to find a dr that would. He called about 4 different drs. trying to find one that would, finally found 1 dr in our town that would do the detox, they said that was his speciality, he had been doing it for 20 years, they admitted him he was not in detox yet as he took 4 pills in the er before they took him to a room. After they got him settled in a room they started with atavan shots every 2 hours, we asked for something different than atavan because 3 years ago our 14 yr old daughter died from lymphoma, they had given her atavan, and she totally lost her mind on it, but they talked him into trying, about 7 hours later when the detox really set in they called the dr and had the atavan changed to iv atavan along with 40mg valume(not spelled right) every 2 hours, by the next AM things were really bad so the dr then changed again adding phenebarbitol to the plan every 2 hours on that, well needless to say that by that time hubby was totally out of it and left the hosp against medical advice this was Thurs evening, I did not want to bring him home, for fear that he would go looking for more pills even though at that time, he was totally confused and did not know what he was doing, so I took him to his mothers 2 hours away he spent the night with horrible muscle spams, crawling skin and the next AM did not remember anything after the first shot of atavan, wanting desperatly to go back to the hosp, I called the addiction specialist (yea right, I would not let him treat my dog now) and he would not take him back. We called 3 other drs. including one that was giving him the pills regulary for 4 years none would touch him. Then took him to my dr that was giving me 60 20 mg oxycontin per month for the past 4 years, and pleaded for him to put him in the hosp. and he did, with 10 mg valume 4 times per day thru the night the detox got bad again so they added a drug, 10 mg oxycondone IR every 4 hours ( great 48 hours with nothing and they give him more, he took some the rest he did not take and put in my purse, well today when the dr came to see him told him that he was nuts (anybody taking that many pain pill would have to be was what the dr said) pissed off hubby again and again left the hosp ama. We came home and now finally after 4 days of no sleep he is asleep now, his emotions are up and down from very high to very very low. I do not know at this point what to do to help him, I am very on edge after 4 days with no sleep also, I have a script for 60 .5mg klonpin, I think that the worst part is of the physical detox is over the muscle spasms are almost gone, still a few, the nurse that was taking care of him said he was the worst he had ever seen, the crawly skin has subsided somewhat, but the up and down emotion, and no sleep, what can I do to help him we have to get thru this, he keeps saying that he wants to be done but is not strong enough to do it that he knows he will be right back on them. Sorry to break the thread and that this is so long but I need help ,please!!!

         Thank you

[oxic]

Hey, Sorry to read you guys are going thru such a ******* nightmare!!!
I'm sure if you've been reading here for a year, you've seen Thomas' detox recipe, which includes a benzo(preferably Valium or Klonipin) for the first several days(which he's in the midst of).....so i would get the Klonipin filled.

Is there any chance you can get CLONIDINE, a blood pressure medication, and coincidentally withdrawal masking agent(so to speak). They use it routinely at our detox facility.  Of course making sure your husbands' BP doesn't bottom out!!!, with its use.


I'll copy and paste the Recipe anyways, as there are some good pointers throughout;

Thomas Detox Recipe

PLEASE NOTE: I am not a doctor, simply a long-time Rx opiate junkie who has had many opportunities to develop a way to detox. This is a recipe for at-home self-detox from opiates based on my experience as well as that of many other addicts. It is not intended as professional medical advice. It is always wise to make sure none of the recipe ingredients or procedures conflict with medications you may be taking. Likewise, if you have any medical condition, disease, allergy or any other health issue, consult your doctor before using the recipe. Thanks, Thomas

This recipe is designed for cold turkey opiate detox. It assumes that you can get about 5 to 7 days away from your job or household responsibilities during which you can sleep, veg and act as miserable as you feel. Opiate WD mimics the symptoms of the common flu, so, if you need a smokescreen, hide behind a bad case of the flu.

If you can't take time off to detox, I recommend you follow a taper regimen using your drug of choice or suitable alternate -- the slower the taper, the better.

For the Recipe, You'll need:

1. Valium (or another benzodiazepine such as Klonopin, Librium, Ativan or Xanax). Of these, Valium and Klonopin are best suited for tapering since they come in tablet form. Librium is also an excellent detox benzo, but comes in capsules, making it hard to taper the dose. Ativan or Xanax should only be used if you can't get one of the others.

2. Imodium (immodium) (over the counter, any drug or grocery store).

3. L-Tyrosine (500 mg caps) from the health food store.

4. Strong wide-spectrum mineral supplement with at least 100% RDA of Zinc, Phosphorus, Copper and Magnesium.

5. Vitamin B6 caps.

6. Access to hot baths or a Jacuzzi (or hot showers if that's all that's available).

How to use the recipe:

Begin your detox with regular doses of Valium (or alternate benzo). Start with a dose high enough to produce sleep. Before you use any benzo, make sure you're aware of how often it can be safely taken. Different benzos have different dosing schedules. Taper your Valium dosage down after each day. The goal is to get through day 4, after which the worst WD symptoms will subside. You shouldn't need the Valium after day 4 or 5.

During detox, hit the hot bath or Jacuzzi as often as you need to for muscle aches. Don't underestimate the effectiveness of hot soaks. Spend the entire time, if necessary, in a hot bath. This simple method will alleviate what is for many the worst opiate WD symptom.

Use the Imodium (immodium) aggressively to stop the runs. Take as much as you need, as often as you need it. Don't take it, however, if you don't need it.

At the end of the fourth day, you should be waking up from the Valium and experiencing the beginnings of the opiate WD malaise. Upon rising (empty stomach), take the L-Tyrosine. Try 2000 mgs, and scale up or down, depending on how you feel. You can take up to 4,000 mgs. Take the L-Tyrosine with B6 to help absorption. Wait about one hour before eating breakfast. The L-Tyrosine will give you a surge of physical and mental energy that will help counteract the malaise. You may continue to take it each morning for as long as it helps. If you find it gives you the "coffee jitters," consider lowering the dosage or discontinuing it altogether. Occasionally, L-Tyrosine can cause the runs. Unlike the runs from opiate WD, however, this effect of L-Tyrosine is mild and normally does not return after the first hour. Lowering the dosage may help.

With breakfast, take the mineral supplement.

As soon as you can force yourself to, get some mild exercise such as walking, cycling, swimming, etc. This will be hard at first, but will make you feel considerably better.

PLEASE NOTE: If you have any medical complications, first check with your doctor before detoxing to verify that this regimen is safe for you.


I wish there was more i could do for you and your husband...... coming off that doseage has to be a mother ******; just keep him sedated(But not unconscious), and in a hot bath, and perhaps some deep muscle massages.

Hang in there guys!!
(and keep us updated)

percs

[blondie129]

Hi,

  I am the hubby and just read my wifes post, you are right it is a mother ****** and then some!!!  Thank you for replying!

                  TC

[oxic]

Hey Friend.....so is there any chance of getting a hold of some Clonidine??

You know, many people before you have successfully kicked habits of your calibre AND BIGGER; so you can do it too(like in the order of 800+ mgs of oxycontin with a substantial benzo appetite to top it off).

Tell us more.... did you cold turkey?  When was your last hydro/ oxy. ?

Make sure you don't get dehydrated either.

percs

ps....i came off a 20+/day perc habit, of many years; and although i felt like i was going to die, it passed and have been off since Aug. 19th/02

[blondie129]

Cold turkey my friend....well my last dose was Wed. at about 9:30 as they were getting ready to take me to my room after the 9 hour er wait...but after I left the hosp out of my mind Thurs against medical advice (not knowing what the **** I was doing), I called the original Dr to see if he would readmit me on Friday but he was done with me and I found a different Dr to admit me about 6pm on Friday nite (still had not taken any), about 11pm friday nite the new dr decieded that he wanted me to come off slowly taking 2-5mg oxy IR every 4 hours, so since last nite at 11pm I have had about 50mg in the hospital before the dr came in and told me I was nuts and pissed me off and left ama again, as for the clindine I still have the patch on from today, I am not sure how long they last but I doubt that I will be able to get more. How long was it for you before the real bad part is over, the muscle spams have subsided, and the crawling skin also, the diarrea (diarrhea) is pretty much gone, no stomach pain, but man, I just do not feel right at all.....just ****** up feeling!! Although it does seem to help to smoke a little pot.

         Keep in touch and good luck on your journey
                                    TC

[oxic]

Sorry, didn't realize you had a catapres (clonidine patch) on....Anyways, you are definately thru the nastiest physical w/d's, and now as you said "Just don't feel right".  I remember that feeling VERY well. ******* no-mans land; where your body/brain is wondering why hasn't the next dose of synthetic pain killers been sent yet, and since that has been the pattern for so long, your body just doesn't want to start "firing" again, by producing its' own dopamine/natural pain killers.

This is where the L-Tyrosine/ B-6 comes into play.  Pick it up(or have your wife get it from the health food store), believe me, i was skeptical about anything natural working. IT DOES.
If you look at L-Tyrosine(an amino acid), it is very closely related to dopamines'molecular structure, and stimulates adrenaline production.  It helped me(as well as many others---including my mother in law who recently detoxed from coke, vikes, xanax and booze) crawl out of the hole.
I would say i started to feel human again(BELIEVE ME, I WONDERED IF I WOULD EVER FEEL NORMAL AGAIN) around 7-10 days; still was lethargic and couldn't get more than 2-3 hours of sleep/night, but at least out of that no-mans land.  By three weeks, things dramatically improved.
If there is anything I/we can do for you(and your wife), please ask.

percs

[mrmichael67]

Please, email me at ***@****.  It would be a lot easier to address different things.  I only come here every now and then.

[pepsi4]

I hate to interrupt this thread, but I wasn't allowed to post a new one.  In case anyone is interested, I found a site where you can download a narcotic converter (you can use it for free for 14 days).  It's at  http://www.globalrph.com/narcotic_converter.htm  It may be helpful to those trying to taper (as I have with some success).  I have NOT had a chance to really check out the program, so I do NOT know if it is accurate.  In any case, I just decided to go cold turkey -- been over 24 hours since I've had anything.  Just got back from a long walk and feel fine physically.  I fear this may be the calm before the storm, but I'm going to give it a shot!  Peace to all....

[Thomas03]

let me know when you find a site where you can download real opiates! Enough of these charts. Let's have the real thing!

Thomas

[Jerri2]

Thomas your a riot!!Wouldnt that be something though just post what ya want and out it pops!!!          Jerri

[mrmichael67]

It works fine.  I have had it as a favorite for a long time and it still works.  The one I use is right on the web page.  It is http://www.globalrph.com/narcoticonv.htm.  No downloading.

[mrmichael67]

It is really handy when working with patches.  I showed it to my pain doc at the time and he loves it.

[Benz Doctor]

Hi everyone,
I haven't seen the "Thomas receipe" advised for methadone before only other opiates. Does it work as well for methadone?  What sort of meth dosage should you be down to before you start? Also some people recommend switching from oxys to lortab before tapering because of the long lasting nature of the oxys. Is there something you can switch from the meth to?  
Thanks in advance, BD

[mrmichael67]

The only real thing to switch to from methadone is buprenorphine.  You should have your dose of methadone lowered to AT LEAST 30mg.  I have heard 60mg, but I believe that to be playing with fire.  I would go down as low as I could before switching over....under 30mg.  I am currently on methadone maintenance for pain management and wd management.

[msunderstood]

Hey all I am new here, I ve been looking for a place to talk with others about addiction, detox, opiates, methadone, etc.  
I used to take about 40-50 10mg hydros a day, tried rehab, failed, the only thing rehab was good for was the detox.  you can be detoxed and not suffer.  If anyone tries cold turkey, Ive done it several times, and i wud rather have another baby!! (not really!)  I went into a methadone treatment prgm to stop craving opiates.l  It works, alot of us can stay on methadone for years and years, its a synthetic opiate, and i know many people who are given methadone for chronic pain, it did stop the pain.  The problem with it for me, is I wasnt feeling well, I did not like how I felt on it, I got up to about 65mgs.  I gained 30 lbs. I was miserable.  The dr at the clinic told me if I went on a slow detox i wudnt feel bad.  Well for months i went down 2.5mgs a week.  did fine until i got to 25mgs.  The sweats kick in. The muscle spasms come and go.  I am definitely not experiencing any severe withdrawals, but I have increased my detox to 5mg a week bec i THINK ALL IT IS DOING IS PROLONGING THE AGONY!! I am cranky, I dont sleep very well, I dont want to leave my house, but I keep at it!!  I finally realized I do not want to be a slave to drugs. I am now down to15 mgs, I wud love to find out what will happen to me when I get to zero.  I have been doing this with nothing but motrin.  Does anyone think I can make it the rest of the way without the abv mentioned meds?  Since I reducced off slowly will the withdrawal symptoms stay as they are when I get to zero or wiil they get worse.  I posted this here, so those going thru oxy detox understand that methadone is just as addicting. It is great to use for those who could not manage living a productive life with the pain meds they were taking.You are in a controlled situation.  You must find out all the info and details of any med you start taking, dont make the same mistake I did, by trusting my shrink of 4 yrs, obviously I was trusting the wrong dr.  Find out the answers to all yr concerns and questions b4 u do any of these things. This is not factual but just my personal account of what I think, feel and have been thru,  Best to all.Msunderstood

[ineedhelp2]

hey! i use methodone when i have nothing else or when i think i am ready to fight the addiction of my pain pill problem.i really like the durg but i find my self being more addicted th\o that.i have heard that it is actually a harder addiction to fight than pain pills.also you can have bone deteriation from methadone.i have found this forum my looking for a way to get more pain medicene without a script and god is with me because he led me to you guys.i may not have answered your question , but i know that i do like the methodone.i am currently buying from the streets at 20-25 $$$ a pill i am willing to do what ever it takes to make me happy and feeling good.i want so bad to be back to my normal self full time mom wife and christian i was excersising every day also .now all i worry about is how many pills i have left and when i can take my next one .it is a constant battle for me.it is ruining my marriage and my life.i saw and read about the thomas  recipie?? is that the name? i am willing to try any thing to fight this devil and feel better whike going through withdrawls.any one reading this please email me some info or respond to my recent post under "ineedhelp2"
my email is ***@**** name is laura.its good toi now that i am not alone.may god be with us allin our own war!!!! love peace & happiness to you all. laura...:( i need help too:(

[wantoffmeth]

Hi everyone.  I am also on MMT and am on a very high dosage.  I have only come down 15mg and have a LONG way to go. What I am going to try to do is at least 10mg a week until I begin to feel the least bit uncomfortable, and then hang on that does for awhile, and so forth.  I also had the question regarding Thomas's recipe for detoxing.  Because, I've read from many people that even at 2mg, they plan to sta on that for a couple of weeks and then it's home detox time.  I wonder at this point how long it will take to feel physically somewhat comfortable, and if this recipe used for detoxing from opiates would work with methadone detox.  That's the part I am fearing the most, as I am sure everyone is that plans to come off this worst of all detoxing drugs.  Nobody at the clinic told me this, or anything else that would otherwise sway me to stay the hell away from them, which I should have.  (should have, would have, blah blah).  Seems that has been the language for my life.  I've been on Meth for almost 1 year, so I want to try to get off this **** before much more time goes by.  As I mentioned in another thread, if I had the money, I'd detox under anesthesia,unless someone had some major accurate advice after researching, swaying me otherwise, since I did about a million hours of research (ofcourse an exaggeration).  Any information regarding my comment would be greatly appreciated.  It's just nice to know when you feel you're all alone with this **** running through your head, that you're NOT.  Thanks everyone.


Kat

[sharonver]

Hi all...

I am detoxing from meth- was on for more than 15 years, I am down to 4 millagrams! (IMO) tapering or slow detoxing is not prolonging the agony, because if you do it slowly it won't be as bad as you think.  Better than C.T. for me!! Once I got down to 30 mg. I started decreasing 1 millagram every other week I was fine until I got to 6 millagrams then it started to get uncomfortable, but when you hit a wall like that you can either go up 1 or 2mg. or like I did stay at that dose until you adjust. It took me a few weeks to adjust to it then I was ok.  The next millagram decrease -5mg was ok. Last week I went to 4mg. - uncomfortatable again, will wait another week or 2 then it will be down to 3!!  The detox only goes to 2mg. (liquid)If anyone has any ques. or wants anymore info email me.

Good Luck,
Sharon

[wantoffmeth]

Hi!  I misplaced your e-mail address.  Sorry.  If you get a chance maybe you could send it again?  Anyway, do you know how, when you are done with 2 mg (I don't even know you, and I am so proud of the determination you have getting off - it's amazing, you must be very strong) to continue?  Has anyone advised you of what to do to stay the most comfortable and what will happen physically and how long to expect whatever it is that you and I (I'll be behind you a long way, but I hope to do what you have done) have to expect? Not to repetetive!!!  I'm just scared, that's all.  And I guess when you haven't been through something, the unknown scares you more than anything.  Not knowing what to expect, and being scared that you won't be able to do that last, hardest and most crucial step.  And how long will it take to get back "somewhat" to ourselves?  At least so we can function somewhat normally?  I wish I had some answers.  Everybody hang in there.  I guess noboby said................ that life would be easy. Ain't that true.

[sharonver]

Kat,

I will be more than happy to help in any way that I can.  I can share with you my experiences, my  advise, and my support.  I find that one of the most crucial aspects of your detox is motivation, if you feel that you are not quite ready to do it then wait until you are more confident. I tried once before without the motivation and for the wrong reasons, this time is different and much more successful, your frame of mind plays an important part in your recovery. Feel free to email me anytime.
***@****

Sharon

[Benz Doctor]

I know that while your on MMT your tolerance to other opiates is very high. If you decided to go cold turkey from methadone, how long before a dose (amount?) of hydrocodone would help with the withdrawals?? Would it be better to get under 30mg. of methadone before switching?   Thanks BD

[sharonver]

In my opinion, if you are detoxing slowly you probably won't need them until you get to the single digits dose.  Thats just from my own exerience.  Once you get to those low doses though it may be able to help take some of the edge off the withdrawals.

Sharon  (just remember, the slower the better)

[drugzalots]

hello, to the people on mmt, do you have to go to your clinic everyday to get your dose?  because where i live we can get on an honor thing.  like i go every monday and get my weeks worth.  i have talked to a few people at the clinic that have said this place is great cause of that, plus no lines.  plus they let you go as high a dose as you need to be to stop the withdrawls.  now once you get to 100mg you have to have this certain blood test that sees how you are motabilizing the methadone and how much you have in you 24hrs after you dose.  that's so people can't lie and say "i need more".  cause lord knows we would!  i went up to 165mg and i had to have 3 of those blood test.  i still felt i could of gone up higher.  it never did hold me the whole 24hrs.  but my last test was inconclusive.  so i just figured i'd get used to it.  anyway this may 18, will be two years on this and i will be able to get my methadone once every two weeks.  that will really be great.  i have heard of people saying that mmt sucked cause of having to go to the clinic everyday and not having a normal life cause of it.  in the begining i had to go every day, but to me it was so worth it.  way better then going threw withdrawls every few days cause i was always running out of pills.   i would never go back to that life.  but i also can not picture my life off of methadone.  sharon you have been on it for 15yrs.  that's what i want.  cause you figure when you have done drugs as long as i have i can not see me living sober.  i really don't think i'd know how.  and even with 2yrs of counsling i don't know why i let myself get hooked on drugs.  or why drugs had to be in my life at all.  i was 13 when i found my life long lover drugs, of all kinds, and i went overboard on them all.  it's a wonder i'm still around.  why is it that some people want and need drugs in there lives and others don't?  it has to be some kind of tic we have that makes us this way, ya think?  well this has turned into a book, sorry.  had to vent.  thanks, angela

[drugzalots]

hello, to the people on mmt, do you have to go to your clinic everyday to get your dose?  because where i live we can get on an honor thing.  like i go every monday and get my weeks worth.  i have talked to a few people at the clinic that have said this place is great cause of that, plus no lines.  plus they let you go as high a dose as you need to be to stop the withdrawls.  now once you get to 100mg you have to have this certain blood test that sees how you are motabilizing the methadone and how much you have in you 24hrs after you dose.  that's so people can't lie and say "i need more".  cause lord knows we would!  i went up to 165mg and i had to have 3 of those blood test.  i still felt i could of gone up higher.  it never did hold me the whole 24hrs.  but my last test was inconclusive.  so i just figured i'd get used to it.  anyway this may 18, will be two years on this and i will be able to get my methadone once every two weeks.  that will really be great.  i have heard of people saying that mmt sucked cause of having to go to the clinic everyday and not having a normal life cause of it.  in the begining i had to go every day, but to me it was so worth it.  way better then going threw withdrawls every few days cause i was always running out of pills.   i would never go back to that life.  but i also can not picture my life off of methadone.  sharon you have been on it for 15yrs.  that's what i want.  cause you figure when you have done drugs as long as i have i can not see me living sober.  i really don't think i'd know how.  and even with 2yrs of counsling i don't know why i let myself get hooked on drugs.  or why drugs had to be in my life at all.  i was 13 when i found my life long lover drugs, of all kinds, and i went overboard on them all.  it's a wonder i'm still around.  why is it that some people want and need drugs in there lives and others don't?  it has to be some kind of tic we have that makes us this way, ya think?  well this has turned into a book, sorry.  had to vent.  thanks, angela

[sharonver]

At my clinic we can go once a week, but as of now thats about it. And they do give out vacation bottles for up to 2 weeks. But I could not see staying on this med for my whole life! 15 years was way long enough. I can't imagine that it would be that healthy to stay on too long.  The highest dose I was on was 65 mg. And the last few years only 30mg.  That was plenty to hold me.  Some people do have a bigger habits and need more to hold them.  I guess I was a light-weight.  

Sharon

[lost groove]

in my experience, i would not recomend quiting methadone c/t at all. i've read here that other people did it and i am truely amazed. i did it but was not a success story. mentaly, i still feel a bit left of center..granted, my doctor didn't have a clue what he was prescribing. he gave me an incredible ammount in just six months then left the building..for those who are going for it anyway, take a good ammount of time off work and keep the bath ready at your disposal. that was the only relief i could find, a hot bath, and after a few minuts in there, i was crawling out of my skin! i had gone through w/d from other opiats but, nothing prepared me for that hell. if you are trying to quit, if you get take home, maybe stash some of it.i thought i was o.k. after 72 hours but, it just hadn't hit me yet. and when it did, pure hell! sure don't mean to sound glum about this but it just messed me up so bad. guess i'm still biter..sorry.
good luck and all the best to you all.
l.g.

[drugzalots]

hello sharon, yeah right now at this point and time in my life i don't even want off the mmt.  first of all i haven't even begone to get to the root of my drug problems.  why i feel i need the drugs to make it in my daily life and all.  i do thank god for methadone cause it stopped that ****** up life i did have before ya know the looking for drugs so i can be normal today ****.  and i could never find enough.  i could down 60 pills in 24hrs.  so needless to say i went threw the money.  and yes we lost everything because of me.  that's hard to live with.  but anyway, i'm happy your getting off the mmt.  and i will have to do it very slowly also....just not now...and probly not next year either.  i hope that my clinic don't make me get off before i feel i'm ready, ya know.  not really sure how all this works in the long run.  but i feel if i'm pushed to get off to soon i'll go back to the bad stuff.  and i'm sure the methadone isn't all that great to be putting in our bodies, but neither is all that tylenol i was using.  or the rush to my old heart when i shot up drugs.  sharon i was going to ask you can you feel the meth when you only take that small amount?  the 4mgs?  take care, angela

[sharonver]

angela,

I doubt very much that the clinic will push you to get off the meth sooner than you want to!!  If anything they try to keep you on longer.  As for feeling the 4mg, not really, it still keeps me from getting too sick though.

Sharon

[Benz Doctor]

Sharonover,
It seems you have it licked, congrats!! I hope to be in your shoes in the not to distant future. Do you know if the "Thomas reciepe" will work for Methadone? Thanks, BD

[percsnomas]

..............sorry to cut in on your question.
Firstly, hello!!
Yes the recipe can be used for meth.!!

Two friends of mine from here(bmac and Methman) used it when they got off meth., and swore by it.

Take Care

[Benz Doctor]

Hey no problem, Thanks for your quick response. I have seen this question asked several times but not responded to. Do you know what doses they were on when they implemented the "recipe"? Any info would be great!
Thanks in advance, BD

[percsnomas]

I don't remember(it was several months ago), but i have emailed Methman, to see if he can advise you.  Might take a lit'l bit.

Hang in There!!

[percsnomas]

I found a post from Methman back in November, so i copied and pasted it for you in the interim.  Hope something in it helps my friend!!!


C38 MethMan
(15-Nov-02)  DGirl Hey... Been there... actually am there. I've only stopped my methadone habit 12 days now. There are far wiser folk than I here that will JUMP to help you just like they did me.

Email is cool and all, but to be honest, please try the forum first. It's also a pretty good idea to post at the top, even if the subject is not Methadone. That's where most of the posting seems to be going on. No one ever says anything about off topic especially when they can (and do) help. Personally, my WD are still happening to me, but because of this forum, I've found an ENORMOUS amount of hope. Hope for me was something very far away for a few days and these people in this forum pulled me through. You're probably skeptical as I was about this forum. I've only been here about 10 days and they've all made me feel like family. Just like one of the good ones here said to me, you are NOT alone. And if you keep coming here, you won't EVER be.
Take a look up higher in the threads. I think I posted my daily regiment and how I felt coming off methadone under "How long will it last." If it isn't there, then let me know and I will be happy to email it to you.
Additionally, I will be happy to walk with you through each day if you need it. I am not a walking book on how it all works, just an addict in the same situation you are. But, I do have 12 days so far and will happily share what I felt each day if it helps you. For me, not knowing what to expect was a big one. But several people here responded to me and let me know just what to expect which made a big difference for me. If I too can help, I will.
To maybe be able to help you in some small way would make me feel good too. Like I said, I've only got Day 12 done and tomorrow is Day 13. After that, day 14. After the initial hammering you take coming off Methadone, the higher I seem to get. Life is starting to kick in for me after being in a damn methadone clinic for 10 years.
One thing I am curious about. You said the Methadone Clinic was putting you on a 30 day detox? Man, that is the FIRST time I have ever heard of a methadone clinic wanting to drop a customer. Whatever their motives are, GO FOR IT.
If I were you, the first thing I would do is see a Doc when the taper starts. (Not the Methadone "Doctor" that admitted you in to the wonderful Program. You know.. they guy with all the bucks?) A doctor that knows about addiction would be best. He or She will more than likely stick you on Clonidine which helps and something to help you sleep. The taper is not bad. At least it wasn't for me until I got below 5mg a day. Then, they went down 1mg per day. I did cool until about 3 mgs, then I started feeling kind of tired and weak. 2mg felt the same. So did the 1mg. At that point, I made an err in judgement and thought, "Hell, 1mg. Big deal. I can handle this." My reasoning was that 1mg was not **** and I didn't feel horrible. But once there is no Meth for the brain to play with, withdrawals become pretty tough for about the first 3 to 4 days.
Start NOW on a multi-vitamin, B Complex on top of it, 1000mg of Vitamin C, an anti-oxidant and 3 hot showers a day. This is part of the "Thomas Recipe" that was provided to me. Also, bananas work for leg cramps. When you need to drink anything, drink Gatorade to replace your electrolytes that you'll be crapping out. Plus no matter how bad you feel, get up and MOVE. Move around. Walk in circles if you have to. The first couple days, it's all you can do to get up. But if you keep moving it helps get your mind off it, plus it helps your brain start healing.
Whatever you do, if you are at a point where you want to stop, when the WD's come from methadone, DO NOT GO BACK TO H. Just hang strong and visit here a LOT. People here will pick you up and carry you past the dark spots. It worked for me as well as many others.
Hang tough girl... if I can do it, you can too.

God Bless,
Mike

[MethMan]

Hey Bud..
Oxic asked me to respond to you regarding your desire to rid yourself of Methadone and when to start the Thomas Recipe.
My meth dose was 60 for years. When I started tapering, I really didn't do as bad as I thought I would.  Even at levels under 10mgs, I felt fatigued and weak, but nothing that really was very dibilitating.  Under 5mgs, I went 1mg per day down to zero.  The first day of not having ANY methadone, I didn't feel too bad, just a bit roughed up.  That night is when the full detox got rough.  No sleep, restless leg thing going on, aches, etc.
About three days of this hell, I found this place and the Thomas recipe.  The hardest part of starting it was getting up the strength to get to the store to get the stuff.  Once I started it, I began to feel better within about 48 hours.  Not great mind you, but better.
Two things I can tell you.  If I knew about the Thomas recipe earlier, I believe I could have saved myself from undue suffering early on.  I would have started it at the 5mg level, maybe even earlier.  That way, the regimen would have had time to start helping me before D-day.
The second thing is that you are gonna feel rough for about 10 days, but there is an end to it.  It won't feel like it will end, but if you hang strong, you will beat it.
I've got about 5 months between me and methadone now.  Every day gets better and better.  Believe me... it's worth the stretch.
Looking back, I think I deceived myself a little bit.  I thought that at some point, suddenly I would be "fixed".  That I would feel great and all that hell would be behind me.
I can save you that self-imposed hell by telling you that it is not that way at all. Each day when you get up, look yourself in the mirror and marvel in your victory.  Even though I didn't opt for the traditional 12 step thing, there is truth in the phrase "One day at a time."  As modern human beings, we want to take a pill and wake up to find everything is fixed.  Unfortunately, as many other things in life are, methadone addiction (or dependence) is not that way.  I can remember the beginning of this journey I'm on.  I remember the hell, the tough spots, the fractured hope.  But above all, I remember the help I received here that are the cornerstones of my success.
You're in the right place my friend.  And you are better than this evil you didn't ask to be a part of.

All the best,
MethMan

[Benz Doctor]

Thanks for the quick reply. The other option is to try the Rapid Detox program. Does anyone have any pros/cons on this approach.
Thanks, BD

[sharonver]

There are a few people here that have tried the rapid detox,I don't know of any real success with it.  I think it is dangerous, and I myself would never try it. In my opinion I see it as a quick way for anesthesiologists to make some big bucks at our expense & suffering!!

Sharon (don't recommend it)

[Benz Doctor]

Hi Methman, Thanks for the quick response. I have been using Methadone regularly for about one year (six months of which has been tapering).I get my meth off the street in wafer form. I had over five years totally clean (and feeling great)from a $400 a day iv Dilauidid habit. I used Methadone to detox from the K4s in rehab. Thankfully, I wasn't exposed to the clinic enviornment due to other addicts in detox telling me "YOU DON'T WANT TO GO THERE !!" Everything was fine until two years ago. I went to the dentist and got Loratab 7.5s (I didn't even use them until I had a pulled muscle months later) Well my brain must have said "Hello old friend, where have you been?" Since that time I've been using 7.5s and 10s on a recreational level with a little Methadone in case the Loratab got away from me. Well you can probably guess what happened next, the Methadone got away! I have been up to 160mg. a day but now I'm down to 50mg.a day and thought that was pretty good until I read some of you alls posts of down to two or three mgs. And now I'm wondering how I'm going to get such a low level breaking wafers? I'm also starting to consider going to the rapid detox. Thanks for all of your input. BD

[drugzalots]

hello everyone, well i finally got to go to the dr yesterday.  he was my dr for years.  he knew i was on mmt and he don't look down on me for it.  i used to get lortab from him.  and of course i had to ask him for some yesterday!  (man what the hell is wrong with me!!!)  thank god he said no!  he gave me some neurontin 600mg.  he told me he has another patient that has stenosis and that he couldn't even walk across the room, he put him on this neurontin and now this man can walk again.  wow!!!  if this works for me i will be so very happy indeed!!  i so much want my life back!  to be able to walk again without pain and without a walker!  man i just can't beleave it!!  i want to find out as much as i can on this drug.  my dr said it takes away all pain, wow!!  if that is true then why isn't everyone on it?  if any of you have any info on this med would you please post it here?  thank you in advance.  also i'll let you all know how it's working on me.  take care all, i've got to go, angela

[pillhell]

Hey bud,
Its really great to have you back!You were missed.I hope you got all the politics worked out,and you can express yourself freely.After all this is the great land of the free!!!!!!!!!!Well it sounds like your doing great.I was out of commision for a while,but I'M BACK BABY!!!!Ya know what they say the good,the bad and the ugly.Anyway I tried to email you but it was sent back to me stating you are an unknown user.i used the same address i emailed you before.So if you have a new email address let me know-***@**** I'll talk 2 u soon.Keep up the good work.

                      pillhell

[pillhell]

Hi Sharon,
I already emailed you.But i was reading your posts and i couldnt help but post to you so I could let you know how great I think your doing!!!!!!!!4 mg. WOW!!!!!!That is so awesome.Keep up the great work.You are definately an inspiration to those struggling.i've been out of the loop for a while.But I'm back,ready to kick but and take names.Your success makes me think I can do it this time.Keep in touch-I am so proud of you girl!

                         pillhell

[sharonver]

Hey Mandy...
Got your email, it was great hearing from ya. Glad you are back, missed ya.  Thanks for your kind words on my daily struggle to recover.  I hope that I am doing as well as everyone seems to think I am.  I do know that I have gotten so very much help and support from everyone here and I appreciate it more than you'll ever know.  It has been a long difficult journey for me but I will prevail!!!!

Sharon

[scared friend]

Hi, this is my first visit and even though it's anonymous, I am still very nervous about admitting this.  I don't want to sound like little miss goody, but I have never had a problem with any kind of drug and I don't drink at all.  I started taking Loratab 10's a couple of years ago for various medical conditions.  I now buy them from friends and I just can't believe it.  I take whatever I can afford and what I can't afford.  I have depleted my savings, charged up my credit cards etc., I am so scared and I don't know what to do.  I have a husband and a 7 month old baby girl and I know that I have a very serious problem.  I told my husband and he now thinks for the third time that I am weaning myself off and actually gives me 1 1/2 per day, but of course I had about 10-20 to that number depending on what I can get my hands on.  I have tried to do the cold turkey thing, but oh my god!  I don't have any family here, so I don't have a baby sitter for my little girl and my husband travels all the time.  I really, really want to quit, but I can't even seem to slow down without getting severely depressed and the physical part of it is overwhelming.  I can't even function at work if I don't have them.  I do not want my family, friends or co-workers to know about this.  I mentioned it to my dr., and he pretty much just blew me off.  Wonder why they don't want to help you?  It's nice to hear from others who are suffering from the same thing.  when I am low, or when I haven't had any for 3 hours or more, I don't want to talk to anyone!  It's just awlful.  I have read about the clonodine and valium and meth, but I am scared that I will be trading one addiction for another and I don't want that either.  I don't know how insurance works with things like this, but if I could go to rehab, I would.  I could talk for hours about this and I know I am looking for some sort of miracle pill that would put me back to my happy self before I discovered this darn things.  Maybe in writing and admitting, it will help me feel better.  Good luck to all, scared friend.

[Thomas03]

Welcome to the forum.

You may or may not find it comforting that your Lortab story is just about everyone's, including your horror of withdrawal. When I first became addicted to Vicodin/Lortab (back in horse and buggy days), withdrawal was brutal and scary. I wasn't prepared for it and I didn't understand what was happening, how long it would last, or what to do about it. There's also an intense psychological factor to Lortab withdrawal. Believe me, we all know what you're feeling.

I suppose you can do one of 4 things: keep using Lortabs, taper off of them over a month or so, do a cold turkey detox lasting about a week, or go to rehab (in-house or out-patient).

I get the idea that you can't continue to use as you are now. You don't sound ready to go cold turkey. You don't sound in charge enough to taper (I couldn't taper to save my life). So, that leaves some form of rehab (in- or out-patient).

Since you have a 7-month old to care for, perhaps an out-patient setting would work for you. They will give you some meds to help with withdrawal, dole out your Lortabs daily and provide some counciling. Of course, it's up to you not to buy more off the street. And your chances of success, I think, would be better if you had someone to help out with the youngster. You know, most of us are shamed by our addiction, and it is shame that keeps us using, isolated from friends, family and help. Shame perpetuates addiction while never motivating anyone to do anything constructive.

'Fact is, what happened to you can happen to anyone and will happen to many. You became addicted to Lortabs because you're human, and that's nothing to be ashamed of. Let us know how you're doing.

Thomas

[scared friend]

To Thomas03:  I am not sure If I am posting correctly, but just wanted to say thanks for responding to my comment.  It's nice to be able to communicate with someone who truly understands.  I am really really scared.  I have a good life and feel sad that I have fell to this.  My husband does not understand as he hasn't ever been in my shoes.  He travels all the time and basically I feel like a single mom with an addiction problem.  I don't want my baby girl to suffer from this.  This is why it's difficult for me to bite the bullet.  I feel so bad that I am afraid I will not take as good of care of her if I try to quit cold turkey.  It is consuming my every thought.  I have a good job and I can't even concentrate at work anymore wondering where or how I am going to get some more.  Do you know if I go to rehab through my company insurance if anyone would find out about it?  Are you clean or trying?  I thought about trying the detox program folks are talking about in the forum.  I will have to go back and look up the name.  It's the one with B6 and various vitamins along with valium.  Of course, I don't know where I would get the valium, but I am willing to try it.  It's very difficult to have these in your possession and not take them!  It makes me feel like everything is going just fine until I start coming down and/or looking at my finances or watching my little girl sleep.  Gosh, I just hate it..hate it ...hate it.  It makes me want to scream!  Any way, sorry, didn't mean for this to be so long.  Thank you again I appreciate you taking the time with me.