Need expert help - cognative problems

[RFehr613]

hi, i was diagnosed bipolar at the age of 15.  i am currently 23 and have been through just about every mood stabalizer and anti-depressant in the book.  im currently on wellbutrin, equettro and lithium and have been on them for a couple years.  i was also on topamax and wellbutrin in highschool for about 2 years.  i dont know how long its been going on, but i notice about 2-3 years ago that my brain keeps screwing stuff up ha ha.  like, i cannot for the life of me remember someones name when i meet them.   it takes a good 10 or so introductions before i finally remember it.  i used to always remember someones name the first time.  also, i mix up words and letters (like dyslexia).  dyslexia DOES run in my family and i am diagnosed with a reading disorder, but it never used to be like this.  and overall, my concentration just sucks.  my doc told me back in highschool that topamax has cognative sides, but i told him i never noticed any.  i was put on lamictal after the topamax, and i felt like my cognative issues were worse on lamictal.  i was just recently reading a thread on a body building forum about bipolar.  a guy there was bipolar and had taken topamax, and he told me about how bad the "topamax moments" were and that they still affect him even after he stopped taking the med.  it made me think, so i did a little research and it seems every cognative side thats listed for topamax is a side that i have.  

back in highschool, the course work was easy and i never did much work outside of class.  now, im a senior in college studying physics and im having some real problems concentrating when doing the problems.  my doc put me on aricept a couple years ago to combat these sides, but i dont feel like it does anything.  ive also been taking ginko biloba for a couple years.  nothing seems to help.

my question is, are these sides from the current meds (wellbutrin, equettro, lithium)?  or are they left over sides from the topamax?  if theyre from the topamax, will they ever go away?  i cant live like this any longer.  thanx in advance.

[JillthePill77]

I skimmed over parts of your posts, but I took, and still take, Levoxyl to prevent problems with my thyroid.  My Dr. checks my levels every 3 -6 months and I haven't had any problems at all.  I take 0.025 MG and the only problem I've had is that I have to explain to every DR that it's preventative only and I don't have hypothyroidism.  My
liver specialist, physician, and Psychologist all agree that is good medical practice, as long as the blood levels are taken regularly.

I agree with DLA about the ADD, though.  That sounds like it would cause a lot of your more serious problems.

This is probably not new information, but every doctor you deal with must know every drug you're taking.  Over the counter, illegal, whatever.  I wouldn't deal so much with the past, you can't change it anyway.  But from now on carry a form with every drug you are taking and keep it updated.  It gives the doctors a much better chance to help you if they have a clear picture of every medical problem.  I always ask every doc, no matter what he's treating me for, to review the list of drugs I take.

Good luck.  Keep us posted.  I have massive experience reading research papers and DLA seems to have a great deal of experience with computers, so if you want a search done.  Let us know.  My daughter does research at Purdue so she has access to the big medical searches too. She can find stuff I can't.

Hi, to DLA.  Hope you're feeling better today, or did I read the wrong post.  I'm always doing that.

[RFehr613]

yeah, not so sure about trusting a google search though.  ill just ask my doc, hell probably know.  no word from him yet though...

[DLA]

Like the new profile!   Really like where you added the "male" part to it, so I don't get confused any more!  LOL

No, I'd have to find something on it.  Way back in the olden days when I was dx I knew the percentage, but that's been a few millenium ago.  ;-)  At least 13 years anyway.  Bet if you punched it in, the computer could bring it up for you.  I will try to do that later.  Well, maybe tomorrow, it's already later and tomorrow.  12:09am

[RFehr613]

changed my profile info :)

i dont suppose you got any numbers about bipolar and ADD do you?  i would really like to see some quantitative evidence.  i dont deny it by any means, it would just be a really good point to bring up with my doc.

[DLA]

Biggest majority of bipolars also suffer from ADD or ADHD.  

Click on the 'My MedHelp" with the heart under it at the top and you can change your info and add a pic or at least have it change your avatar to blue.  You can add lots of info there and there's also a journal there.  But know that whatever you put in your journal everyone can read it.  

[RFehr613]

thanx for the input.  im not sure how large an industrial can of duster is, but that sound like a lot.  i dont think i did quite that much.  but the last time i did it was bad.  i had just gotten fired from my job, so i went out to my car and sat in it.  i started hyperventalating to prepare my lungs for a large hit of this stuff, then i exhaled as much as i could and inhaled as much duster as i could.  i ended up passing out for 15 minutes.  scared the **** outta me, so i threw the can out the window and never did it again.

luckily i dont have memory problems like yours.  im kindof obsessive compulsive with my stuff, so i never end up losing it ha ha.  i keep everything in the EXACT same spot every time (keys on belt loop, wallet in back left pocket, cell phone in front right pockt, etc).

the dyslexia though i really dont know if i can say its from duster.  it just started a couple years ago (or i just noticed it then), and i havent touched duster for....6-7 years.  also the fact that it runs in my family makes me inclined to believe that its just genetic.  i also dont really zone out like you spoke of.  i have in the past, but it was just meds i was taking.  i dont do it on my current meds.

im really thinking about this ADD thing though.  are their any statistics for people with bipolar that also have ADD?

[RFehr613]

my bad, i didnt know you were a woman and i didnt know anything about the color avartars.  it never asked me...

ill talk to my doc about the T4, i dont really feel like it does a whole lot anyways, so it may be worth stopping.  thanx for the help.

[Nicotine]

Just adding another opinion and I'm gonna tell ya what happened to me. I did about 10 indutrial cans of computer duster about a year ago........ i wish i never had i was so scared.
for a week after that i ws dyslexic id get words mixed up in sentences alot and i dident even try reading.. which was my favorite thing to do.

since then i got a vehicle I've gone thru 20 set's of key's cause i can't remember for the life of me where i put them. I could just sit the key's down on the coffee table in front of me. have to leave all of a sudden and look for my key's for 5 minutes even tho they were in plain view.
Peoples names i can't remember unless i hung out with them for a couple hour's and i hear there name alot from other people they run into.

the dyslexia has gone and i can read and speak proper english again but my memory doesent seem to be coming back anytime soon.

now mind you the memory problems dident occur till about 3-6 months after i did the inhalent and the dyslexia came and went A.K.A. zoning out on a road sign while waiting thru a green light till it turned to red again.

[DLA]

Dude, I'm a woman.  Change your avitar to a male, blue.  Right now you're pink for a female!

Don't know about the lithium and if it's guaranteed thyroid trouble.  I'm telling you that if you take the thyroid when you don't need it that is what will happen to you.  Ask Venora about the lithium.

[RFehr613]

pregnant?  dude, im a dude

so are you saying all people who take lithium go through this?  its like guaranteed?  im not on an extremely high does if that matters.  im currently taking 450mg/day.  for a brief period i was at 1125mg/day, but my blood test showed that was too high.  this is lithium carbonate by the way.

[DLA]

He is so very very wrong about the thyroid.  75mcg is not a tiny little dose.  And ppl can take a lot more than that.  Guess you'll do what you have to do, but I'm here to tell you when the thyroid goes bad your whole life is screwed.  Takes years and years to get to a point where you are well.  After you finally get the thyroid destroyed--that's what normally has to happen, drinking radio active iodine or surgery--it takes quite a while to get the meds adjusted to where you can function as a normal human being again and not a brainless slug, then it can take a year or longer--if ever--to get all your organs healed and back to functioning like they are suppose to.  And if you go hypothyroid those muscles you have been building for all these years can just disappear in a matter of months.  You'll also gain weight like crazy and have high cholesterol.

Look, I would say I'm not trying to scare you, but that would be a lie.  You are young and sound really healthy other than the bipolar.  As long as you stay away from the drugs and alcohol.  I don't want your life to be turned upside down by this little gland that can destroy the life you are leading.  You sound really smart and I don't want your life plans to come to a halt suddenly b/c of your thyroid.  And if you plan on getting pregnant some time in the future it can become a major road block.  So having a ****** thyroid as you put it, is a HUGE deal, that you can't possibly imagine.  Look, if you don't believe me, go over to the thyroid website and post there asking about it.  I won't even comment on it.

Just make sure you are comfortable with what the dr is telling you, I guess, and that you can live with the consequences it may be causing you.  Because of a bunch of bad antibodies I have been in this thyroid he// for 8 years now and have had no life.

[RFehr613]

ive been into body building now for about 2 years.  just this past december i decided to try a ketogenic died to cut down my body fat.  i love the diet and it works great.  one positive side to it is that when youre in ketosis (body running off ketones vs. carbs), you can think more clearly and have more energy.  its great.  when im in ketosis and am doing my dynamics problems i concentrate very well and solve them much quicker than normal.  the problem is, ive been on a cyclical ketogenic diet.  that means i eat carbs for 24-48 hours out of every week.  this carb-up is needed so i have energy for lifting in the gym.  and it takes a good 1-2 days to get back into ketosis, so i really only have about 3 days of this clear brain function.

i am not currently on the diet.  im taking 3-4 weeks off to bulk up on a standard 40/40/20 diet, then im going to cut more with the keto diet again.  and with these carbs, im like dying trying to do homework ha ha.  im like falling asleep and i cant keep my mind on one thing.

thought i should post that too

[RFehr613]

well he told me im taking a low dose so i should be fine.  he said 75mcg is the max i can take though.  and what difference does it make if my thyroid is f*cked anyways, ya know?

[DLA]

Well, that was a really stupid move on his part!!!  If you take thyroid meds when they are not needed for replacement that damages your thyroid.  Dr's are clueless when it comes to thyroids.

When you post your levels I'll help you figure them out.

[RFehr613]

i just called my doc and left a message to have him call me back with my last test results, so ill post em as soon as he gets back to me.

i cant believe lithium does that to you.  christ, is it even worth it?  im gonna be on levothyroxine my entire life then.  my doc originally put me on levothyroxine not because my levels were low but rather to combat sedating sides of the meds i take.

[DLA]

Sorry.  Pretty sure that if once your thyroid is damaged it's permanent.  Don't know of anything you can do to fix it again.

Also make sure they really feel of your thyroid to make sure it doesn't have any nodules or anything on it.

[DLA]

All of the drugs, am sure, have done damage to your brain, no way around that.  Just like the drinking did to mine.  

Would still start with the thyroid if I was you.  Especially finding out that you already take levo.  Do you know why you are hypothyroid?  I have no thyroid at all and take 137mcg of levo.  Need to get it checked and get a copy of your test results.  Then let me know what they are and I'll try to help you with the results.  You need to have a complete thyroid work up done.  Make sure they run all the tests at the same time; TSH, FreeT3, FreeT4, then there's some antibody tests and such for thyroid that they should also run.  Sorry, been too long since I've had all those, don't remember their names any more.  But if you want to know more about them go to the thyroid forum on here and ask for help from them.  I first belonged to the thyroid community.  Great bunch of people.  But as I said, if you get the tests done and let me know I'll figure it out or ask to get you the info you need.

[RFehr613]

actually i forgot to mention i also take 75 mcg of levothyroxine.  i dont know what my levels are though.  i could find out as i get them checked fairly regularly.  my doc hasnt said anything when he gets my blood tests though so i assume theyre fine.  does lithium PERMANENTLY damage thyroid?  :(

and i have been put on ADD meds in the past (adderal and focalin) but i decided to quit them because i didnt feel like i needed to be on something so harsh.  i been thinking about getting back on them though recently.

also, just remembered...i had a short lived coke binge about 2 years ago.  i did coke every day all day for about 4 days straight COMPLETELY out of nowhere, then did it here and their after that (never once bought it though, so it wasnt at all frequently).  ended up stopping it completely about 6-8 months later.  and as i said before, my problems existed before this, but i knew it would likely be important to mention.  also, i developed a dependancy on focalin during this time period.  it was after i had stopped getting prescribed focalin, but i still had some left.  i ended up snorting all of it and havent touched it since.

i also forgot another little thing my brain screws up.  ill be writing something (like taking notes in class) and ill end up writing the complete wrong word from what i was thinking.  not just mispell a word or leave a letter or two out (which i also do), i will literally just write a completely different word.  it often has nothing to do with what were talking about ha ha, nor does it even resemble the word i meant to write.

[DLA]

If that's the case then sounds like you need to be checked for ADD.  Am sure you know that it is very common in bipolars.  It will also drive you insane at times.  Was soooo glad when I was finally dx as ADD!  Gave me a name for what I thought was me just losing what mind I had left.

Having said that you also need to have your thyroid levels checked to make sure that they're not the problem.  Taking lithium destroys your thyroid over time and thyroid patients suffer from what we call "brain fog" which sounds just like what you're having.  A normal TSH should be around 1.0 to make you feel good.  The standard for the range is 0.3--3.0, but most of us thyroid pts will tell you that until you get it to right around 1.0 you won't feel good at all.  I don't feel good until mine is around .93.  Get this checked out quickly as thyroid affects every single cell in your body.

And if the levels are fine, keep checking on it at least once a year.  For more info on this you can ask Venora, she's an expert on Lithium and thyroid damage.

[RFehr613]

yeah i know, but its not so much the memory as it is the way my brain functions/processes.  my memory IS affected, but not to a large enough degree that it really bothers me.  its the fact that i cant comprehend stuff.  i cant sit and think about my physics problems.  i get side tracked or i cant keep focused on the right part.  and the thing with remembering peoples names...i dont think its the memory as much as it is the comprehension.  i honestly feel like their name goes in one ear and right out the other.  one thing that makes me think this is i, HONEST TO GOD, realize 30 seconds after meeting them that i dont know their name.  i think i have serious problems with comprehension and concentration.

[DLA]

Don't know about the meds, but all of the drugs and inhalents affect your brain big time.  And the first part of your brain to be affected, other than mood, is memory.

[RFehr613]

i thought i should also mention:

1. i smoked pot my junior and senior years of highschool
2. my senior year of highschool i was using extacy
3. i abused inhalents (Duster) for a couple months in highschool
(i was done with all of these after i graduated though)