Impending Relapse? Hiskidd

[hiskidd]

Wow guys. Today is officially day 20, and it's the worst (one of the) nights of pain I've had. It's almost 3am. I can't sleep even with a sleep aid. My diagnosis a year ago was Degenerative Disc Disease. They couldn't see enough to do surgery, but I got the oortizone shot (epidrual), the MRI, and the oxy.

Tonight had me doing some serious thinking about quality of life. I looked at so many pictures taken this past year on my phone. So many happy pictures of my kids. Of me and my family doing life. It got me thinking "What/am I addicted or JUST physically dependent." And if it's JUST (caps cuz it sounds like justification) physical dependence, should I say "so what?" in order to go back to my 45 mgs a day?

I've read stuff tonight (some on this forum) from people who say Europe has a way of doing 3 weeks on the drug/s then 1 week off to help offset the usage. I read that if you're in pain all day all the time then oxy is probably "right" for you, but not if you're going to have a dentist visit or something that will go away.

I just don't know. There's enough horror stories out there about back surgeries too, that I'd hate to leave April and 4 kids with me totally incompacitated.

I guess my question is, am I just rationallizing now? Am I close enough to work and school that I can't imagine pain all day every day. I had some "good" days, but I also just laid around. I'm really afraid I won't make it past Tuesday without trying to see my doctor about a prescription. Gonna try to sleep again. I do love you guys. Just not sure what to do????

in HIm,

David

[Dav125]

Ok, I have the same delimma,, pain vs quality of life. Or ,pain vs meds vs quality of life..With pain vs meds, I have come to find that any quality of life is not true quality, it is a fabrication of the meds with its own set of terms as to what is enjoyable and whats not. Even then, its only a temporary moment and really a facade, a fake sense of being..Dig down underneath..You know this to be true..

I've come to the conclusion that no matter what (those words fit everywhere), there is no quality while medicating..There just isn't..The pills control your emotions, your dreams, your desires, your motivation,,everything..They dull the sense's, perceptions, everything.

I want to be me as best I can not only for myself but for my 4 children too..That cannot happen with meds I have come to acknowledge to myself..Does this help at all with helping you reach a decision? Because yes, I see someone that is trying to rationaize a reason to say it's ok to use "some"..For me,,there is no such thing as "some" anymore. If it's here,,it's "all"...All the time..Think hard on that...Hope you got some more sleep......Dav :)

[laurel453]

Oh, David, i am so sorry you are feeling this pain. You are both on pain and i can not judge as my use was recreational. I would not dare giving any suggestion. Just wanted to show you my support .

[LeaAnn807]

Ditto laurel!  I'm sorry you guys are hurting!  Praying for an alternative for you both!  Please hang in there!

[udoschoices]

here's the deal man. I have DDD and herniated disk L5/S1 from football in younger years, incorrect lifting of heavy weights, etc. At 21 the said my back looked like a 50 yo. I'm 39 now. I went through the same things, nerve block shot, the pills, the surgery discussion. Got me hooked on the pills for fun not pain - because you know what fixed the pain? I GOOD personal trainer. An ex-NFL running back who had fixed people that had back surgery, people like you and me diagnosed with it. There ARE ways to get around it without drugs. You can strengthen up the supportiing muscles enough to take the load off and not feel it. I dont have pain to this day, haven't for years. Back the same, but i'm stronger and not all the weight i carry is pushing on that back.

This isnt an answer to your pill vs quality of life question, because i'm still stuggling to get off the pills i got hooked on first prescribed over 5 years ago by the back doctor. Just telling you what actually works. I'm living proof and i had all the surgery discussions, blah blah. LAST thing you want is to fuse your spine and have LESS range of movement. Lots of studies showing no improvement from these surgeries.

You can get better. I know it doesnt feel like it, i've been there. But go to a gym, find a GOOD trainer, tell then what is wrong and do the exercises to get it right. Yoga helps also.  

hang in there, pills just mask the problem

[ImDONENoMore]

I can only offer my experience with what you are feeling right now.

I too thought after about a month, that maybe I was different - that maybe because of my pain (OA) that I should be treated differently - that I was one of those people that would have to be on pain meds forever because of my physical pain.  I could not have been more wrong.

I have found at almost 6 months off that SO much of my pain has disappeared.  Yes, I still have the OA and sometimes it is painful.  But you know what?  I take an OTC pain reliever (Aleve) and it works wonders for me.  I only take two every morning and it keeps the pain at bay for the whole day.

I only say this because I was also ready to give up and go back to the pills.  If I had not held out a little longer, I'm not sure where I'd be right now.  Taking pills I'm sure.

Good luck to you - just wanted to give you something to think about.  :)

[mommyoffive0529]

Everyone on here is right..no matter what i do , i don't want to ever have to take a pill again...this has been a really rough last few weeks for me and i really notice my pain subsiding..Basically, i can live with the pain...its the mental part that's taunting me..that first pill in the AM part with my cereal and off i went!  Got a load of stuff done on only one pill and then later on i would take a half and i was great again...then when i got home to do the mommy thing, i took one more half...i never abused the pills i just hate to be in pain but i think the whole life thing is way harder...i realized that the last six years of my life are a blur...i probably have not needed them pills in a few years but how could i know if i was taking them all this time...so i am only on day 15 and i am feeling it too..the depression and weakness and i do not want to get up but everyone says it will get better and i have to believe them because they have done this already before me and they are ok so no matter how i feel right now..i hope it can only get better..God Bless you and do'nt take those pills again..i have been finding them all over the house for days and i have not wanted to put one in my mouth even though  i know i will feel so much better...to hell with pills...they are the Devil's cocktail

[Back2Me]

I am seeing am upper cervical specialist (when i have $$). But this science is great. They use only like sound waves. Fixed my mom right up and she has had the failed surgerys. Look into it. Or like the other guy said physical therapy.

[throwindatowl]

Ive always felt so stupid for using just to get high. I read posts from people in real pain and thats what meds are for. Im not sure if staying medicated makes pain worse. The body gets used to not feeling pain then you quit taking pain meds and the body goes into shock. Makes the pain worse. Maybe alittle time with pain would make it better? My heart goes out you all and I hope you can learn to manage your pain. Hopefully without hardcore pain meds. My grandmother is dying in the hospital and they only give her 5mg oxys. Im not sure if many people need to be taking 100s of mgs a day? Then again, what do I know.

[Dav125]

You know what I found out? Pain was being masked, I was then over exerting during that period,,aggrevating and straining my injuries (from surgery,,the carving and removal of the ruptured or herniated material, not fused) creating more pain,,requiring more med..

And as tolerance went up, so did meds, which masked more, which stupid me pushed more (because I am a hands on A type all my life) and this thing spiraled out of control the past 3 months or so because I just could not come to terms that I "am" going to have to physically change my behavior and the expectations I put on myself..And thats a very hard thing to do when you spent your whole life reaping pride and accomplishment more from what you did physically than standing back and being a ringmaster directing a show..Even as the ringmaster I still felt I had to jump in and show the way for those I hired to get a particular construction job done....I'm actually pretty amazed I got away with it as long as I did,,

No more though..I have come to "finally" realize "no more".....I did two surgery's,,one in 2005 on L-4 and L-5 and one this past June on a re-ruture or re-herniating of L-5 from ignoring the lesson I should have learned after the 2005 round and continued to stress myself beyond my physical limitations...

The past week has been difficult, but in the pain dept I am stunned that I don't hurt more than I do..I can tolerate this with otc's...I went from a Holiday wearing a back brace medicating ,medicating,medicating, to being where I'm at which is the start of the 9th day without..You said a key statement undoschoices..."The right exercise" is the one thats needed for people that are inflicted with the conditions we have..Which is ironic you mention this because I'm reading a book about that right now. It was given to me by a friend who went thru my same surgery procedure prior to me,,but took notice at that time that he had to change and for the past 7 years is going strong (within limitations) with no problems since...

So I am now looking at him, seeing his success, and believing I can turn this around and get my life back...The book btw is called "In Fitness and in Health"..Author is Dr. Philip Maffetone..I'm only 30 pages or so into it, but already its directing me toward the things I need to do to help insure my success in breaking free of the med relience and live a better life from this day forward..I guess it's my personal trainer at present that you describe above...Ok, enough rambling...

Glad to see what you wrote ImDone,,,That really helped reinforce the belief that it is possible to live within my limitations without fear ,,:)..

[petroglyph54]

Yep lots of us in the same leaky old boat! I have your same affliction plus. Probably just been with it a bit longer. Being stubborn helped me to really increase my ddd. I finally couldn't stand up strait. Started the happy epidural route. I've now had 14 in my neck and back and 7 in my shoulders. I've refused to increase my dose of oxy past the 200mg per day which used to let me function. I believe that it's also now the minimum to keep me from wd's. Just seen a pain specialist, she says I'm immune to oxy, put me on Opana and, and I'm really undermedicated so I'm hurting and in wd's. Long story long, They changed the formula for making oxy, which I'm now allergic to. What do we do??? So, our dillema isn't unique to any of us, but it seems the pain med route is fairly predictable, that's how we all found this site. I've read here and heard from my doctor that I'll "only" be physically dependant versus addicted. Thank God, wait a second, this might be worse? I haven't missed a dose in 6 years and have a scrip to be filled, I don't have to go searching and mine's paid for, sheesh...Maybe I'm also and addict? heh, heh,
Yep, the line between the two is invisible. But taking meds like clockwork year after year, I think you can thouroughly saturate every cell in your body, I have. Now, like you, I don't want to take the pills, and I don't want to be in lots of pain. I think the answer as much as I dislike it, is like said above. WE gotta do the proper exercise, proper nutrition, lots of clean water and a positive mental attitude. That is the only way there is out of this situation. Like I said I don't like it, but that is how it is. The meds, WILL NOT work forever, your tolerance no matter what it is will increase till you can't take enough of  it to get any relief and your still way addicted. There also nasty side effects to any pharmacutical. Also, we'll have to quit from a mcuh higher dose, which I think is more miserable. You gotta go backwards to get out. Also, exercise has to be done at least 3 times a week. I think it's after 3 days our muscles start to atrophy after  3 days of none use. I am very glad you made it this far, from where I'm sitting it seems like you made it to the other side. Now just get better, wish you well.

[Dav125]

Amen brother,,Amen..Seek and one "might" just find  :)

[gnarly_1]

HI David....a lot of our members have been where you are I was about 10yrs ago all I can offer you is my story hopefully it will discourage you from wanting to go back to the ball and chian....I to suffer with bad disks in my back 2 herniated and 3 deteriorate I did the pain pill thing for around 10yrs trying to fight off the pain first it was darvons they quit working so we went to vicaden then the es vicaden by that time I started to take more the perscribed I rationalized it because I was in pain eventually it went form 1 extra pill to 3 or 4 extra pills per dose I kept telling the doctors that the pills dident work so they moved me to percs then perc 10s then dilodid then morphine the whole time I was abusing them just to get them to work in the end David I was eating them by the handful with no pain releaf at that point they decided to put me on methadone I spent the next 6 1/2 yrs on methadone only to have the same thing happen went from 30mg to 150mg and it quit working for pain....do you really want to go threw that eventually it all quits working and then your stuck with a huge addiction to break it took me 8 1/2 mo of going in and out of withdrawals to get off the methadone then another 90 days to even feel like I was going to recover....Dude it just ant worth it....give yourself a little more time your body will start to produce it own natural endorphins when that happens your pain clock sorta resets itself then things like alive or ibuprofine will actually work again many of our members here have found we do better off of narcotics then on them give it a chance your still in the beginning stages of recovery...I hope you dont make the same mistakes I have made I watched 16 1/2yrs of my life go by in a fog....good luck and God bless.....Gnarly    

[norco_no_more1960]

I think I am 2 days ahead of you in detoxing.  For me its from norco.  Night before last (so the evening of the 20th day) was one of the worst days with pain that I have had ever since I started wd.

Someone here told me that it was likely rebound pain.  I toughed it out yesterday and last night I slept much better than the night before.

I have workmans' comp injuries - back, knees, ankles and neck.  I"m more than 40% disabled according to them.  

I think my overall quality of life is going to be much better once I am past all of this.  

The whole time I've been detoxing I've had most of a bottle of Norco in my house.  I didn't have a problem tapering and I kept the bottle "just in case" I needed it.  Two nights ago I was very tempted to take one but I don't want all of this work to be a waste.  But that night my mind went over some of the same arguments that you mentioned above.

Bottom line - I don't want to worry that if I decide to move to a different state, I won't have someone to prescribe my pain meds.  I don't want to be afraid not to take a pill every day so I don't have wd.

My first grandbaby is due in July and I want to be able to be a real part of my grandchild's life.  I think these pain meds just make my body crave more and more and when I don't feed the craving, it creates more pain in my body just so it can have more of the drug.

I think you've done really great.  Keep it up, don't give in.  I'm dedicated to getting past the original wd pains, which I think I have, getting past the rebound pain (I'm not sure if I'm past all of that) and to living a life free of Norco.

Lisa

[throwindatowl]

I think we gotta remember our lives before taking this pill. I know it was a better life. I relapsed quite afew times but looking back on it, I really didnt want to quit. I wanted all the bad stuff that comes with it to go away. It never did. The exercise has helped me alot. When Im done that little part of my brain pills tap into is satisfied. Its a chemical thing. Normal does return we just gotta give it time.

[hiskidd]

Thanks EVERYONE. Very trying night. Not much better early morning, but I really do hear what you guys are saying. I'm not resolved to go back to the narc meds at all. I would say I'm more resolved not to, but some of those bad times make you want to say, "Forget it all. I don't know these people on the internet forum. Everyone is different..." And on and on.

I have so much to be thankful for. If there is one big thing I am taking as a gift from God in all of this, it's that I'm much more compassionate toward others who are in pain. In ANY kind of pain. I'm slower to judge, and much quicker to listen, and pray more for others. I have true empathy.

I also have big regrets. I think of time that I wasted a "painless" body life by NOT spending enough family time, doing bad things, or whatever. It's like I want so bad to "go back" to those years. Wish I never took a drink, wish I never did this or never did that. Basically that I didn't take care of my body from the time I was a youth kind of thinking. And now it's damaged.

BUT, like I said, I hear you guys, and I don't want to hurt it more. I saw myself go from two 20 oxys a day to between 45mg and 60mg a day in 13 months. I know that may not sound like a lot to some people, and I rationalize that I took them "as directed" only orally, etc., but I remember using them when not in tremendous pain, or when I felt pressure or stress. I remember self-medicating.

I care about you guys. I feel Matthew 25:36-40 in so many of you. I know not everyone is a Believer, but I can't separate myself from my faith, so it's not intended to assault anyone. Addicted or dependent, the sense is a "NEED" for the meds. I guess I've got to get away from that way of thinking. Thank you all for caring. I care for you too. David

[hiskidd]

:) Not 20 oxys a day. Two 20mgs!!!

[Dav125]

Your connecting with your spiritual self..Thats a very good and powerful sign for the better...Go for it. Everything is lining up for you to move on past the past days...

[Back2Me]

You are going through a mimd f$c$ right now. It's from the pills. It might seem like it's just your pain but trust me it's your drug bombarded brain screaming right now as well.

[hiskidd]

Guys, I'm back to work (teaching 8th grade) and I am freaking out. My back hurts, I feel panicky, unprepared, and ready to burst into tears. I just emailed my wife to tell her I don't think I can do this, OR I HAVE to do it with oxycontin. The whole time I was "getting better," I didn't think I'd relapse, or the thought of having to go through WD's would scare me into not RELAPSING, but at this point, it feels like I don't care. I'll relapse if it means making it through my day.

I'm so afraid of letting my family, and you guys down. I don't know what to do.

[Dav125]

You'd be amazed at what you can do when one stops thinking about doom and gloom and just fights there way thru focusing on whatever is required to be done. Even in my worst energyless states I surprised myself when it came to going out the door and accomplishing the task at hand....Wishing you strength to believe in yourself....

[rligh09]

My husband has the back issues like a lot of the people on here. We were really scared he wouldnt be able to deal witht he pain after teh meds were gone. We are on week 6. He was off work for a few weeks so that helped and he litterally laid on a heating pad about 20hrs out of the day, took a ton of ibuprofin and is  now using aleve. It was tough those first few weeks but he is definatly feeling ok. Here is something he figured out to. Our bed is about 14 yrs old so a few nights he slept on the couch with the heating pad and he felt a thousand times better in the a.m. So now he sleeps there everynight and we will get a new mattress at tax time. He also lost about 15 pounds and I think that helped to not having that weight in his belly has really helped his back a lot too. When it gets reall bad, which it hasnt in a while he uses a lidacain patch that his doctor prescribed him they work a little haha but you have to shave any hair on you back!!
Has anyone ever tried accupuncture??

[hiskidd]

Thank you both. It's now 11am. I'm a little more stable, but still miserable and still thinking about/craving oxy to "fix" things. Just gotta make through the day. I feel so trapped. Gotta provide for my family. Gotta pay those bills. Gotta, gotta, gotta. So tired. Trying to take things at chunks of time, at a time. So much to do and think about. Lots of pressure. The eyes of 30 8th graders waiting for me to lead, and all I want to do is crawl under the covers on my couch.

Still fighting, but strength is waning. David.

[pcooney13]

Hang in there, I found the busier I was at work the better...stopped my mind from racing.  My pain (same sort of disc issues that you have) is much better since I have been off the Percs. (I'm a couple weeks ahead of you).  My anxiety stemmed from a lot of things, but mostly just a real jumpy feeling.  It gets better with each passing day and you will feel so much better about yourself and your life.  Don't overwhelm yourself with all of those things that you think you "otta" get done.  Getting yourself off the Oxy is the most important thing you can do, everything else will be fine.  I will be thinking of you and hope your pain stays under control.   Stay strong.

[mommyoffive0529]

Are you having any anxiety problems...i have a TON of anxiety and everything seems to set me off....i don't know what the hecks going on...my boyfriend just got home and i didnt hear him and he didnt mean to scare me and here comes the panic...unfreakingreal