Aa
HepC and Alcoholism Help
Does anyone know if HepC has anything to do with craving alcohol? I need help with both issues. I am also needing info on how to get a script for antibuse. I will be undergoing therapy for learning how to cope with a very troubled life and am alone in life. I know family support is necessary for recovery and I just don't have that. Lately, a family member has been keeping in touch with me and I am so very glad. Other than that, I am alone. It's horrible. So, I hope someone out there has some encouraging info for me. My HepC is not active and may never be, but I will be seeing a gastroenterologist soon possibly for a biopsy. I qualify for state programs as I have very low income, another reason for therapy! And I do wonder if I should ever receive treatment if the virus is ever active. I have antibodies, that's all I know. Extreme depression for sure! I take an anti depressant. Also, low thyroid meds. I am very interested in antibuse so I will definitely stay away from the alcohol, AA is just not for me at all. I've tried it and it's only trouble meeting strangers who know all about you. I am looking for a support group of SOME kind. Maybe I've found one here. Hope someone knows something good to tell me! Thank you.
Ha Ha, one of the reasons my posts tend to be so long winded is because I want to qualify my points as well as I can so they won't be misinterpreted, but I probably wasn't as specific as I could of been, thanks for qualifying some of my statements...when I said AA is a chance to unearth your secrets, shames, etc. I meant to your "sponsor" of course....your deepest ones tend to go to your sponsor alone...
But then, many newcomers find that they go to "speaker meetings" in the beginning cause they don't have to share themselves and they can listen to those who have gone before them which is a good thing....AA is just about the best show in town sometimes, alcoholics tend to be very intelligent and interesting people, and some of them the funniest people you've ever heard...so these speaker meetings can be highly entertaining and meaningful at the same time...
But as you go along and realize that we're all just people with many of the same issues, many newcomers find that they can go to share meetings and share like everyone else...though this is not demanded and there is no time frame for this to happen....one of the best things about AA is that there aren't many rules, you can even show up drunk to a meeting, as long as you don't try to share and can keep relatively unruly...I think you have to have at least 24 hours of sobriety before you can share yourself...
And of course, some like to go to smaller, more intimate meetings...and there are meetings where there is more of a focus on the "solution" then hearing constant "drunkalogs"...there are so many meetings that you can afford to be a little choosy about them...
But I heard a very wise man say...don't get TOO hung up about being "picky" about meetings, find the meetings that are right for you and you feel the most comfortable, but remember....the first people who started AA had very bare bones meetings with just a few people who didn't like each other much, and they managed to stay sober for the most part and start a movement which has probably saved millions of lives throughout the years, throughout the entire world...
He was very picky himself and would complain about this meeting or that (he also had a hard time staying sober for any good length of time)...this one was too sophisticated and upscale with too few people....that one was too street and downscale with too many people...this woman here had too nasal of a speaking voice, this guy had a red jacket on and it offended him, ha ha, you know the drill...finally his sponsor told him to go to the most downscale of meetings with just a bare bulb hanging in the middle of the room...it was in this meeting that this man was able to get sober and stay sober because he had to conquer his malcontent attitude there...one big sign of alcoholism is being constantly malcontented with your environment, this gives you one more excuse to drink, ha ha!
It's like the story of the Buddhist student complaining to his Buddhist teacher, I cannot meditate here today, it is just not quiet enough with all that street noise outside...and the Teacher responded...is the noise bothering you or are you bothering the noise???
But then, many newcomers find that they go to "speaker meetings" in the beginning cause they don't have to share themselves and they can listen to those who have gone before them which is a good thing....AA is just about the best show in town sometimes, alcoholics tend to be very intelligent and interesting people, and some of them the funniest people you've ever heard...so these speaker meetings can be highly entertaining and meaningful at the same time...
But as you go along and realize that we're all just people with many of the same issues, many newcomers find that they can go to share meetings and share like everyone else...though this is not demanded and there is no time frame for this to happen....one of the best things about AA is that there aren't many rules, you can even show up drunk to a meeting, as long as you don't try to share and can keep relatively unruly...I think you have to have at least 24 hours of sobriety before you can share yourself...
And of course, some like to go to smaller, more intimate meetings...and there are meetings where there is more of a focus on the "solution" then hearing constant "drunkalogs"...there are so many meetings that you can afford to be a little choosy about them...
But I heard a very wise man say...don't get TOO hung up about being "picky" about meetings, find the meetings that are right for you and you feel the most comfortable, but remember....the first people who started AA had very bare bones meetings with just a few people who didn't like each other much, and they managed to stay sober for the most part and start a movement which has probably saved millions of lives throughout the years, throughout the entire world...
He was very picky himself and would complain about this meeting or that (he also had a hard time staying sober for any good length of time)...this one was too sophisticated and upscale with too few people....that one was too street and downscale with too many people...this woman here had too nasal of a speaking voice, this guy had a red jacket on and it offended him, ha ha, you know the drill...finally his sponsor told him to go to the most downscale of meetings with just a bare bulb hanging in the middle of the room...it was in this meeting that this man was able to get sober and stay sober because he had to conquer his malcontent attitude there...one big sign of alcoholism is being constantly malcontented with your environment, this gives you one more excuse to drink, ha ha!
It's like the story of the Buddhist student complaining to his Buddhist teacher, I cannot meditate here today, it is just not quiet enough with all that street noise outside...and the Teacher responded...is the noise bothering you or are you bothering the noise???
Women For Sobriety has some good tips on staying a way from alcohol. One of them is to take an amino acid called L-Glutimine. I felt like it helped me. Although, now that I know that I have Hep-C, I am too petrified to ever touch a drop of alcohol in my life. Good luck....I will keep you in my prayers. Maybe like one of the other people said, check out different AA groups. Some are better than others.
I'm with Strator on this, one of the hallmarks of alcohoism is *isolating* always being on your own cause you can't handle being with other people that well...drinking until you are drunk while you are on your own all the time is a prime example of this...
Perhaps some of the reasons for this is thinking other people will "pull your covers"....get to know all your deepest and dark secrets and then hold them against you because they are all so shameful, etc....
The things is, in AA or organizations like it, you find out that we ALL have feelings like this, and, with all due respect...one person's secrets aren't all that important or significant in the grand scheme of things...we all have things we feel deeply ashamed of and it's really not that big of deal, proves youre just human like everyone else...
Once you are able to let some of these things go by telling other people who can relate to you and are there to help you...it's very freeing...there's a saying that "we are only as sick as our secrets" the logic being that if you are by yourself and mulling over your own problems by yourself... going round and round in your head... that in itself can lead a person to drink...
Also it's a great way to make friends, of course, like any other place where anyone is allowed to join with no dues or fees, there will be people you can't relate to...but there will be people you CAN relate to as well..and you say you feel very alone, INSTANT way to make friends and not have to socialize with other drinkers for the time being, till you learn to stay sober in any situation...
AA is not the only way to help you out of active alcoholism, but it's probably the most successful and been around the longest...that's why law enforcement, the courts, rely on it to help drunk drivers, etc...
This disease does not mix with alcohol or drugs, unless they are the drugs you need to take to help rid you of the virus...period...drinking accelerates the virus' killing your liver...
So maybe AA isn't for you, but do seek help elsewhere... because like Strator said, if it was easy as taking a pill, there wouldn't be any need for AA...cause it's hard, alcoholism and addiction is hard...getting sober is even harder...but then anything worth getting in life is usually hard work...
best of luck to you...
Perhaps some of the reasons for this is thinking other people will "pull your covers"....get to know all your deepest and dark secrets and then hold them against you because they are all so shameful, etc....
The things is, in AA or organizations like it, you find out that we ALL have feelings like this, and, with all due respect...one person's secrets aren't all that important or significant in the grand scheme of things...we all have things we feel deeply ashamed of and it's really not that big of deal, proves youre just human like everyone else...
Once you are able to let some of these things go by telling other people who can relate to you and are there to help you...it's very freeing...there's a saying that "we are only as sick as our secrets" the logic being that if you are by yourself and mulling over your own problems by yourself... going round and round in your head... that in itself can lead a person to drink...
Also it's a great way to make friends, of course, like any other place where anyone is allowed to join with no dues or fees, there will be people you can't relate to...but there will be people you CAN relate to as well..and you say you feel very alone, INSTANT way to make friends and not have to socialize with other drinkers for the time being, till you learn to stay sober in any situation...
AA is not the only way to help you out of active alcoholism, but it's probably the most successful and been around the longest...that's why law enforcement, the courts, rely on it to help drunk drivers, etc...
This disease does not mix with alcohol or drugs, unless they are the drugs you need to take to help rid you of the virus...period...drinking accelerates the virus' killing your liver...
So maybe AA isn't for you, but do seek help elsewhere... because like Strator said, if it was easy as taking a pill, there wouldn't be any need for AA...cause it's hard, alcoholism and addiction is hard...getting sober is even harder...but then anything worth getting in life is usually hard work...
best of luck to you...
I'm so long winded yet I thought of another thing...Hep C might be yet another excuse to crave drinking...but I don't know that it *induces* alcoholism per se...I know plenty of people with hep c who are fine not drinking, probably because they never had a drinking problem in the first place...alcoholism is a disease like any other with many components to it, one them being biological..but you can get help with it...
very good insight on the alcoholism issues by the veterans here, you are not alone.
it is good you are going for a biopsy, but is only needed if you tested positive for a viral load in hep c, not just antibodies. HEp c, if the virus is still present, is always active, always replicating and flowing through your systems. If you call inactive hep c the fact that you have no hepatic symptoms of advanced disease, then you could be right, but chronic hep c is not refer to as active/inactive. Unfortunately, it is always triggering responses from your immune system, but many people don't feel any different until it is too late and too advanced. You need to address your substance abuse issues and then the hep c. Get your genotype and viral load, if virus is still present, then the biopsy is a good next step.
stay tuned to the forum, it could help you immensely.
it is good you are going for a biopsy, but is only needed if you tested positive for a viral load in hep c, not just antibodies. HEp c, if the virus is still present, is always active, always replicating and flowing through your systems. If you call inactive hep c the fact that you have no hepatic symptoms of advanced disease, then you could be right, but chronic hep c is not refer to as active/inactive. Unfortunately, it is always triggering responses from your immune system, but many people don't feel any different until it is too late and too advanced. You need to address your substance abuse issues and then the hep c. Get your genotype and viral load, if virus is still present, then the biopsy is a good next step.
stay tuned to the forum, it could help you immensely.
I dont know how you drew your conclusions about AA but I can tell you that you have to search to find a group that works the program and if it does it will work for you. Look in the directory for Big Book and Step meetings or maybe As Bill Sees It meetings. These are usually smaller meetings where people focus on treatment rather than complaining.
New people always come in with laundry list of things to do, in my case I had a real list of what I considered important. What I needed to accomplish was to learn about and confront my alcoholism - I did and twenty some years later am still applying what I learned. How did it happen? I got a sponsor, started listening, stopped running the show, learned about the power of honesty. got out of my own way, worked steps and threw my list away. You dont tell your secrets to everyone - just your sponsor and as part of the program. You tell the people in the group what you are doing and how it is helping you cause there just may be someone there who has less sobriety and needs to hear it.
The important thing is finding the right place and people. Sort of like this forum here. AA, like the Internet is really a vast wasteland dotted with small groups of enthusiastic people trying to help each other and themselves get better. Look around, you can find that place -- as you found this place. Good luck.
New people always come in with laundry list of things to do, in my case I had a real list of what I considered important. What I needed to accomplish was to learn about and confront my alcoholism - I did and twenty some years later am still applying what I learned. How did it happen? I got a sponsor, started listening, stopped running the show, learned about the power of honesty. got out of my own way, worked steps and threw my list away. You dont tell your secrets to everyone - just your sponsor and as part of the program. You tell the people in the group what you are doing and how it is helping you cause there just may be someone there who has less sobriety and needs to hear it.
The important thing is finding the right place and people. Sort of like this forum here. AA, like the Internet is really a vast wasteland dotted with small groups of enthusiastic people trying to help each other and themselves get better. Look around, you can find that place -- as you found this place. Good luck.
You are not alone. And I and many others in this forum have been EXACTLY where you are right now.
That's a characteristic of alcoholism - we believe the lies that our MIND tell us - like this time it will be different or "I" can lick this myself. OR I'm all alone. Alcoholism is a disease of isolation and more destructive than the HCV.
You have made a good beginning.
The only place I got the info I needed to deal with the disease of alcoholism was AA. I certainly didn't need to bare my soul to everyone. That's why we have sponsors in AA. Wonderful people dedicated to lives of service and helping others to recover. And like others have said there are many many types of meetings. Same sex meetings are usually very safe places.
The truth is if we don't deal with the alcoholism we will be in no shape to deal with the HCV. First things first.
We are all with you!
That's a characteristic of alcoholism - we believe the lies that our MIND tell us - like this time it will be different or "I" can lick this myself. OR I'm all alone. Alcoholism is a disease of isolation and more destructive than the HCV.
You have made a good beginning.
The only place I got the info I needed to deal with the disease of alcoholism was AA. I certainly didn't need to bare my soul to everyone. That's why we have sponsors in AA. Wonderful people dedicated to lives of service and helping others to recover. And like others have said there are many many types of meetings. Same sex meetings are usually very safe places.
The truth is if we don't deal with the alcoholism we will be in no shape to deal with the HCV. First things first.
We are all with you!
mlg-you asked..."Does anyone know if HepC has anything to do with craving alcohol?"
It may not be considered by many a symptom of hep c. But looking back on those last 2 years I drank it probably had a lot ot do with physically triggering things,once I picked up that first drink. Physically the fatigue and sometimes sometimes comes with hep, in itself often may have contributed to my wanting a little 'pick me up.' You know I thought i always felt a little burst of energy with a couple of pops. Course i usually didn't stop there. Eventually I started doing coke again cause I was always so D**m tired. The fatigue could also push one towards depression or feeling overwhelmed, all things that leave us a void we want to fill. Well later when I found out I had hep, I realized that my stressed liver just added to the cycle. Even doing coke would put me to sleep sometimes. The real problem was that I'm an alcoholic, don't know how to stop once I start, and had never address the issues of dealing with life on life's terms. Today I work on all that stuff, I watch my energy levels, I take a nap if I get a wave of fatigue. I talk to friends from recovery. I don't socialize a lot, or go to the conventions or dances right now, I've got other priorities. There are like anyplace else people that I don't see eye to eye with, but I've learned how to put those things aside and look as they suggest at the principles, not the personalities. About a year ago I started driving a guy to meetings that was very withdrawn, disabled, and spent his days in his apt alone. He'd gotten sober a 15 years ago with AA, and still hadn't drank but wasn't going to meetings anymore. But he knew where he needed to be. Man was he a grump, and man could you sense his loneliness. At first he wouldn't open his mouth except to 'grump' about something, some people actually said to me, man he's a real downer. Well it's AA not a personality contest and I just kept picking him up at my sponsor's suggestion. Now he laughs and jokes with everyone, bakes cookies, others gladly pick him up when i can't and if I walk into a meeting without him, they say 'hey, where's ****?' He and I don't socialize outside meetings but when I'm having a rough day, I call him and talk. When a new comer comes in and is grumpy or withdrawn or doesn't want to be there. This guy knows how they feel, puts out his hand, and is a walking example that things get better, and people can heal.
The most important lesson I learned there is how to ask and recieve help. If it wasn't for that introduction I may have never joined a support group for hep c, or come on line here.
You can't find friends without meeting people. Find what works for you. You said you've had a troubled life. Bte you've gotten through tougher stuff before.
Be Well,
Don
Forseegood,...getting sober is even harder...yeah it is. But what a wonderful difference.
Thanks,
Don
It may not be considered by many a symptom of hep c. But looking back on those last 2 years I drank it probably had a lot ot do with physically triggering things,once I picked up that first drink. Physically the fatigue and sometimes sometimes comes with hep, in itself often may have contributed to my wanting a little 'pick me up.' You know I thought i always felt a little burst of energy with a couple of pops. Course i usually didn't stop there. Eventually I started doing coke again cause I was always so D**m tired. The fatigue could also push one towards depression or feeling overwhelmed, all things that leave us a void we want to fill. Well later when I found out I had hep, I realized that my stressed liver just added to the cycle. Even doing coke would put me to sleep sometimes. The real problem was that I'm an alcoholic, don't know how to stop once I start, and had never address the issues of dealing with life on life's terms. Today I work on all that stuff, I watch my energy levels, I take a nap if I get a wave of fatigue. I talk to friends from recovery. I don't socialize a lot, or go to the conventions or dances right now, I've got other priorities. There are like anyplace else people that I don't see eye to eye with, but I've learned how to put those things aside and look as they suggest at the principles, not the personalities. About a year ago I started driving a guy to meetings that was very withdrawn, disabled, and spent his days in his apt alone. He'd gotten sober a 15 years ago with AA, and still hadn't drank but wasn't going to meetings anymore. But he knew where he needed to be. Man was he a grump, and man could you sense his loneliness. At first he wouldn't open his mouth except to 'grump' about something, some people actually said to me, man he's a real downer. Well it's AA not a personality contest and I just kept picking him up at my sponsor's suggestion. Now he laughs and jokes with everyone, bakes cookies, others gladly pick him up when i can't and if I walk into a meeting without him, they say 'hey, where's ****?' He and I don't socialize outside meetings but when I'm having a rough day, I call him and talk. When a new comer comes in and is grumpy or withdrawn or doesn't want to be there. This guy knows how they feel, puts out his hand, and is a walking example that things get better, and people can heal.
The most important lesson I learned there is how to ask and recieve help. If it wasn't for that introduction I may have never joined a support group for hep c, or come on line here.
You can't find friends without meeting people. Find what works for you. You said you've had a troubled life. Bte you've gotten through tougher stuff before.
Be Well,
Don
Forseegood,...getting sober is even harder...yeah it is. But what a wonderful difference.
Thanks,
Don
Seeing a picture of how much damage I had potentially done - being an alcoholic with hep C...and how much the hep AMFLIFIED THE EFFECTS in the damage to my liver really helped me to stay sober - when I'd always had trouble before.
I really want to beat this disease and know that there IS a cure but that you cannot drink at all during treatment or the Interferon might not work and the virus will stop replicating.
So I take it one day at a time and say well maybe I'll drink tomorrow but certainly not today - and that helps me take the "forever" effect off of it. You see if anyone were to tell me I could never have chocolate cake ever again...I'd gorge myself on it as much as I could. But if I hear I can't have it for just TODAY I'm cool with it.
You need to find a good group and learn about both diseases - the harder to treat is alcoholism if you ask me. It's sneaky and disgusting just like the hep, but you DO HAVE A CHOICE.
I wish you all the best.
I really want to beat this disease and know that there IS a cure but that you cannot drink at all during treatment or the Interferon might not work and the virus will stop replicating.
So I take it one day at a time and say well maybe I'll drink tomorrow but certainly not today - and that helps me take the "forever" effect off of it. You see if anyone were to tell me I could never have chocolate cake ever again...I'd gorge myself on it as much as I could. But if I hear I can't have it for just TODAY I'm cool with it.
You need to find a good group and learn about both diseases - the harder to treat is alcoholism if you ask me. It's sneaky and disgusting just like the hep, but you DO HAVE A CHOICE.
I wish you all the best.
dearest mlg, it's so good that you're reaching out for help... that is the first step to freedom... i pray for you to finally get ahold of this battle...and win!!!
dearest mlg, please also remember that the Lord is near to you and you are never really alone... he loves you and cares, and is ever listening...and He has the Power to help us...
please stick with us here for help with hep c issues... there is a wealth of info available through these fine folks as well as some great friends...
my heart goes out to you...i know you will find the way!
sandi
dearest mlg, please also remember that the Lord is near to you and you are never really alone... he loves you and cares, and is ever listening...and He has the Power to help us...
please stick with us here for help with hep c issues... there is a wealth of info available through these fine folks as well as some great friends...
my heart goes out to you...i know you will find the way!
sandi
Wish you didn't have to handle this alone. I can't tell you what's right for you. I wouldn't suggest putting too much stock in antibuse though, especially if your alone a lot and get strong cravings. There aren't any magic bullets, if antibuse was all it took the recovery meetings wouldn't be so packed.
Maybe for you...try to get into an outpatient or counseling program through your town or state. At least maybe you could get some face to face input that way and meet a few people for support, but remember most people in outpatient may not be that experienced at staying sober. My personal opinion.. better to attend a group where there's some long term experience.
In my case I sobered up for 7 years once without a support group, and then drank for 2 years. Now I do the AA thing and I tell you, it is way better. A lot of people there say they did not like it at first, thought everyone was weird or a cult or just didn't understand, their still around and sober a lot of years later.
I do understand, some people just aren't the crowd or stranger type. But that's also something I've seen change in a lot of people. I know in my area there's both large and smaller meetings. Some find it more peaceful at first at the smaller ones.
The best to you in this,
Don
Maybe for you...try to get into an outpatient or counseling program through your town or state. At least maybe you could get some face to face input that way and meet a few people for support, but remember most people in outpatient may not be that experienced at staying sober. My personal opinion.. better to attend a group where there's some long term experience.
In my case I sobered up for 7 years once without a support group, and then drank for 2 years. Now I do the AA thing and I tell you, it is way better. A lot of people there say they did not like it at first, thought everyone was weird or a cult or just didn't understand, their still around and sober a lot of years later.
I do understand, some people just aren't the crowd or stranger type. But that's also something I've seen change in a lot of people. I know in my area there's both large and smaller meetings. Some find it more peaceful at first at the smaller ones.
The best to you in this,
Don
We're not Doctors here, best to go to a doctor to get a script for antibuse. Be sure to always inform your doctor about any liver issues, as some medications directly affect your liver. Even Tylenol.
Most people here have active/chronic Hep C as far as I know. How do you know it is not active? Did they check your viral load?
You could be in that small % group that defeats the virus with their immune system. If that's the case you have a lot to be thankful for.
But your not alone anymore! Most people here do not suggest that you drink with HepC genotype 1. Personally I dont think people should drink at all. I think it is the great American social lie that you need to drink to be happy.
I suggest if drinking is your problem, that you give AA another try. I went to AA for 4 years. After a while of AA I was able to cope with not drinking and learned that there is a huge life out there that doesnt involve drinking. I learned a lot of life skills and I dont have the desire to drink and I dont go to meetings anymore.
Definatley stick with the counseling, especially if you have depression issues.
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