Aa
Aa
A
A
A
Close
Avatar universal

PLEASE HELP. Crashing after 2nd dose Naturethroid

I have been suffering from severe PPD for the last year. I was put on 32.5mg naturethroid in February and for one week my life completely turned around. I felt like I was meeting my new baby daughter for the first time and that my 2yr old son had his mommy back. It was AMAZING AMAZING AMAZING. Then my dr switched me to another bioidentical because we thought my daughter was having a reaction to the naturethroid since she had an aversion to pork and I was nursing. I had a horrible reaction and switched back the next day to naturthroid but things have never been the same since.

First my dr. doubled it and things got a little better then bad again. Now I am on 65mg twice a day and after the 2nd dose I crash like nothing I've ever experienced. :( I can't function. I feel sick and weak and emotionally and physically incapable of doing anything. It doesn't happen every day, but it does happen most days. Can someone here please please help me understand what is going on. I am not the mother or wife that I was a year ago. My heart is broken. I feel tremendous guilt every single day. I was such a good mommy before my daughter was born and now I am just completely broken. I am lost and I feel hopeless. I have another Dr appt on the 19th and want to go into that appointment able to understand my results and to be an advocate for myself. I feel that it is critical that I actively participate in my treatment since I am the only one who can truly understand exactly what my symptoms are. Please please help me if you can. I don't know where to start. Thanks in advance for any help that you can offer me.
26 Responses
Sort by: Helpful Oldest Newest
Avatar universal
I agree. Thank you! Took it at 1pm. Feeling ok so far, maybe a little edgy, but no crash or sick feeling so far. If everything goes ok I'll try it again tomorrow.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
It isn't necessary for the doses to be 6 hrs apart... I never take my second dose of T3 after about 1:00 PM, but of course, it depends on your schedule.  The most important thing is to be as consistent as possible... Flopping your schedule around, keeps your body on a roller coaster and doesn't ever let you get used to anything.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
The range is 2.0-4.4. Those are good questions that he didn't mention…or if he did, I don't remember. I'm going to email him about when to take everything now! Thank you!! I woke up late today and took my first dose at 9am. I desperately needed the extra sleep. So I'm thinking I probably need to take the 2nd dose around 2pm instead of 12pm since they will be 6hrs apart…or maybe 1.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Okay, I had to go back and re-read the entire thread, so I could get back on track, because things got a bit fragmented with different things going on...

What was the reference range for the Free T3 done in Sept 2015?  Ranges vary lab to lab or even labs change their ranges sometimes, so you always have to post ranges with results...

If you're getting your new script filled on Monday, you'll begin taking the 75 mcg levo first thing Tues morning... when did your doctor advise you to take the liothyronine?  Did he advise you take it all at once or to split it into more than one dose?  
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
HI Barb,

He did order a Free T3 in September. It was a 2.6. I mentioned it above. I didn't realize it initially which is why I didn't post it. I can't get my prescription filled until Monday afternoon so I can't start the new meds until Tuesday. I am going to try your advice and take the 2nd dose at 12pm tomorrow. If I get sick, I will try 1/2 at 12pm on Monday and see if there is any difference before I start the new regimen. He put me on a specific B complex that is best absorbed by MTHFR patients. He upped my vitamin D. My iron is low, but he said that taking iron will feed the EBV that I have so not to take it. I take magnesium and do ok with it probably because the progesterone I take constipates me. I hope that's not TMI.

He didn't mention Hashimotos, just the lupus. He did order the most of the blood work you mentioned:

Test                                   Result           Range
TPO                                   7                  0-34
ANA Direct                         Positive
Thyroglobulin, Antibody <1.0               0.0-0.9 IU/mL

Thanks again for everything. Feeling pretty hopeless tonight.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Your doctor didn't order a Free T3 for the last blood test (Sept 2015), so you don't know whether it's low or not... Just because it was low in Feb doesn't mean it was in  Sept - that was a period of 7 months and you'd had your dosage doubled... That's where the importance of, both, Free T3 and Free T4 comes in on "every" set of blood work...

Thyroid antibodies would be Thyroid Peroxidase Antibodies (TPOab) and Thyroglobulin (TgAb) to determine if you have Hashimoto's... Most doctors would order an Anti-nuclear Antibodies test (ANA), Rheumatoid Factor (RF), along with others.   An ANA would certainly be done if a doctor were looking at Lupus or something like that.  

I agree with vino that there are some vitamin deficiencies that can cause certain symptoms and some vitamins can help with stress levels, etc, however, simply taking any type of these vitamins/minerals can get you into trouble... For instance, as vino mentioned, magnesium causing lose bm... if you get the right kind, it, typically, won't do that.  Vitamin B6 can cause some people to have very vivid dreams (personally, it causes me to have outright nightmares, so I have to be very careful to avoid supplements that have B6 in them). Some forms of vitamins/minerals are "body ready" which means they are absorbed much easier; others have to be converted to a form the body can use.  It's necessary to research each one you plan to take and make sure you get the one that will work best for you.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
That makes sense. All of it…the threadjacking and the medicine info. He asked if anyone had mentioned Lupus to me before but didn't get into it more than that. I can't even begin to tell you how tired I am so my brain wasn't firing fast enough to ask enough questions about everything on his list.

What would be a name of an autoimmune antibody test that I could look for in my results? I can look this up too when I have more time and get back to you. Question for you…you said that I am getting too much T3 with Naturethroid, but my T3 is low…how does that work?
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
In regards to adrenal issues. Because of my ongoing untreated thyroid problem after so many years, I did start to feel much worse. After consulting " dr google" I figured I must have some adrenal fatigue and read a book on that.(Adrenal Fatigue, the 21st Century Stress Syndrome) Very helpful and it was like someone had written about my symptoms in it. It goes on about what stressful things we have in our lives to eliminate if we can and  a list of vitamins to help recuperate adrenals. I started last year in Spring  with the vitamins and about 6 ms later some  things have  improved. Vitamin C time release, vit E 800iu, Pantothenic Acid(B5 ) 1500mg per day, Niacin25-50 mg a day, B6 50 -100 mg a day, or B -complex of 50-100 mg of B6, 75-125mg of B3 200-400 of B12, Magnesium 400 mg after 8 pm. There are other things he mentioned but the above mentioned I've used not as high amounts. Also eat more meat than before and  more protein overall with every meal. When I went to the doctor my 24hr saliva test for cortisol output was within normal. My doctor said that the Thyroid and Adrenals are like the scale of a balance, if one is too low the other will compensate and can  be high,  and obviously  we need them even.  Get the adrenal help you need if he won't help maybe a naturopath may be more helpful. There are some formulations for adrenal support from Pure Encapsulations of Thorne brand. By the time I found out about these, had done ok with my "system" . Once I was able to tolerate normal stressful situations and not feel stressed I've lowered the amounts I take of the vitamins to normal. He says to increase Vitamin C, Magnesium and  Pantothenic Acid in stressful times. Those get depleted out of our bodies faster when we're stressed. I use a powder form of Vitamin C and add to my water few times a day about 2500 mg. I don't want to use more, it makes my hormone replacement less potent. It takes time to build tolerance to higher amounts of Vit C, and sometimes Magnesium. It makes you have loose bm. Also Vit C and E thins out the blood, it is a thing to know for people on blood thinner meds.  There are supplements to take for MTHFR mutations to help with methylation. I didn't test positive for the few he did, he said most people have the mutation nowadays.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Many people look at Armour or NatureThroid, etc as "natural", but really, it's not all that natural... Those meds come from pigs which make a whole lot more T3 than humans do, so that's not "natural" for us.  It's true that some people really do much better on desiccated hormones, because they need that much T3, but many of us don't.  There are plenty of us that do just fine on synthetics and when it comes down to it, synthetics are much easier to adjust, because they can be adjusted individually, whereas, with desiccated hormones, you get what you get.

Your doctor didn't just add a T3 med to your afternoon dose, because desiccated hormones (NatureThroid) already has T3 in it and that's what's making you crash - you're getting too much.  By switching you to the levo (T4) and liothyronine (T3), each be adjusted as needed without disrupting the other.

What antibody tests have been done to determine an autoimmune condition?  If it's a thyroid autoimmune, it's certainly something to worry about "right now"...  

I understand that you like to get information from others, which is great, because others have good things to say, as well, and don't mind your thread being high-jacked, however, when there are 2 people posting certain information on the same thread, it gets confusing as to who responses are for and what advice is being given to which person... It might not be good for one person to take advice meant for someone else... lol
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Hi, at this point is almost 4 weeks on Synthroid 150mcg and 2 weeks generic Cytomel 10 mcg (5 mcg morning and 5 around 12:30).  Overall I feel much better with this combo, is not "it" for me yet. I was feeling sleepy like a zombie all the time before, I was so afraid to drive, when I would get one of those bad crashes, I would turn the AC on so high....
I was afraid to switch but I figured I couldn't feel any worse than I did, so I had to try it to see. I never had palpitations with any of the meds I've tried, always felt sleepier...  It seems people either get palpitations or feel more tired when getting on a thyroid med or higher dose, until the body gets adjusted.  With Synthroid my doctor told me to take 100 mcg in the morning and 50 in the afternoon. I asked him why and he said not to have chest pain. In the first week I did have some headache and fews times  hint of chest pain.  At this point I can tolerate the whole dose at once but I want to confirm it with him first before I  make the change. I transitioned quite easily I think. I still have some water retention issues, and not feeling much energy. I will have blood work next week and follow up appt after that.  My pulse is better and my daily temperature readings are ok.  Based on how I feel, I think another 10mcg of Cytomel is in order,  will see.  I was on 3 grain NT before,(not that was doing anything for me) my math may not be correct, but I don't think that's  equivalent, I think is less. But since is new medication, maybe less was the way to start. I was so happy when my doctor started me on Armour and NT, especially after reading here how hard other people have it  with their doctors.  Since my body is not "accepting" it, I have to try whatever will make me feel better. It's been a long time since I felt alive. I got married at 17 and had my first child right away, then the second one 8 yrs later. My youngest is 13 now, if I would have had to deal with little ones I would have been dead. I have to work, and I do part time. I hope this journey will work out for me. A sign in a store read: Life is meant to be enjoyed, not endured. I got tears in my eyes because that's how I felt.  Hoping for better days!
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
I just re-read your post. Thank you for commenting. So you are glad that you switched? He wants to switch me to a levothyroxine and liothyronine combination. I'm very nervous and very hesitant because I don't want to go backwards at all. I can't …for my kids.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Barb135, You are wonderful and I can't tell you how much I appreciate the time you are taking to write these words. I wish there was a way that I could repay you! I've seen 3 different Dr.s and this newest one is the most thorough. I guess he did test for T3 in Sept. It was 2.6. It showed up weird on my report and I'm not used to looking for it that way. He said that it is too low but since I was crashing on the second dose he wants to change the whole approach and put me on 75mcg of levothyroxine and 7.5mcg liothyronine. I'm not really comfortable with switching medications. For several reasons …because I prefer a more natural approach, because naturethroid really helped me at first and I do feel a little bit better for a little while after I take it (couple of hrs), and because I've heard and read so many crappy stories about the synthetic approach. He says my adrenals can't handle the 2nd dose and that's why I'm crashing. I'm working on an adrenal plan, but I know that it will take time for that part. He also told me that I have two mutations of the MTHFR and tested positive for an autoimmune - but he says it could be nothing to worry about right now. He said we have enough to work on right now.

I was wondering why he didn't just add some T3 instead of completely switching me. I didn't think of the question until I left. I plan to email him, but I wondered what your thoughts are. I am reading and reading and reading all that I can online but it feels incredibly overwhelming and your guidance is really helping me navigate better. I am so sorry you weren't feeling well! I hope you're feeling a lot better today. Hugs!!

P.S. I don't mind my thread being 'hijacked'. I love info and want to help others and be helped at the same time.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
There's a new format on MH that's not real easy to navigate until you get used to it.  Try logging out and log back in and see what happens.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Thanks for your reply, something is off with my computer I don't see the page like before , I do see the name of the person posting but not to whom is addressed. I keep refreshing the page, sometimes it looks normal. I got the same look on ipad too, don't know if is a mac thing. I've learned quite a lot from reading some of your replies from 6yrs ago.  Thanks again for all your wisdom and time dedication to help people! I am very grateful to you and the others for  being here.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Yes, my last post was addressed to you... I will look forward to seeing your new labs when you get the results and can post them.

We're all different, so a change a med will affect us each differently, so in that case, there is no tried and true time frame... When we get close to our optimal dose, tweaking the med(s) can become a "fine art".  I learned a lot of ways to do that, and will gladly help you through it.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Hi Barb, I'm assuming last post was referred to me. I will have labs in a week and I will post on my thread that I have started. The question in regards to changing meds was more of general information since I've never come across that information on all my reading here. I also want to say that I really appreciate all your hard work here, helping everybody!
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Patience is a virtue with treating thyroid... for most of us a month is not nearly long enough to be on a dose/medication, because it takes 4-6 weeks for the T4 med to reach full potential in your blood, then your body still has to get well, after that... That's not to say you might not need a tweak though...

You should be having labs at the 6 week mark to see where you are and that should tell you whether you need to make an adjustment or not.  So as not high jack SMCat's thread and get the 2 of you confused, it would be better to add new labs to your own thread, when you get them.  If you aren't scheduled for new labs, soon, you should talk to your doctor and insist that it be done at 6 weeks to make sure you're getting where need to be.  While the labs are not the be all, end all, they will help determine what steps to take next.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Sorry I haven't responded; I've been ill and haven't been on much the past couple of days...

Rule of thumb (where most of us feel best) is for FT4 to be about mid range and FT3 to be in the upper half to upper third of its range.  In your latest (Sept 15) labs, your FT4 is only at 42% of its range.  There is no FT3, so we don't have any idea where that is.  

A raw result for rT3 is not useful... Your doctor should have ordered a Free T3 at the same time so an FT3:rT3 ratio could be calculated.  

Further more, any doctor who is prescribing a patient a medication with T3 in it and not ordering Free T3 every time labs are done, clearly is not a good thyroid doctor; nor is one who is doubling the dosage, rather than titrating up slowly...

In your labs of Feb 2015, your FT4 was at 46%, which is much closer to the recommended 50%, but your FT3 was only at 21%... Whatever medication you had been on before that, only required the addition of some T3 vs completely changing your entire regimen and putting on into this tailspin of doubling your dose with every change... That's crazy...

The first thing you need to do is try to get a new set of labs because the ones in Feb are already outdated... since your doctor doubled your dose since then, you have no idea what your levels are.  

Be sure you do NOT take your medication the morning of the blood draw or you will have false high Free T3... You don't need to do rT3 again.

Just for your information, every time you are actively adjusting medication dosages, levels should be tested every 6 weeks and you should insist on Free T3 and Free T4 every time.  

Since you're crashing after the afternoon dosage, I might suggest that you discuss with your doctor about cutting that one in half.  I don't recommend not taking any, because the T3 is fast acting and what you took in the morning will be out of your system, and you could crash the other way by night time.  I might also suggest that you take the second dose closer to noon vs waiting until 2:00 PM... many of us find that taking a dose too late in the day also causes issues.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Thanks for your reply vino. I have tried synthroid in the past but it didn't help much and gave me heart palpitations. I am not excited about it, but I'm willing to try again. I'm afraid of getting worse if I switch. I can't go back to the way I was. I'm by no means the mom I was a year ago (happy, energetic, joyful etc..) but I'm not experiencing the level of rage that I was before my naturethroid was doubled. It just seems like now I can't go any higher without these debilitating side effects…but I'm not getting where I need to be on this dose so I guess I just need to talk to my dr about all of this monday.
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Hi, just wanted to say that I had the same symptoms as you describe in your third post, when I was first put on Armour. After a month was feeling much worse, got switched to NatureThroid, and felt much better, how ever didn't get better in time;  the "crash" was an ongoing thing for me, I was practically a functioning zombie. I was feeling sleepy most of the time and really lows at random times through out the day. After 6 ms on NT(3grain) my labs didn't improve much, I was switched to Synthroid/Cytomel about a month ago(due to resistance supposedly). I'm feeling much better now, but not optimal yet. I still have lows but are not debilitating as before, do see small improvements every day, not a big wow effect. Have you tried a different medication before? And a question for Barb, how long do you think is a fair amount of time to give a medication a good try before trying another?
Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Yes. It should be Sept 2015, hence the brain fog and exhaustion. I tried to call my dr for the test that was in between feb and sept but they never got back to me today.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
Okay, wait a minute... the test that's labeled Sept 2014... should that really be Sept 2015? or are there more test results you could post?  

Helpful - 0
Avatar universal
Hi Barb,

Thank you again for helping me through some of this. I was tested after I began the 32.5mg Naturethroid and my numbers had gotten worse. They doubled the naturethroid and then I was tested again a few months later in sept 2015 as listed above and the numbers got worse again.
Helpful - 0
649848 tn?1534633700
COMMUNITY LEADER
I'm sorry I just saw your response to my questions...

Are the February labs the last ones you had done? You were only prescribed 32.5 mg NatureThroid at that time, then your dosage was doubled; were there no tests done when the dosage was doubled?

Then your dosage was doubled again? How long have you been on  the 65 mg twice/day?  Were you prescribed that dosage without further testing to see if you needed if you needed that high a dosage?

It looks like you need to insist on new tests to be done for Free T3 and Free T4 to see what your actual levels are.  Be sure you have the blood draw as early in the morning as possible and don't take any thyroid medication prior to the blood draw or you will get false high readings...

Right off hand, I'm going to have to wonder if you're over medicated with the NatureThroid, since you, apparently, had your dosage doubled twice with no testing prior to dosage changes to determine what you might need...

Once you've had a dosage change, you should be tested in 6 weeks for Free T3 and Free T4 to make sure the medication is having the desired effect.  And as long as medication is being actively adjusted, you should be tested at 6 week intervals.  If your doctor isn't willing to do this, you should think about finding a different one.
Helpful - 0
2
Have an Answer?

You are reading content posted in the Thyroid Disorders Community

Top Thyroid Answerers
649848 tn?1534633700
FL
Avatar universal
MI
1756321 tn?1547095325
Queensland, Australia
Learn About Top Answerers
Didn't find the answer you were looking for?
Ask a question
Popular Resources
We tapped the CDC for information on what you need to know about radiation exposure
Endocrinologist Mark Lupo, MD, answers 10 questions about thyroid disorders and how to treat them
A list of national and international resources and hotlines to help connect you to needed health and medical services.
Herpes sores blister, then burst, scab and heal.
Herpes spreads by oral, vaginal and anal sex.
STIs are the most common cause of genital sores.