what's next ;-/

[ita17]

I am very confused & pretty much in disbeliefe :(  Tday is my 12DPO & I just tested w/EFRE & it's a BFN.  
I have had 3 very easy pregnancies I was 27, 29 & almost 33.  Took one try (ohh, those were the days:) in between #2 & #3 I had a regular mc @ about 7 weeks, saw HB then bb died.
@ years ago @ just before I turned 38 I started having yucky periods heavier & clotty & a litle more painful & we ttc for maybe 3-4 months a couple of times, so I went to see my OB.  LONG story short ( & some of you may know this already, sorry) But I had an endo cyst in my left ovary that grew fast, my old OB thought it was cancer, but I KNEW it wasn't.  SO I wasn't super concerned as HE was!  
Anyway, we had interrcourse ONCE in August last year on my CD12 & I got pg..we weren't trying, I had been in TONS of pain for months by then from my cyst, & was trying to figure out what to do about it.
ANyway, that ended up a BO @ 7 weeks, in Oct.  So in Nov. I got lap surgery done & they removed my left tube & ovary.
Got pg first try the next month & that one I had a missed mc @ 11 weeks.  Baby was just a few days behind, but growing good. ( I think I mc'd cuz of 22 hours of flying between 5.5-7 weeks along.
I had to have a DnC which I wanted NOTHING to do w/it..my other 2 I mc's naturally & it ws fine.

So here's my delima; I have been on Gonal-F seeing an RE & I am responding GREAT on it, 3 follies each time.  I already mentioned to my RE that "maybe I have scaring" & bb can't implant, or maybe my tube is clogged a little????  He says NOPE.it's you age!  I am NOT buying that cuz from his OWN words, my reserve looks great for being 40 now, he says that from US my follies in my ovary is like one of about 32 year old women.
So I pay out of pocket for him cuz he's not in my group.  BUT I was thinking I should go back to my OB who preformed my lap & DnC & ask to have an HSG test & that other one that the tiny camera goes into your uterus to check for scaring.  
I just NEED TO KNOW!  My hubbys sperm is REALLY good, & I have always gotten pg w/hardly any trying.  I just don't think that "over night" my GOOD eggys just all DIED!

What do you ladies think?  Any advice or experience?  What should I ask for?????

[adgal]

You know Ita, I have a friend with a similar story....her and her DH tried for years to get pregnant and finally conceived twins (boy & girl as well) through IVF.  Just before the twins first birthday, she found out she was pregnant naturally (singleton this time) and just recently gave birth to a healthy baby boy!  So yep, anything can and does happen!  Only you can decide when it is time to stop trying.  I cannot begin to tell you how many thought I was crazy that we wouldn't give up even though we had loss after loss after loss.  Now, here I am 16 weeks with what so far is a healthy pregnancy.  I will deliver at 41, and this baby was also conceived naturally.  So do what your heart tells you, you will know what is right.  

[40smama]

God bless your sil's friend - what a story!  I can't imagine going through that but I'm sure she's up to the challenge & will be okay although she'll be swimming in diapers for a few years - yikes and here I was feeling overwhelmed by a 15 month old.  

I don't mean to be difficult either - i hope you're not insulted by what questions I raise.  I'm worried that someday down the road a woman who's had multiple D&C's will com upon this post & freak out about the possible damage to her uterus.  

One thing my re told me and what I learned from the expert doctor on this forum is that luckily that since the lining of the uterus replaces itself every month (kind of like a man having fresh sperm), it's like a whole fresh enviorment for the fetus to grow.  That made me so happy as I was worried that my uterus was too old to grow a baby but it was just my eggs unfortunately.

I just thought I'd pass this thought along for those who worry about this very thing.

[ita17]

Thanks hun :)  I SOOOOOOO needed this day!  It's been busy & LONG but SOOOO nice!  We went to Newport to my SIL beautiful beach house & hung out for a bit, the we went to the game & my 3 kids got to walk onto the pitch w/the LA Galaxy & the Seattle Sounders teams!  & my 12 & 7 year old were RIGHT NEXT to DAVID BECKHAM!  BOY did THAT make my night, & possibly my week..BFP or NOT!!! LOL He is SOOOOOO CUTE!  He even smiled & gave me a wink cuz I was trying (kinda a freaking out) trying to get my little 7 year old to look @ HIM & to say HI!  & she was all shy & he noticed & was laughing & trying to say hi to her!  It was really cute :)  I got a few pix of him, but it was hard to get a good one!
So anyway, I just need to relax & do what I feel is best for me & our family.  I really don't think I'll be doing any more meds @ this point, I try really hard to do things w/out any meds & as much holistic as possible, (never even been on bc) so for me choosing to do fertility stuff as not been an easy choice.  I really only did it to help speed things up.
Oh, I've been wanting to share this story for a while, doesn't really go w/this thread, but oh well.......
So one of my SIL ( I have 5) has a friend who is in her early 30's & TTC for several years, went to the RE that I am seeing, tried  IUI's then IVF, not sure how many or for how long, but I know it was a while.  Anyway, she finally got pg w/twins, boy & girls :}  Then when the twins were 7 months (they just turned 1 in July) old she GOT PG NATURALLY w/TWINS again!  boy & a girls!  She ttc for over 8 years & NOTHING!   She figured there was NO WAY she could get pg w/out major help!  Now she will have 2 sets of twins that will be less than 16 months APART!  
Sometimes we have to be careful for what we wish for LOL :D

[natalie910]

Have fun at the game and really try to take your mind off of all of this for a little bit. I know I really need to stop focusing too much, it makes me a little crazy at times...lol
Anyway, have fun!

[ita17]

ooops, I meant 20 year old, not 2 year old LOL :)

[ita17]

Well, I'm not the type who just believes everything I read & am told, thats why I am probably not a very good patient for most Dr's.  I also feel that lots of Dr's do what's best for them for $$$.
I do a lot of research myself & ask TONS of questions ( Ican be annoying, if you haven't noticed that all ready!!!)
About age & flying, my acupuncturist explained it to me as, there was most likely nothing wrong w/the baby, but being that I was going on 40, that the egg was older, it's enviroment is older of that of one of lets say a 2 year old, or 32 year old for example, & she said when your over 35 you really need to "baby" yourself more when your pregnant.  Things that would not have harmed a growing fetus when I was lets say 29, might & very possibly can harm that same fetus @ 39.

I'm not asking you to believe me, but this is what I've been told, & to me it makes perfect sense.  We didn't even try naturally (prior to meds) in May becasue we were flying again 20+ hours to St. Thomas, the RE nurse said that I really should just wait, that it wasn't worth it.  I'm sure every RE is different on this, but being that I had a"gut" feeling about it long before knowing or talking to anyone about this, I choose to believe it.

Hope you all have a great day!  I'm off to the beach, then to a Galaxy game (pro soccer)!  Were a HUGE soccer family!!!  Hopefully I'll forgt about all this for a bit!

[40smama]

I don't understand the difference in age - why flying in your mid 30's and your 20's makes a difference.  Actually I flew in my last pregnancy (I was 44) from Washington to Boston - I realize it wasn't a very long flight (4-5 hours) but I did it.  Oh yes, I also had two more shorter flights (each 3 hours) as well.

I really, really want to get more stats about D&C's other than just some internet sites.  I want to see serious scientific proof that they cause up to 20% damage like from a reputable university.  I'm sorry but I just need to have that in order to accept a stat like that.  There are so many women that I know on this forum as well as personally (and myself) who've undergone multiple D&C's and become pregnant both easily and w/ART.  Of course I'm not running a scientific study.

I don't know about the thing about scarring from natural m/c's and just being pregnant.  I'll have to investigate that - I've never heard that before.  I understand the part about just wanting to forget about having another child - it's so hard!  I just wanted to say you have to follow your heart on this one and yes you're right - it is a big trial of faith and patience - I'm a little short of the patience one.

I hope you get your BFP soon - jen

[ita17]

You can google DnC & it says it clearly, to be honest w/you I was very surprised at how hight the % is.  It goes significantly up w/each additional DnC.  Dr's are NOT perfect & they can easily (accidently) hurt the uterus.  Now you can ALSO get scarring w/natural mc's & just having babies.
When you flew in your pregnancies, where you over 35?  I flew a couple times too, but for less than 2 hours & I was in my 20's....big diff from 391/2 & 22 hours.

I was on Gonal-F for 2 cycles @ 150 the whole time & my follies all matured within 7 days of injections....very quickly & in fact the RE was pleasantly surprised @ how well I responded...so he told me anyway.
Last month we did TI, & this month we did 2 IUI's 1 right before O & one right after O.

Part of me wants to just FORGET it all!!!  But I feel very strongly that were supposed to have another baby, & that this is all a BIG trial of our faith & patience. sighhhhhhhhh

[40smama]

I wanted to echo some of amanda's (adgal) words - if D&C's caused up to 20% chance of scarring, they wouldn't be doing this procedure - especially on women in their child-bearing years.  The flying thing - I've flown w/every single one of my pregnancies and I was okay.  You're right - the reasons doctors don't want pregnant women who are in their last months to fly is because risks or premature labor and dehydration.

It's great that you're responding to gonal-f.  I wasn't as fortunate.  It surprised the heck out of me because all of my numbers had come back great (well, for my age) but that's the thing right there - the age factor.  Were you taking gonal-f in preparation for a IVF or IUI cycle?  why gonal-f?  Are you doing a iui or IVF cycle?

I got so sick of the fertility stuff when I was going through it that we adopted this giant schnauzer named Max.  Makes no sense but he saved my sanity during this time.

[ita17]

Thanks for your response!  If I in fact I am not pg this cycle, I'm calling my OB & making an appointment.  
I had no issues w/my DnC BUT I have read that you have over 20% chance of getting scarring w/1 DnC, so I KNOW that is a possibility.
I can't really explain it, but I HONESTLY did not want the DnC, I was practically forced to do it (thats how it felt)  
& about the flying, I had a very long conversation w/my acupuncturist who is specializes in fertility & she says this happens A LOT.  There just isn't any studies on it cuz they can't ask for pregnant women to volunteer in their first trimester to see if they mc.  The amount of radiation that you are exposed to in over 22 hours of flying in a lot.  This RE I am seeing advises STRONGLY against flying before 20 weeks.
I know women fly all the time, this is just what I've been told, & quite ironically I felt the same way about going before I went, but I thought I was just being dramatic!  

Could of would of should of....................
Now I know, & IF i get pg, will not be flying.  & about flying in your later weeks, well my old ob told me it was mostly because they want you to stay close to home in case of premature labor.  + you can really get dehydrated quickly on a plane & that is one main reason why women go into premature labor too.  It just happened to my SIL a few months ago, flew to Hawaii & was in the hospital a day later, then when she got out  & flew back home (AZ) back in the hospital for almost 1 week (she was only 31 weeks) Due to complications of being dehydrated.  SHe made it fine til week 37 & has a beautiful baby girl!
I need to chill out a bit, I just HATE this whole fertility stuff!!!!!!  & the 2 WW :(

[adgal]

I am not sure what can be done if there is scarring. I guess it depends on how bad it is.  I know in some cases it can be lasered off.  However, most of the time it shouldn't impact too much.  What do you think you got the scarring from?  A D&C can cause a little bit, but it is a pretty common procedure and if done properly with no complications shouldn't cause you any trouble.  I have had 2 of them and no trouble so far this pregnancy.  

To check for scarring or a closed or partially closed tube they can do an HSG and a hysteroscopy.  I have had both tests, although in my case it was to get a better look at my uterus and the two fibroids I have.  I am sure if you request it, these tests can be done.  

Also, I don't think it is too likely that flying caused a miscarriage. Millions of women fly while pregnant. It is fine except in the final weeks when most Dr's don't recommend it.  I think it's something to do with the altitude causing labour.  The overwhelming majority of first trimester miscarriages are caused by chromosonal abnormalites.  As we get older, we are more likely to have them.  Both of my D&C's the testing came back normal as well, but the testing just doesn't pick up everything. I wish it did as I would have loved some absolute answers, however sadly they are not always there.  I wish you well in your quest, and there is absolutely nothing wrong with looking for answers.  You do have to be prepared for the possibility you may not get any and I know first hand how difficult that can be.  

[ita17]

Okay.........so I "get" that some of my eggs are OLD, BUT my question is what are the tests that I SHOULD get done?  I'm gonna ask about the HSG, but how & more IMPORTANTLY what can be done if they find scar tissue on my uterus.
My last mc in Feb.  My RE ^ acupuncturist are 99% both sure that the mc was due to radiation from flying for over 22 hours between weeks 5.5-7.  DnC & ALL testing came back perfect.  My Acupuncturist says she see this ALL the time, & it's more common in women over 35 just cuz the new baby is just more I guess you can say sensitive to everything.
Anyway, I know I sound stubborn, & maybe I am but, I just don't see how 6 mature follies in 2 cycles NONE took.  I feel everything happens for a reason, & I really want to know if it is my age....or do I have scarring, or a semi closed tube????

[magnolia55]

I got pregnant 2nd try at age 39, I waited until 41 to start again (my OB had told me to start trying right away because of aging eggs), and a year and a half later, and 2 m/c, we are still trying. She was right. You just can't fight Mother Nature even though everyone on this site is trying. Luckily some are succeeding, but if you read the stories, most people have a story to tell.

[ita17]

Thanks for your reply.  BUT I just have this feeling inside & have since I had the DnC in Feb. that I have scarring from it.  I can't really explain it, but I really didn't feel good about the procedure, but everyone around me including myself figured I was just too hormonal to really make sense.
I just don't think that in a matter of a few months my egg quality just changed that drastic.  My mom had me @ 39, my moms sister had a neice @ 40 & my grnadma had that aunt @ 41...all naturally of course.
I know that statistics show that my age is the reason why, but I don't feel like I'm in denial, but I just think that I need to be more pro- active & that this RE is more about "well your now 40" lets do IVF........(much more $$$ for him!)

[adgal]

Well, I do have to agree with your Dr.  Age really does play a pretty big role in all of this.  Our fertility declines after 35 and again at 40.  We also have a higher rate of miscarriage.  That is not to say it can't and won't happen.  I too get pregnant easily, but it has taken 5 times to get this far.  But it does require more patience on your part.  Chances are you won't get pregnant as easily as you have in the past.  I wish you luck and I hope things work out soon.