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Reverse T3 and Synthyroid
Will taking Synthyroid cause my Reverse T3 to go even higher inside of to the FT3 where it's needed?
I have Hashi's. The whole Reverse T3 situation confuses me.
6/5/2014
TSH 2.73 (.55-4.78) dr does believe it should be 2-2.50
Free T3 2.9 (2.3-4.2)
Free T4 1.35 (.89-1.76)
Reverse T3 24 (9.2-24.1)
TPOab 992.40 (<60)
Thanks
I have Hashi's. The whole Reverse T3 situation confuses me.
6/5/2014
TSH 2.73 (.55-4.78) dr does believe it should be 2-2.50
Free T3 2.9 (2.3-4.2)
Free T4 1.35 (.89-1.76)
Reverse T3 24 (9.2-24.1)
TPOab 992.40 (<60)
Thanks
It just won't take the equal or less signs so
less than 1.3 suggest hypothyroidism
Between 1.3-3.0 suggest euthyroidism
Greater than 3.0 suggest hyperthyroidism
Hope this works
Thanks
less than 1.3 suggest hypothyroidism
Between 1.3-3.0 suggest euthyroidism
Greater than 3.0 suggest hyperthyroidism
Hope this works
Thanks
The reference range for the Free Thyroxine Index (Whatever it means)
Females
3.0 suggest hyperthyrodism
Females
3.0 suggest hyperthyrodism
Update on follow up tests- She did the tests I requested and throw in a thyroid panel since I asked and was curious.
These were drawn on 7/29/2014
UIBC 251.4 (155.0-355.0)
Iron Binding Cap, Total 309.4 (350.0-450.0)
Iron Saturation % 18.7 (20.0-50.0) L
Transferrin 247 (203-362)
Ferritin 210.9 (10-322)
Iron 58.0 (50.0-212.0)
So the iron is back in normal range but still a bit low. I have not taken any supplements.
Thyroid- 7/29 6/5 (Both are the same ref ranges)
TSH 2.23 (.55-4.78) 2.73
FT4 1.20 (.89-1.76) 1.35
FT3 2.9 (2.3-4.2) 2.9
T4 8.9 (4.5-12.0) 8.9
T3 94.9 (60-181) Not done
T3 Uptake 32.3 (22.5-37.0 %) 25.7
Free Thyroxine Index 2.9 % 2.3%
Females
3.0 suggests hyperthyroidism
Sill haven't started the Synthyroid. Don't know what most those tests mean but my symptoms are still all over the place but the biggest one is no energy but have a hard time napping. Or much interest in doing anything. My appetite isn't great. No palps, tremors or weight loss or gain. The same 5 lbs comes & goes. And the internal tremors, especially in my legs, is driving me nuts. The brain fog comes and goes.
Guess it's time to start the Synthyroid and see how it goes.
Thoughts appreciated.
These were drawn on 7/29/2014
UIBC 251.4 (155.0-355.0)
Iron Binding Cap, Total 309.4 (350.0-450.0)
Iron Saturation % 18.7 (20.0-50.0) L
Transferrin 247 (203-362)
Ferritin 210.9 (10-322)
Iron 58.0 (50.0-212.0)
So the iron is back in normal range but still a bit low. I have not taken any supplements.
Thyroid- 7/29 6/5 (Both are the same ref ranges)
TSH 2.23 (.55-4.78) 2.73
FT4 1.20 (.89-1.76) 1.35
FT3 2.9 (2.3-4.2) 2.9
T4 8.9 (4.5-12.0) 8.9
T3 94.9 (60-181) Not done
T3 Uptake 32.3 (22.5-37.0 %) 25.7
Free Thyroxine Index 2.9 % 2.3%
Females
3.0 suggests hyperthyroidism
Sill haven't started the Synthyroid. Don't know what most those tests mean but my symptoms are still all over the place but the biggest one is no energy but have a hard time napping. Or much interest in doing anything. My appetite isn't great. No palps, tremors or weight loss or gain. The same 5 lbs comes & goes. And the internal tremors, especially in my legs, is driving me nuts. The brain fog comes and goes.
Guess it's time to start the Synthyroid and see how it goes.
Thoughts appreciated.
Yes, we do buy iodized salt in the house. I started using non-iodized sea salt because my sodium level was slightly low and my then dr told me to use that because it will raise my sodium level better. It didn't. I'm not a big salt user but guess I'll go back to using regular salt.
Plus no signs of goiter or nodules and my random iodine was about the same 2 years ago.
I'm just so sick of taking all these supplements she wants but I have no idea if they're helpful or not. Or if I'm just flushing money down the toliet, so to speak.
Vitamins I know I need I will and do take, no matter what.
Thanks
Plus no signs of goiter or nodules and my random iodine was about the same 2 years ago.
I'm just so sick of taking all these supplements she wants but I have no idea if they're helpful or not. Or if I'm just flushing money down the toliet, so to speak.
Vitamins I know I need I will and do take, no matter what.
Thanks
http://www.thyroid.org/iodine-deficiency/
This lists 50-99 as "mild deficiency", and since you're closer to the low end of that, bordering on moderate deficiency. Iodine can be contraindicated in some people with Hashi's as it can exacerbated the autoimmune response. Vitamin C does appear to be in trouble. Why you aren't absorbing that from your good diet, I don't know. So much of nutrition is interdependent, i.e. foods rich in a vitamin, for example, may contain trace amounts of other substances that, in effect, supercharge it, which may be why getting your nutrients from food is often much better than from supplements.
In one respect, the most telling thing is that your FT4 is right where it should be, indicating that your thyroid is getting enough iodine to make T4. Once T4 is made, no further iodine is needed...T4 is converted to T3 by stripping off one of the iodine atoms. Beyond the thyroid, deficiency of iodine is not going to impede the conversion process or transport into cells.
I think of thyroid supplement as iffy, but I doubt there's any harm in trying.
You're probably aware, but just in case...you do have to buy iodized salt. Iodine doesn't occur naturally in salt, it's added specifically to reduce the incidence of goiter (caused by lack of iodine).
Iodine deficiency used to be (before the 1930s) the leading cause of hypo (goiter) in the world. Certain areas of the U.S. were notorious for it. Adding iodine to salt pretty much eliminated it as a cause. We know you have Hashi's, so even if you are a little iodine deficient, taking iodine is not going to cure your Hashi's. I see iodine as more something to explore if you are hypo (lower FT4 than yours), have low to no antibodies, and are looking for the cause of your hypo, which could be correctable.
This lists 50-99 as "mild deficiency", and since you're closer to the low end of that, bordering on moderate deficiency. Iodine can be contraindicated in some people with Hashi's as it can exacerbated the autoimmune response. Vitamin C does appear to be in trouble. Why you aren't absorbing that from your good diet, I don't know. So much of nutrition is interdependent, i.e. foods rich in a vitamin, for example, may contain trace amounts of other substances that, in effect, supercharge it, which may be why getting your nutrients from food is often much better than from supplements.
In one respect, the most telling thing is that your FT4 is right where it should be, indicating that your thyroid is getting enough iodine to make T4. Once T4 is made, no further iodine is needed...T4 is converted to T3 by stripping off one of the iodine atoms. Beyond the thyroid, deficiency of iodine is not going to impede the conversion process or transport into cells.
I think of thyroid supplement as iffy, but I doubt there's any harm in trying.
You're probably aware, but just in case...you do have to buy iodized salt. Iodine doesn't occur naturally in salt, it's added specifically to reduce the incidence of goiter (caused by lack of iodine).
Iodine deficiency used to be (before the 1930s) the leading cause of hypo (goiter) in the world. Certain areas of the U.S. were notorious for it. Adding iodine to salt pretty much eliminated it as a cause. We know you have Hashi's, so even if you are a little iodine deficient, taking iodine is not going to cure your Hashi's. I see iodine as more something to explore if you are hypo (lower FT4 than yours), have low to no antibodies, and are looking for the cause of your hypo, which could be correctable.
Howdy,
An update on recent test.
My ultrasound showed some slight changes in sizes from 2012 but still deemed normal. No nodules or enlargement.
Idione, Urine (Random) 57.4 (28-544) Is this consider too low?
Vitamin C 0.00 (0.2-2.0) ????
All others were well within normal ranges including the Celiac-negative but they didn't do one Celiac test that she wanted so now she doesn't like my lab-tough. It's in my network..
She wants to start me on a idione supplement as well as a Thyroid Support supplement.I just sort of skipped over that for now. Plus 1500 mg of Viamin C and Iron. It was a phone call and she was talking about so many things. I just kept making my point about the Iron panel and the malaborption issues. So who knows if what I'm taking is doing any good. .And she said she would test what I requested.
I told her all these supplements are not agreeing with my system and aked her why when I eat a healthy diet full of all these vitamins and nutrients why am I not absording them, she didn't really answer.
I outright refused the iron until we see a full iron panel.
I don't appear to have scury (sp) symptoms but I will take Vitamin C and up my intake of foods high in iron and Vitamin C.
So my point being, don't I have enough Idione? And isn't it not advised for Hashi's?
Also aren't Thyroid supplement kind of iffy?
I don't use alot of salt but I guess I will start. And last time I ate shellfish which I love, I felt awful. Maybe I'll try it again. Not allergic type reaction and I tested not allergic either afterwards.
Thanks
An update on recent test.
My ultrasound showed some slight changes in sizes from 2012 but still deemed normal. No nodules or enlargement.
Idione, Urine (Random) 57.4 (28-544) Is this consider too low?
Vitamin C 0.00 (0.2-2.0) ????
All others were well within normal ranges including the Celiac-negative but they didn't do one Celiac test that she wanted so now she doesn't like my lab-tough. It's in my network..
She wants to start me on a idione supplement as well as a Thyroid Support supplement.I just sort of skipped over that for now. Plus 1500 mg of Viamin C and Iron. It was a phone call and she was talking about so many things. I just kept making my point about the Iron panel and the malaborption issues. So who knows if what I'm taking is doing any good. .And she said she would test what I requested.
I told her all these supplements are not agreeing with my system and aked her why when I eat a healthy diet full of all these vitamins and nutrients why am I not absording them, she didn't really answer.
I outright refused the iron until we see a full iron panel.
I don't appear to have scury (sp) symptoms but I will take Vitamin C and up my intake of foods high in iron and Vitamin C.
So my point being, don't I have enough Idione? And isn't it not advised for Hashi's?
Also aren't Thyroid supplement kind of iffy?
I don't use alot of salt but I guess I will start. And last time I ate shellfish which I love, I felt awful. Maybe I'll try it again. Not allergic type reaction and I tested not allergic either afterwards.
Thanks
I had a bit of a struggle, too. The first year on meds was pretty rough because I have a pituitary issue, which we didn't know about for a while. So, my TSH hovers permanently around 20.0, and my doctors just wanted to push more and more meds on me. I finally said enough!, and that's how I got to this forum.
It takes some time, but you'll get there.
It takes some time, but you'll get there.
Yes, not everyday but more lately. And I'm glad for you,too. The only part she doesn't tell if there was a struggle to get there like so many have.
Yes, I do watch the reference ranges of all my tests, and do pay attention when they get too low or too high.
Thanks
Yes, I do watch the reference ranges of all my tests, and do pay attention when they get too low or too high.
Thanks
I agree with you...if there's no deficiency, why take something? However, you do have to bear in mind that some of the vitamin and mineral reference ranges are as flawed as thyroid reference ranges, so just being at the bottom of the range often isn't sufficient. For example, the lower limit of the D range (usually @ 30) can be a joke if you're also hypothyroid.
She may very well be doing well on Synthroid. I take T4 only, and I'm doing well, too. How much all the supplements add to that, I have no idea.
As long as you're feeling better...that's all that counts.
She may very well be doing well on Synthroid. I take T4 only, and I'm doing well, too. How much all the supplements add to that, I have no idea.
As long as you're feeling better...that's all that counts.
Magneuium, Omega-3, CoQ10, low dose aspirin and an chinese herbal supplement that's supposed to be for my adernals. It's got 10 different herbs in it. That she sold me. The others I refused to buy from her. I also take Xanax 1 mg 3 times a day as needed for GAD and Metoprolol 25 mg once a day. Orginally for a rapid pulse.( different dr) Now it's fine. BP good
I still haven't started the Synthyroid. Too many other things that could be causing these symptoms and why waste good medicine if it might not help.
She does want me to take others but I refused. Like a super vitamin and Omega-10 (which tested fine) And I do eat fish and a pretty healthy varied diet. I made it clear to her that unless I was deficient, I wouldn't take it.
She is a Intergerated Meidicine as well as family medicine but likes to focus on the Intergerated part. Only seen her twice but she is good at calling in the evening to answer questions and discuss things.
She does want me do a micronutrient test but I refused. It's way to expensive.
She is hypothyriod herself (cancer) and doing well on Synthyroid as well as all these supplements, so she tells me.
The bloodwork pending are Vitamins A,C,E,B2,B3,B6,Zinc. Plus prealbuim because I did have a high Total protein, a cealic panel and fasting insulin (I requested that because my fasting glucose is often too low). And urine idione. I don't object to these. Also have very high folic acid. Just the omission of the full iron panel. I wish she had told me ahead of time what she was ordering and I would have asked her for the full panel.
I've never had an issue with any of my iron, ferritin, etc before.
At least these are all covered by my insurance and I wouldn't have had the blood drawn again. I'm a hard draw-usually out of the top of feet. The techs don't really like to see me coming-lol.
I know I wouldn't see her again until she orders these tests and gets all the results. She is out of pocket and not cheap.
But on the plus side I seem to having more good days recently.
I still haven't started the Synthyroid. Too many other things that could be causing these symptoms and why waste good medicine if it might not help.
She does want me to take others but I refused. Like a super vitamin and Omega-10 (which tested fine) And I do eat fish and a pretty healthy varied diet. I made it clear to her that unless I was deficient, I wouldn't take it.
She is a Intergerated Meidicine as well as family medicine but likes to focus on the Intergerated part. Only seen her twice but she is good at calling in the evening to answer questions and discuss things.
She does want me do a micronutrient test but I refused. It's way to expensive.
She is hypothyriod herself (cancer) and doing well on Synthyroid as well as all these supplements, so she tells me.
The bloodwork pending are Vitamins A,C,E,B2,B3,B6,Zinc. Plus prealbuim because I did have a high Total protein, a cealic panel and fasting insulin (I requested that because my fasting glucose is often too low). And urine idione. I don't object to these. Also have very high folic acid. Just the omission of the full iron panel. I wish she had told me ahead of time what she was ordering and I would have asked her for the full panel.
I've never had an issue with any of my iron, ferritin, etc before.
At least these are all covered by my insurance and I wouldn't have had the blood drawn again. I'm a hard draw-usually out of the top of feet. The techs don't really like to see me coming-lol.
I know I wouldn't see her again until she orders these tests and gets all the results. She is out of pocket and not cheap.
But on the plus side I seem to having more good days recently.
The selenium looks good.
Your iron is very low. It's too bad she didn't test ferritin. Iron deficiency can cause many of the same symptoms as hypo. If enough ferritin isn't present, thyroid hormones can't get into cells.
I'm sorry you feel so lost and confused. What kind of a doctor are you seeing? I think some of this microanalysis of micronutrients can become very overwhelming. If to have enough tests, you're eventually going to find something "off", which may or may not be significant. It's ferritin that's the most important when it comes to metabolizing thyroid hormones, so why would she just test iron, without a complete panel?
I know you're supplementing D and taking a probiotics. What else are you taking?
Your iron is very low. It's too bad she didn't test ferritin. Iron deficiency can cause many of the same symptoms as hypo. If enough ferritin isn't present, thyroid hormones can't get into cells.
I'm sorry you feel so lost and confused. What kind of a doctor are you seeing? I think some of this microanalysis of micronutrients can become very overwhelming. If to have enough tests, you're eventually going to find something "off", which may or may not be significant. It's ferritin that's the most important when it comes to metabolizing thyroid hormones, so why would she just test iron, without a complete panel?
I know you're supplementing D and taking a probiotics. What else are you taking?
Actually she did
Selenium 161 (79-326)
That was one supplement she didn't recommend I go on, at least not yet.
Also just got some recent test result in my portal and my iron is low, too.
Iron 39 (50-175)
The others are still pending according to the results sheet.
I'm am a meat eater.
She didn't do a full iron panel which I'm a bit annoyed about since I haven't had a complete panel in about a year. My HGB & HCT from the month before was all in the good range.
She's not back from a conference until later in the week so I guess it more blood work before I start taking iron pills since there's got to be a reason for it. Doesn't appear to be anemia and I am post-menopausal.
I am so lost and confused.
Selenium 161 (79-326)
That was one supplement she didn't recommend I go on, at least not yet.
Also just got some recent test result in my portal and my iron is low, too.
Iron 39 (50-175)
The others are still pending according to the results sheet.
I'm am a meat eater.
She didn't do a full iron panel which I'm a bit annoyed about since I haven't had a complete panel in about a year. My HGB & HCT from the month before was all in the good range.
She's not back from a conference until later in the week so I guess it more blood work before I start taking iron pills since there's got to be a reason for it. Doesn't appear to be anemia and I am post-menopausal.
I am so lost and confused.
Some conversion happens in the liver, but a lot of it happens where it's actually needed, in the cells that are demanding it.
That's good on the 50,000 IU of D per week. That seems to be the dose that many doctors start at until levels start to rise a bit, then it's gradually tapered off.
I'm not certain about D, but it's logical that if you have trouble digesting fat, and D is dissolved in fat, then you might have trouble digesting it. Perhaps your doctor would try injectable, avoiding the gut entirely?
She didn't test selenium as part of your vitamin/mineral panel by and chance, did she?
That's good on the 50,000 IU of D per week. That seems to be the dose that many doctors start at until levels start to rise a bit, then it's gradually tapered off.
I'm not certain about D, but it's logical that if you have trouble digesting fat, and D is dissolved in fat, then you might have trouble digesting it. Perhaps your doctor would try injectable, avoiding the gut entirely?
She didn't test selenium as part of your vitamin/mineral panel by and chance, did she?
Hi,
Finally spoke to the dr and she said she wants to see how I react to the Synthroid before she adds some T3 medicine.
However, as I've been reading the liver is where all this happens and some issues have peaked my interest.
I am unable to aborb fats or anything oily, Even good oils like olive, coconut or a simple dressing with oil in it. It causes most of that meal to go right thru me almost immediately. If I understand it right, this process involves the liver. (I even get it sometimes with Omega-3 gelcaps) This has only been happening over the last few years, not a lifetime issue.
My liver function tests are all fine.
She wants to take 50,000 iu once a week. When I questioned her about this she said just do the Vitamins and she'll test my fat aborption later.
And continue the Ultra Probiotic that makes me feel bad and all the other pills she has me on.
I'm also, I think, lactose intolerate but now I have my doubts about that and it was the fats I was reacting to.
The most recent bloodwork was a lot of vitamin testing and a celic panel. I think she's determined to prove this. I already tested negative and my blood work allergy panel came back negative to everything they tested. Also went gluten free with no change.
I also have the MTHFR (double) so I don't appear to using my 800 of B12, effectly. So much going on especially if my liver isn't working right.
Could this affect my ability to absorb Vitamin D as it's a fat soluble vitamin
as well as convert FT4 to FT3? I also had a liver reaction to Crestor within a week.
Thanks
Finally spoke to the dr and she said she wants to see how I react to the Synthroid before she adds some T3 medicine.
However, as I've been reading the liver is where all this happens and some issues have peaked my interest.
I am unable to aborb fats or anything oily, Even good oils like olive, coconut or a simple dressing with oil in it. It causes most of that meal to go right thru me almost immediately. If I understand it right, this process involves the liver. (I even get it sometimes with Omega-3 gelcaps) This has only been happening over the last few years, not a lifetime issue.
My liver function tests are all fine.
She wants to take 50,000 iu once a week. When I questioned her about this she said just do the Vitamins and she'll test my fat aborption later.
And continue the Ultra Probiotic that makes me feel bad and all the other pills she has me on.
I'm also, I think, lactose intolerate but now I have my doubts about that and it was the fats I was reacting to.
The most recent bloodwork was a lot of vitamin testing and a celic panel. I think she's determined to prove this. I already tested negative and my blood work allergy panel came back negative to everything they tested. Also went gluten free with no change.
I also have the MTHFR (double) so I don't appear to using my 800 of B12, effectly. So much going on especially if my liver isn't working right.
Could this affect my ability to absorb Vitamin D as it's a fat soluble vitamin
as well as convert FT4 to FT3? I also had a liver reaction to Crestor within a week.
Thanks
I know, some of these practitioners do give you a lot to swallow, both literally and figuratively! LOL More is not always better.
So, the adrenal support you are on is all herbs?
I don't know a lot about interpreting the finer points of the saliva test, but high adrenal hormones might be causing you to convert more RT3 than FT3. If your adrenals come back into line (and I think some patience will be required), your FT3 might right itself.
So, the adrenal support you are on is all herbs?
I don't know a lot about interpreting the finer points of the saliva test, but high adrenal hormones might be causing you to convert more RT3 than FT3. If your adrenals come back into line (and I think some patience will be required), your FT3 might right itself.
It's Mag Glycinate. 400 mg.
It was the salvia test and according to it. I'm extremely high all day.
6 am 25.4 Morning (7.0-10.0)
11:30am 24.4 Midday (3.0-7.0)
4:15 pm 12.8 Afternoon(2.0-4.0)
8:30pm 4.5 Evening (<1.5)
My wakeup time is around 4:30-5 am. Bedtime is around 9pm. She ordered thru her lab, even gave me the kit, for insomia which I don't think I have. I do drink coffee in the morning and smoke which I know can affect the results. And it was very difficult to get enough salvia without foam and bubbles. It doesn't seem to jive with how I feel. Mornings I have good energy, not hyper-energy, fade around early afternoon then I'm pretty much done by 8:30-9pm. She also didn't seem overly concerned.
Of course, it came with a list of pricy supplements that I could buy thru them. I have my doubts about the test-Did I do it right, etc.
Her supplement is thru another company with at least 10 herbs and called a Heart Calming Formula? I found 1 of them that is supposed to help the adernals. The rest are for all sorts of other things,unproven of course. I don't feel any different on them.
No signs of Cushings. And I pass all the home adernal tests.
I really like her, she is helping with other issues that I've had for years including my panic and anxiety disorder.
So I will take to her about the T3 addition. She does listen and does believe in more than the TSH belief.
I think I annoy her because I wouldn't take some of her supplements that have over 3,000 times the RDA or go gluten free but she seems to get over it pretty quick.
It was the salvia test and according to it. I'm extremely high all day.
6 am 25.4 Morning (7.0-10.0)
11:30am 24.4 Midday (3.0-7.0)
4:15 pm 12.8 Afternoon(2.0-4.0)
8:30pm 4.5 Evening (<1.5)
My wakeup time is around 4:30-5 am. Bedtime is around 9pm. She ordered thru her lab, even gave me the kit, for insomia which I don't think I have. I do drink coffee in the morning and smoke which I know can affect the results. And it was very difficult to get enough salvia without foam and bubbles. It doesn't seem to jive with how I feel. Mornings I have good energy, not hyper-energy, fade around early afternoon then I'm pretty much done by 8:30-9pm. She also didn't seem overly concerned.
Of course, it came with a list of pricy supplements that I could buy thru them. I have my doubts about the test-Did I do it right, etc.
Her supplement is thru another company with at least 10 herbs and called a Heart Calming Formula? I found 1 of them that is supposed to help the adernals. The rest are for all sorts of other things,unproven of course. I don't feel any different on them.
No signs of Cushings. And I pass all the home adernal tests.
I really like her, she is helping with other issues that I've had for years including my panic and anxiety disorder.
So I will take to her about the T3 addition. She does listen and does believe in more than the TSH belief.
I think I annoy her because I wouldn't take some of her supplements that have over 3,000 times the RDA or go gluten free but she seems to get over it pretty quick.
What kind of mag do you take? You want to be sure it's not mag oxide.
How off are your adrenal hormones, and are they low or high? Did you do the 24-hour saliva test?
Since your FT4 is really quite good, and it's your FT3 that's off, you might ask your doctor about taking some T3. Of course, you want your adrenals in pretty good shape before doing that. You can take either synthetic T3 (alone or along with synthetic T4) or desiccated porcine thyroid, which has both in it. I will warn you that many doctors think that T4 only works for everyone (it doesn't), and many doctors fall into the synthetic camp or the desiccated camp and never "cross the aisle" as it were.
How off are your adrenal hormones, and are they low or high? Did you do the 24-hour saliva test?
Since your FT4 is really quite good, and it's your FT3 that's off, you might ask your doctor about taking some T3. Of course, you want your adrenals in pretty good shape before doing that. You can take either synthetic T3 (alone or along with synthetic T4) or desiccated porcine thyroid, which has both in it. I will warn you that many doctors think that T4 only works for everyone (it doesn't), and many doctors fall into the synthetic camp or the desiccated camp and never "cross the aisle" as it were.
No recent trama, no surgery, no lifestyle change, post menopause.
Am deficient in Vitamin D and mag. Am being very good about supplments.
The other stressors right now, possible folate trapping, high cholesterol, mutant gene, several other adnormal blood tests came with the same blood work. Don't appear to be related to the thyroid.
Am positive for the EPV-not active. Have been for years along with an elevated Sed Rate but it's actually lower than it has been in awhile.
Drawing blood from me is perhaps a bit of a stressor. I'm a very hard draw. This time it was 8 tubes out of the top of my feet after my normal locations failed. It hurt-lol. And I get more drawn on Tuesday. No thyroid testing.
That's the highest my FT4 and TPO has ever been.And the lowest FT3 since 2012.
The only thing I can think of over the last few months, I've been slightly concerned about for few months is my husband's company being bought by a larger corporation and what that they mean to his location,staff,etc.
Am deficient in Vitamin D and mag. Am being very good about supplments.
The other stressors right now, possible folate trapping, high cholesterol, mutant gene, several other adnormal blood tests came with the same blood work. Don't appear to be related to the thyroid.
Am positive for the EPV-not active. Have been for years along with an elevated Sed Rate but it's actually lower than it has been in awhile.
Drawing blood from me is perhaps a bit of a stressor. I'm a very hard draw. This time it was 8 tubes out of the top of my feet after my normal locations failed. It hurt-lol. And I get more drawn on Tuesday. No thyroid testing.
That's the highest my FT4 and TPO has ever been.And the lowest FT3 since 2012.
The only thing I can think of over the last few months, I've been slightly concerned about for few months is my husband's company being bought by a larger corporation and what that they mean to his location,staff,etc.
You're right. Those labs are in no way hyper. Both FT3 and FT4 are right on the floor of the ranges, hypo by any standards. What is interesting is that in the 2.5 years since 2/2012, your labs without meds have improved tremendously. That's very unusual when you have Hashi's.
It takes some time for T4 to build in your blood, and it's not unusual when first starting or increasing to have symptoms worsen for a while or have a few new ones pop up. You were on a very low dose, and sometimes that will actually make your FT4 go down a bit since it can lower your TSH, so your thyroid isn't stimulated to produce as much natural hormone. Intolerance to a very low dose can also be due to adrenal issues.
TPOab is considered basically either positive or negative. Some people with very high antibody counts seem to feel better than others with low ones. Also, antibody counts vary wildly, so they can swing around even intraday. There are those who will disagree with me, but I don't think it makes a whole lot of difference. As antibodies kill off the thyroid, it can "dump" hormone, i.e. the hormone from the dying cells gets dumped into the bloodstream in a pretty uncontrolled fashion. If you're fairly hypo, this can be just the pick-me-up you've been looking for. If you're not, however, it can make you temporarily hyper.
One of the "burning" questions in my mind that in all my reading I have not been able to find an answer to is how many antibodies it takes to destroy a thyroid. If TPOab is 900, is the thyroid being destroyed twice as fast as someone with a count of 450? Is a very high antibody count just overkill on the immune system's part? Is there a "magic" number, i.e. once your antibodies are over X, it doesn't matter any more if they're higher.
Antibodies can be present for years, or even decades, before they cause enough damage to produce symptoms. Sometimes it takes years to effectively "kill" the thyroid, sometimes it's just a few months. However, we have no idea how antibody levels might interact with other factors to destroy function sooner or later. For example, does a high antibody count when you still have a lot of thyroid function left affect you more than a high count when your thyroid is almost dead?
On the antibody front, there are a lot more questions than answers. Researchers are only beginning to scratch the tip of the iceberg when it comes to autoimmune diseases, and there are a lot of AIs ahead of us in line.
Do you have any other health concerns that might exacerbating the autoimmune response? Any chronic diseases, recent trauma, stress (physical or psychological), recent surgery, vitamin or mineral deficiencies, lifestyle changes, menopause, etc.?
It takes some time for T4 to build in your blood, and it's not unusual when first starting or increasing to have symptoms worsen for a while or have a few new ones pop up. You were on a very low dose, and sometimes that will actually make your FT4 go down a bit since it can lower your TSH, so your thyroid isn't stimulated to produce as much natural hormone. Intolerance to a very low dose can also be due to adrenal issues.
TPOab is considered basically either positive or negative. Some people with very high antibody counts seem to feel better than others with low ones. Also, antibody counts vary wildly, so they can swing around even intraday. There are those who will disagree with me, but I don't think it makes a whole lot of difference. As antibodies kill off the thyroid, it can "dump" hormone, i.e. the hormone from the dying cells gets dumped into the bloodstream in a pretty uncontrolled fashion. If you're fairly hypo, this can be just the pick-me-up you've been looking for. If you're not, however, it can make you temporarily hyper.
One of the "burning" questions in my mind that in all my reading I have not been able to find an answer to is how many antibodies it takes to destroy a thyroid. If TPOab is 900, is the thyroid being destroyed twice as fast as someone with a count of 450? Is a very high antibody count just overkill on the immune system's part? Is there a "magic" number, i.e. once your antibodies are over X, it doesn't matter any more if they're higher.
Antibodies can be present for years, or even decades, before they cause enough damage to produce symptoms. Sometimes it takes years to effectively "kill" the thyroid, sometimes it's just a few months. However, we have no idea how antibody levels might interact with other factors to destroy function sooner or later. For example, does a high antibody count when you still have a lot of thyroid function left affect you more than a high count when your thyroid is almost dead?
On the antibody front, there are a lot more questions than answers. Researchers are only beginning to scratch the tip of the iceberg when it comes to autoimmune diseases, and there are a lot of AIs ahead of us in line.
Do you have any other health concerns that might exacerbating the autoimmune response? Any chronic diseases, recent trauma, stress (physical or psychological), recent surgery, vitamin or mineral deficiencies, lifestyle changes, menopause, etc.?
"The thyroid autoantibodies to thyroid peroxidase (TPOAb) and thyroglobulin (TgAb) are secondary response to thyroid injury. Both are polyclonal IgG antibodies and the amount present correlate with lymphocytic infiltration of the thyroid, have completement-fixing cytotoxic activity and TPO autoantibodies correlate with thyroidal damage." - The Immunoassay Handbook by David Wild.
TPOAb correlate with thyroid damage. I lowered my TPOAb somewhat eating brazil nuts (high in selenium).
TPOAb correlate with thyroid damage. I lowered my TPOAb somewhat eating brazil nuts (high in selenium).
The worst that I remember where the inability to even walk at times. The dizziness and balance were terrible. The tireness was worst than anything I ever felt even now. I basically never got out of bed or literally had to crawl or use a cane and sit to take a shower at times. My head felt like it was going to explode at times. All I did was sleep. Didn't want to eat. Never felt that bad before or after.
Took about 2 weeks to feel like I did before and that wasn't so great but a bit better.
My blood results a month after starting/stopping showed no signs of hyper. Never have.
I know that I should have stuck it out. Reading here, as well as the dr said I should given it more time.
TSH from 3.140 to 3.230 (.27-4.2)
FT4 from .94 to 1.13 (.93-1.7)
FT3 from 2.5 to 2.8 (2.5-4.3)
TPO 483 <35 (1st time tested)
It was 25 mg daily.
Does the higher TPO levels mean anything, like it's destorying my thyroid faster or symptom-wise cause I've actually felt not too terrible the past few days. Just some soreness and tired, but I have been more active than I have been in awhile. In between naps, of course.
Took about 2 weeks to feel like I did before and that wasn't so great but a bit better.
My blood results a month after starting/stopping showed no signs of hyper. Never have.
I know that I should have stuck it out. Reading here, as well as the dr said I should given it more time.
TSH from 3.140 to 3.230 (.27-4.2)
FT4 from .94 to 1.13 (.93-1.7)
FT3 from 2.5 to 2.8 (2.5-4.3)
TPO 483 <35 (1st time tested)
It was 25 mg daily.
Does the higher TPO levels mean anything, like it's destorying my thyroid faster or symptom-wise cause I've actually felt not too terrible the past few days. Just some soreness and tired, but I have been more active than I have been in awhile. In between naps, of course.
High cholesterol is, of course, a symptom of hypo. So, my personal feeling on that is to address the root cause, rather than the symptom.
No, you don't have to be positive for both to have Hashi's. Some of us are TPOab positive, some TGab positive and some both. If TPOab is positive, you have Hashi's, but if it's negative, you still have to test TGab to rule it out. So, you test both, but only one has to come back positive. U/S will probably further confirm.
Typically, the rule is to fix the adrenals first. If you have adrenal issues, taking thyroid meds can be almost impossible. We often see cases where people can't increase or can't find a workable dose...one dose is to low, but increase it just a little, and it's too high.
You can see that your T4 level is bouncing around a little. On 12/23, TT4 (unfortunately not FT4) was 60% of range, on 2/26 it was down to 18%, and currently back to 53%. 18% is way too low. Your levels may be swinging on a much shorter interval than these intermittent labs show.
FT3 has been steadily dropping from 3.3 to 3.0 to 2.9.
What side effects did you experience on levo in 2012? What dosage were you started on?
No, you don't have to be positive for both to have Hashi's. Some of us are TPOab positive, some TGab positive and some both. If TPOab is positive, you have Hashi's, but if it's negative, you still have to test TGab to rule it out. So, you test both, but only one has to come back positive. U/S will probably further confirm.
Typically, the rule is to fix the adrenals first. If you have adrenal issues, taking thyroid meds can be almost impossible. We often see cases where people can't increase or can't find a workable dose...one dose is to low, but increase it just a little, and it's too high.
You can see that your T4 level is bouncing around a little. On 12/23, TT4 (unfortunately not FT4) was 60% of range, on 2/26 it was down to 18%, and currently back to 53%. 18% is way too low. Your levels may be swinging on a much shorter interval than these intermittent labs show.
FT3 has been steadily dropping from 3.3 to 3.0 to 2.9.
What side effects did you experience on levo in 2012? What dosage were you started on?
Hi
No she hasn't. And getting her to try anything was a fight. She does want to start at 11.5 first. She believes that my liver is toxic,(detox it), leaky gut, try gluten-free (did it before-no difference) and my saliva tests did show the cortisol was very high.Morning blood was fine and always has been. Am taking her Adneral fix pills. Haven't started the med yet.
She's an Intergated Medicine practioner and Synthoid user herself so wants all these super vitamins and herbs too. She didn't really discuss the Reverse T3 at our last visit. But says she believes it's important and the frees. I feel she did it so I would take Crestor because my cholesterol did go up alot in 4 months. Tried the Crestor for 4 days then had liver side effects as warned could happen so stopped. She wasn't happy.
I read on another side that you have to postive on both the TPO and Tgab to have Hashi's, is that true?
Is it fix the adernals first or fix the thryoid first?
Symptoms have been getting worse over the last few months.
Same lab on both. Different dr ordered them. My last two results were
2/26/2014
TSH 2.57 (.55-4.70)
FT4 1.05 (.89-1.76)
FT3 3.0 (2.3-4.2)
TPOab 228 (<60)
Tgab <20 (<40)
TSI <1.0 (<or= 1.3)
12/23/2013
TSH 2.86 (.55-4.70)
Total T4 9.0 (4.5-12.0) Didn't do a FT4
Free T3 3.3 (2.3-4.2)
TBOab 228 (<60)
Tgab <20 (< or = 40)
Reverse T3 18 (8-25)
Also just had a thyroid ultrasound, awaiting the results.
Tried levothyroxine back in 2/2012 but stopped after 2 weeks. Couldn't take the side events. Numbers were way off then and didn't know about the TPO.
Appreciate your time.
No she hasn't. And getting her to try anything was a fight. She does want to start at 11.5 first. She believes that my liver is toxic,(detox it), leaky gut, try gluten-free (did it before-no difference) and my saliva tests did show the cortisol was very high.Morning blood was fine and always has been. Am taking her Adneral fix pills. Haven't started the med yet.
She's an Intergated Medicine practioner and Synthoid user herself so wants all these super vitamins and herbs too. She didn't really discuss the Reverse T3 at our last visit. But says she believes it's important and the frees. I feel she did it so I would take Crestor because my cholesterol did go up alot in 4 months. Tried the Crestor for 4 days then had liver side effects as warned could happen so stopped. She wasn't happy.
I read on another side that you have to postive on both the TPO and Tgab to have Hashi's, is that true?
Is it fix the adernals first or fix the thryoid first?
Symptoms have been getting worse over the last few months.
Same lab on both. Different dr ordered them. My last two results were
2/26/2014
TSH 2.57 (.55-4.70)
FT4 1.05 (.89-1.76)
FT3 3.0 (2.3-4.2)
TPOab 228 (<60)
Tgab <20 (<40)
TSI <1.0 (<or= 1.3)
12/23/2013
TSH 2.86 (.55-4.70)
Total T4 9.0 (4.5-12.0) Didn't do a FT4
Free T3 3.3 (2.3-4.2)
TBOab 228 (<60)
Tgab <20 (< or = 40)
Reverse T3 18 (8-25)
Also just had a thyroid ultrasound, awaiting the results.
Tried levothyroxine back in 2/2012 but stopped after 2 weeks. Couldn't take the side events. Numbers were way off then and didn't know about the TPO.
Appreciate your time.
Early stages of Hashi's can be characterized by swings from hypo to hyper. This may be what you're experiencing. Do you have other FT3 and FT4 results to compare these to to see if your levels are swinging?
Your current FT4 level is 53% of range. The target for FT4 is middle (50%) of range, so that looks really good and shows that you still have a lot of thyroid function left.
FT3 is a little on the low side of the upper half (50+%) of range guideline. Yours is 32% of range. However, my personal feeling (all the usual disclaimers: not a doctor etc.) is that people who are not on meds or who take T4 only meds often run FT3 on the low side.
As far as TSH is concerned, it's very volatile, and I know people who'd be miserably hypo between 2 and 2.5 and people who'd be miserably hyper. TSH should not be your doctor's main concern.
Will Synthroid raise your RT3? That seems like a simple question, but it's much more complex than it appears, and the answer is that you'll probably never know until you try it and see what it does. We're all very individual, and Person A can start Synthroid and have RT3 go up, while Person B's will go down and it will have absolutely no effect on Person C's.
Has your doctor offered any alternative besides Synthroid?
Your current FT4 level is 53% of range. The target for FT4 is middle (50%) of range, so that looks really good and shows that you still have a lot of thyroid function left.
FT3 is a little on the low side of the upper half (50+%) of range guideline. Yours is 32% of range. However, my personal feeling (all the usual disclaimers: not a doctor etc.) is that people who are not on meds or who take T4 only meds often run FT3 on the low side.
As far as TSH is concerned, it's very volatile, and I know people who'd be miserably hypo between 2 and 2.5 and people who'd be miserably hyper. TSH should not be your doctor's main concern.
Will Synthroid raise your RT3? That seems like a simple question, but it's much more complex than it appears, and the answer is that you'll probably never know until you try it and see what it does. We're all very individual, and Person A can start Synthroid and have RT3 go up, while Person B's will go down and it will have absolutely no effect on Person C's.
Has your doctor offered any alternative besides Synthroid?
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