A Simple Question ... Maybe

[ChadCA]

A simple question

[Cleveland Clinic]

chadca,

I'm waiting for the simple question.

Chronic diseases with no treatments are really the bane of medicine. I wish I had a simple answer or pill for you to take.

The pure prevalence of people with similar complaints affirms how many suffer from the condition.  

The nice thing about the internet is that it allows these types of communities and support groups to form. I would use it to your advantage to see how others have dealt with their illness.

good luck

[Kristin391]

PVCs in the presence of a normal heart are normal.  I have had a lot of PVS since a very young age and totally ignore them. Try to cut out caffeine etc and maybe that would help.  There are lots of arrhythmias that are life threatening that need research and intervention.   Benign PVCs are not one of them.  I guess I view these in the context of all that can and do occur and this is really not something to pay much attention to once everything is ruled out.  I guess I would suggest that you try to relax and look at your diet  and make sure there isn't something you can do there.  Also, physicial fitness is important, keep weight under control, exercise regularly and keep stress under control.

[ChadCA]

Kristin

I truly appreciate you comment regarding other life threatening arrhythmias that need research and treatment, by no means would I suggest study of begin arrhythmias take precedence.  I

[nurse12hr]

I would beg to differ on one point:  Depression certainly CAN kill.

Not so with the penile dysfunction or small breasts!  But, the difference there, is that there ARE solutions available for those conditions.  Each person so afflicted can make an informed decision as to whether or not to avail themselves of the solution.  

Unfortunately, there is no easy solution to the PVC problem.  I wish you the best in your search for the answers.    I agree that more research needs to be done in this area.

[arthur]

I am confused.  The reasons for PVCs and PACs are well understood. Any cardio or EP should be able to confirm that they are the result of firing of island(s) of electrical cardiac tissue located near enough to the pacemaker circuits to cause a premature beat.  Not complicated.  We all have them, some more than others.

The current thinking is that these electrically-active islands are located in regions of the heart wall/PV ostia where only structural cardiac tissue is really needed.  But as evolution and fate would have it, nature didn't think it too important to be too careful about constructing the heart.  Basically, we procreated well enough with or without these beasts in our chests.

I think the most significant problem facing the PVC/PAC sufferer is anxiety and OCD.  I know I fell victim to it myself and I see it discussed throughout this forum and others.  The anxiety feeds upon itself, and leads to both a heightened awareness and a worsening condition (more skips).  There's nothing I can say that will make you feel better.  But I can say that I solved the problem for myself, because I realized that I was becoming victim to a curious version of OCD.  Maybe it's self-realization that is required as the critical first step...once you truly believe you understand the problem and that it's not critical, it's just the way your are constructed, and if you don't stop worrying about losing your life to an imagined runaway arrythmia, you will lose it to an obsession instead.  Your choice.

-Arthur

[Dr. Erik]

Magnesium Oxide 400mg works for me. Try it. You never know.

[nmc]

I'm curious - what is a "structurally normal" heart anyway? I have LVH and LAH, and also suffer from bouts of PVC/PACs (especially when I exercise). My doctor didn't seem too concerned about them. So - can anyone tell me when they *are* something to be concerned about?? I haven't bothered to see my doctor in over a year because I understood the darn things were "normal".
p.s. loved the penile dysfunction and small breasts analogies!

[whelans5]

I know exactly how you feel.  My doctor says,"my other patients, when I tell them they will not die, believe me.  Why won't you?  You're fine"  I can't even get referred back to the internist who diagnosed my bicuspid aortic valve because my doc says I don't need to see him.  So, I am stuck with all my questions and no answers.

My palps get worse when stressed and after the 100 centimetres (for those in the US that's approx. 40 inches) of snow we got lastnight and the 15-25 centimetres (4-6.25 inches) we are getting tomorrow, well I am stressed. The province declared a state of emergency so we are not allowed on the roads.  I am terribly stressed had major panic attacks and palpitations today and thought for sure I was having a heart attack.  I managed to calm myself down for my children's sake.

I definitely could use a support group and treatment for the anxiety of the PACs/PVCs.

If anyone has an psychotherapy tricks they'd like to share I'd love to hear them!

[bama jane]

It is interesting to see there are so many comments to this post. It is my understanding and experience that multiple pac's can lead to atrial tachycardia, but I am told that isn't lethal either. Does anyone notice these things causing palpatations
at times?  eating, reaching over my head, bending over, clothes that are confining around the waist, stomach growling, and heavy lifting.  I wonder if it has anything to do with changes in blood pressure.  I am not a big person 5'5" 106 pounds and my blood pressure gets low at times 78 over 48 sometimes even lower, I am on low dose beta blocker, the low blood pressure does not affect me too much just cold all the time in sunny California. Also there are heart suport groups in most places. I go to one monthly and it has helped me to realize that as bad as my situaion seems to me at times, there are so many people that have gone through much worse with their hearts and are still with us and finding ways to cope. That helps me a lot when my arrhythmia gets bad. I think having a good understanding doctor makes all the difference in the world. Mine always says there is no magic bullet for this, and I am sure if there were one this doc would find it.

[Linda123]

I have had palpitations since my teenage years - I'm now 47 - when I hit 40 my palpitations became absolutely dreadful.  I see you are also 40.  In some women peri menopause can bring on palpitations, this is because in some women cells in the heart are sensitive to estrogen.  My gyanecologist told me that palpitations are a major sign of menopause.  I don't know how you feel about HRT, I know it's a worry, but in my experience I have found taking it has given me back my life in that it has dramatically reduced the amount of palpitations I was getting.  Perhaps you could consider taking a low dosage of it for a while and seeing if it makes any difference.
Best Wishes to you, Linda

[Linda123]

I addressed my earlier post to Kristen - sorry - I meant to address it to you (although it may be of interest to you too Kristen!! :-)

[ChadCA]

Linda, thanks for the suggestion.  However my PVCs would be the last of my problems if I started HRT, I've enjoyed being male for the past forty-two years.

[I'mallheart]

hello i too agree i wish there was more help for us... i take atenolol 25 mg a day...i dont know if i should take it but it has helped when i have had fast arrythmias.. i am gonna see a dr this week and see what is needed to stop taking it if theres no danger...i know i cant just stop taking it...i also suffer from anxiety,depression...baby on the way in 4 weeks..trying to start a company..my health issues...its hard, sometimes i wanna run from it all and QUIT...i try to stay away from caffene also...i take COQ10 and magnesium oxide...i just hate feeling these episodes also..bestof luck
Dave

[whelans5]

I had an echocardiogram 2 years ago and due for another around May.  My doc said to come back in March and he would schedule another one.  The bicuspid aortic valve was found in the echo and so was the regurg.  My problem is no one will tell me anything about the results except, "You're fine".  

I had a stress test and got PAC's while on the treadmill.  If there were something more serious, like blockage or something else, they would have noticed it then wouldn't they?

[trrtrix]

I am a physician, in her 40's, living the protoytpic healthy California lifestyle, with specific attention to a healthy diet. After reading someone else's post about MSG, I looked into it. MSG is prevelent in all canned foods, frozen foods, tofu products and esp in energy bars like Balance and Power bars. It is used to increase the protein content of foods. It is generally NOT listed as MSG, but usually 'yeast extract', soy protein isolate, hydrolyzed vegetable protein, natural flavoring, and in the case of energy bars, sodium or calcium caseinate. These are just a few of ingredients in foods with MSG.

I have completely eliminated these from my diet with resulting complete resolution of my impressive number of PVC/PAC's. To test it, I had a glass of soy milk (containing 'natural flavors') with return of my excercised induced fluttering.

I urge you to look at your diet.

[I'mallheart]

what should we eat then, please make a outline for us to follow  it looks good
thank

[jan]

You have a right to your medical records which includes your tests.  My primary told me to get mine from my specialists and to keep my records.  I do get most and when I do I take them to the computer and do lots of searching, I find it all so interesting.  In the beginning I did it, because I was testing positive and didn't know a blessed thing, and wanted to find out the normal treatments.  So, get them and search.  It took me awhile to find out some chgs./differences are nothing to worry about, it's good when you get to that point.

I rarely am alarmed by palpitations (with the inappropriate sinus tachy I didn't feel any even @ 170bpm).  I had to have an event monitor for a good while and asked the cardio if it would be alright when I feel the different palps if I could record them, he said yes.  It was really interesting, I found out I was having various palps.  None to worry about.  If anybody gets an event monitor ask about recording all the different palps (maybe that is why you will be wearing one in the 1st place, mine was for syncope).

I will confess to having moments here and there where I stop and pay attn. and wonder if anything will become of my palps.  The other night my heart really fluttered and since I am withdrawing from pain meds (Oxycontin and Neurontin) it was one of those such moments.

Maybe if you do a search on the net, particularly Yahoo Groups, you will find a support group to meet your needs.  If not, you can make one, it's really easy.

Hugs

P.S.  I have read it helps if you make sure you are well hydrated, too.

[trrtrix]

Most excellent question. Everyone is different. For me, when I read about it then went through my pantry and fridge, virtually everything I was buying had these additives, including energy bars, veggie burgers, frozen organic Amy's Kitchen dinners, and my beloved soy milk. I thought I was going to have to eat grass and twigs.

The only real drastic change I've made is eliminating the 2-4 energy bars a day I was eating. I spend more time in the kitchen, and ALOT of time in the store reading labels. Some soy milk brands, veggie burgers etc have the additives, but others don't. Pretty much anything you add boiling water to and get a meal is out. Too bad for me.

My best recommendation is to go on line and read about MSG (specifically glutamine), read the labels of what you eat, and see if it helps you. Interestingly, in the literature, magnesium supplements have been shown to block the effects of glutamine (MSG). Many in this forum have had benefit from magnesium.....hmmmmmm.

My intake was impressive, while appearing to be a healthy diet, and eliminatining it has completely cured me. I even drink red wine and caffinated coffee again without a problem. How it effects others I don't know, and will mine return, we'll see.

Good luck!

[RNJ]

Reading the archives of this forum have been very informative but,as with most people, my case has some uniquness to address. My husband is 50 years old, has always been thin, has normal cholesterol and blodd pressure. He was diagnosed with microvalve prolapse as a child but it has never caused him any particular problems until recently. About 6 months ago he called me at work thinking he was having a heart attack. We went to the hopsital--his doctor was away-but the attending physician gave him an EKG. He said he had an arrythmia, and that his heart appeared to actually skip a beat during the brief EKG. The blood test indicated that he had not had a heart attack. A stress test was rec.but as he has no ins. he elected against it and went on about his daily routine. We are fish-eating vegetarians. His one bad habit is coffee. 3 or 4 cups a day, but he cannot be convince to give it up. Today after he got out of the shower he came into the living room and sat down saying he was experiencing the same racing of his heart as the day he had called me at work. He also felt dizzy. He has also been complaining about a constant pain in the upper left quadrant of his abdomen. He says he wakes up tired and feels like he hasn't been breathing at night. Sorry this is so long, but more info is beter, right? RNJ

[netrox]

If you think it's diet-related, try fasting for a couple of days. Drink plenty of water. Drink natural protein drinks. Take a complete nutritional supplement. If your PVC's drop signigicantly during fasting, that could mean that you're eating food that "irritate" your heart.

Also, increase your intake of omega-3 acids. Your body needs it. Without it, it will cause heart problems. Omega-3 acids lubricates your heart membranes and promote electrical stability. That is exactly why people who have high level of omega-3 acids in their blood have the lowest risk of fatal heart attacks.

Eat LOTS fo plants. There's NO limit to how much you can eat plants. The darker the color, the better it is for your body. Don't eat too much of the same plant. Your body will thank you for that.  

I get occasional PVC's. I noticed that how I eat affects my frequency of PVC's.

-jeff

[trrtrix]

I agree with you, esp about the essential fatty acid supplements (omega-3 and others). But, in my new glorious, fabulous PVC/bigeminy/trigeminy/atrial flutter/SVT/PAC/palp-free life, I wouldn't go anywhere near a 'natural' protein shake. MSG is derived from either seaweed or soy, both of which are'natural', and is used to increase the protein content of foods.

[netrox]

Hi,

"MSG is derived from either seaweed or soy, both of which are'natural', and is used to increase the protein content of foods."

There's no strong evidence linking MSG to health problems. In Japan, many consume MSG in large amounts yet their heart disease rate is low and live much longer than most people of other countries. I wouldn't worry too much about MSG as long as we don't consume too much of it.

Seaweed is a rich source of minerals including those that regulate your heartbeats (potassium and magnesium). I eat them occasionally, especially in soups. Just eat a variety of plants. Too much of a single plant isn't gonna help you.

Most heart diseases are caused by several factors, not just a single factor. Many once thought only excessive cholesterol would cause heart attacks. Now, we know it isn't true. Inflammation is a strong factor in creating heart disease. Bacterial infections can cause heart diseases - just not keeping your teeth clean can cause heart problems.

Eating a diet low in fat can reduce inflammation. Fat cells like to carry inflammation agents so less fat is better. If you want to have a moderate fat diet, fine but just eat the right kinds of fats and exercise enough to keep your body burning fats efficiently.

I do suspect inflammation caused by infections can cause PVC's. I remember when I was taking antibiotics, PVC's disappeared. When I finished it, it came back. But that's one time incident - could be coincidence.

-jeff

[justachillin]

I really enjoy reading in this forum.  It makes me feel like mayby I found a place where someone will listen to me and beleive me! About 3 weeks ago I was working out at our local weight facility.  I hadnt been lifting for a while and did upper and lower body for an hour.  About a half hour later as I was driving home I got a fluttering feeling in my chest.  I felt that it was deffinitly from my heart so I began to worry that I had done something to my heart lifting.  I pulled over and began to feel my pulse and about every 6th beat I would get a fluttery feeling whitch was almost liek a horribly mutated beat and pause followed by a strong beat and then normal beating again.  This happened for a few more times then I got scared becuase I thought I was having a heart attack becuase I had never felt that before.  I didnt feel any pain though or lightheadedness, fatigue.  I did however feel a slight shortness of breath durring the fluttery feeling.  I increased my heart rate dramtically in my panic and when I got to my parents house I told them what happened and they didnt think it was a big deal.  I slept over there and after I calmed down I seemed to be ok.  It stopped after my heartrate rose due to being scared.  I scheduled a physical with my doctor and during the physical I told him everything and also that I was on decongestant Medication (H-C Tussive Syrup and Amoxicillin 500mg Capsules).  He listened to my heart and told me that my heart sounded very healthy with no sign of murmer and it could have been a nervious system thing due to the medication I was on as well as the excessive lifting of upper and lower body.  About 4 days later, after a night of working out again I felt it again in my room as I was relaxing about to go to sleep.  It was about a couple hours after my workout.  I felt my heart do it about 3 times then I sat up because I was scared again.  I havnt felt it again for 3 days now.  I started researching online and came to the conlution I may be experiencing an arythmia.  Can anyone tell me what I could be experiencing? and if it is serious?  Thank you so much.
Chris

[LynnSB]

>>Can anyone tell me what I could be experiencing? and if it is serious? Thank you so much<<

It sounds like an arrhythmia and it probably isn't serious because most of them aren't BUT that isn't a diagnosis! No one -- including your doctor - can make an accurate diagnosis ( only an informed guess) without seeing these heartbeats that are bothering you on an EKG... you need to be assertive and insist on an event monitor. You will wear this  pager sized device  hooked to a couple of small electrodes on your chest while you exercise and afterwards, all the time except when bathing, and push a little button when you feel the weird heartbeats. That will record that part , and the beats before and after it occured will be stored, too.. you send it in over the phone. THAT's how to find out for sure. Otherwise, bud, you are just guessing.. why do that? Just INSIST  you need to get to the bottom of these palps.