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Barney Frank and Ron Paul team up to legalize marijuana
http://www.salon.com/news/politics/war_room/2011/06/22/frank_paul_weed/index.html
Ron Paul and Barney Frank have teamed up again (after their successful joint HuffPo editorial of 2010) to introduce legislation legalizing marijuana. Not decriminalizing it, but actually totally legalizing it. Wouldn't that be wild?
It is being billed as "bipartisan legislation" but obviously Ron Paul is the only Republican co-sponsor. According to the Marijuana Policy Project: "The legislation is the first bill ever introduced in Congress to end federal marijuana prohibition."
On this, the (disputed) 40th anniversary of the War on Drugs, basically every thinking person agrees that marijuana prohibition is an expensive failure. But this will probably not even get a floor debate in the House of Representatives. Or maybe I'm wrong! We'll see!
Ron Paul and Barney Frank have teamed up again (after their successful joint HuffPo editorial of 2010) to introduce legislation legalizing marijuana. Not decriminalizing it, but actually totally legalizing it. Wouldn't that be wild?
It is being billed as "bipartisan legislation" but obviously Ron Paul is the only Republican co-sponsor. According to the Marijuana Policy Project: "The legislation is the first bill ever introduced in Congress to end federal marijuana prohibition."
On this, the (disputed) 40th anniversary of the War on Drugs, basically every thinking person agrees that marijuana prohibition is an expensive failure. But this will probably not even get a floor debate in the House of Representatives. Or maybe I'm wrong! We'll see!
I think part of it is this as well. With alcohol, you have responsible and irresponsible users. I drink alcohol at times, but I don't get drunk ever. This is mainly because I can't stand the way I feel the next day and because I have a small child and do not want to care for him under the influence. I feel it's dangerous, so I limit myself to a glass or two of wine on occasion. I also do not drink or drive, and I can say never to that. So should I not be able to enjoy a glass of wine because others may be irresponsible? Same thing goes with pot. It's pretty much a given that it isn't addictive, and responsible users don't drive under the influence nor do they subject their children to it. A responsible smoker doesn't smoke around children. I have heard it said on these boards many times that responsible people should not be punished for the bad judgement of others. I think this sort of holds true on this issue as well.
@ sweetpea That is probably 1 case is a very few..I've never heard (with the exception of that story) someone crashing a car while driving high and killing someone. I'm sure it was not just marijuana that was in his system. Drunk Drivers kill people almost everyday if that's the case make alcohol illegal...But that won't happen again. Also, majority of people as well as politicians want it legalized so YES if they want to let them..If they abuse it, they suffer the consequences....
Came across this on line..kinda interesting.
ANNUAL AMERICAN DEATHS CAUSED BY DRUGS
TOBACCO …………………… 400,000
ALCOHOL …………………… 100,000
ALL LEGAL DRUGS ………….20,000
ALL ILLEGAL DRUGS ……….15,000
CAFFEINE …………………….2,000
ASPIRIN ………………………500
MARIJUANA …………………. 0
—————————————-
Source: United States government, National Institute on Drug Abuse, Bureau of Mortality Statistics
Like any substance, marijuana can be abused. The most common problem attributed to marijuana is frequent overuse, which can induce lethargic behaviour, but does not cause serious health problems. Marijuana can cause short-term memory loss, but only while under the influence. Marijuana does not impair long-term memory. Marijuana does not lead to harder drugs.
It is an interesting point, but you don't think they'll just move on to another drug to sell on the black market? I doubt the black market will just disappear.
Here is another interesting point on this issue. It's not one I came up with, but in thinking about it, I sort of tend to agree.
Right now drugs of any sort are extremely easy to obtain. If legalized and regulated, one of the things that will eventually happen is the black market demand will decrease...again, I draw the comparision to alcohol during prohibition. Huge profits by bootleggers right? So legalization will rid the world of many of these on the street dealers as it won't be as profitable. When it comes to our youth, it will therefor become harder to obtain, not easier. Just like a child can't walk into a liquor store and buy, neither should they be able to easily purchase drugs.
I know in the US alcohol is sold everywhere. Not the case here, only licensed liquor stores can, and they are quick to have licenses pulled if they sell to minors.
Anyway, I have mixed feelings about the perspective above, but it's interesting to look at it that way.
Right now drugs of any sort are extremely easy to obtain. If legalized and regulated, one of the things that will eventually happen is the black market demand will decrease...again, I draw the comparision to alcohol during prohibition. Huge profits by bootleggers right? So legalization will rid the world of many of these on the street dealers as it won't be as profitable. When it comes to our youth, it will therefor become harder to obtain, not easier. Just like a child can't walk into a liquor store and buy, neither should they be able to easily purchase drugs.
I know in the US alcohol is sold everywhere. Not the case here, only licensed liquor stores can, and they are quick to have licenses pulled if they sell to minors.
Anyway, I have mixed feelings about the perspective above, but it's interesting to look at it that way.
So because it "happens anyways", we should just let them go smoke and do what they want? What happened to the idea of trying to protect the general public? That's why we have laws in general, right. If a person is high and driving, they will crash and can kill people. A guy in high school totaled his car because he was high and driving. Do we really want that going on all over the place?
PEOPLE SMOKE WEED NOW!!!! (Illegally) A LOT of people do...What's the difference..Children are going to smoke it because it WILL be exposed to them. whether it be in school or from a friend or parents..Young children smoke cigarettes now..That kills. Even if they're underage, the find someone to buy it for them..Kids are going to experiment whether we face that reality as parents or not..A small majority of children might not but a large majority will at least once. It's not going to go away...I mean it's just pot..It's not heroine..Alcohol destroys families and destroys your liver. That's legal..Smoking causes heart disease, lung cancer, throat cancer, and KILLS, it says it right on the box. Pot kills a few brain cells. It doesn't cause people to go into a rage, it doesn't make you crash into poles or trees or people and it DOES NOT KILL PEOPLE...in some cases it actually helps people. Glaucoma, Cancer, pain in general....Why not make it legal? I does more good than harm..IMO!!!!
Well going off statistics in comparing states from a number of classes I have taken, it shows that if there is easy accessibility then the usage of the drug or substance increases. And looking at the costs of everything, we don't make enough money off of the drugs to compare to what we spend on helping people who are on the drugs. Hospital costs alone in helping those with alcohol related problems, is much more than what we ever make off of taxing alcohol, DUIs, etc. There is more money spent than is coming in(info from drugs and society class). I don't think sending people to jail for addictions to drugs works, but legalizing the drug is not the answer.
I suspect that if legalized it will be with certain limitations. I doubt they would just make it a free for all. It would probably be much like alcohol...only in specific places ie" home, "bars" set up for it, that sort of thing. It would also open the door to medicinial use which we know is sort of a miracle drug for those in chronic pain without the addictive quality. I would also imagine that people wouldn't be able to just grow and sell...it would be a controlled substance, again, much like alcohol. Also like alcohol it would have age restrictions.
Sweetpea...I'm not sure how to respond except that the courses I have taken on it show differently. The only thing I can think of to exlain is that we are coming at it from two different angels as a high percentage of my clients do have some sort of addiction issue. Part of what we want to see is easier access to treatment without fear of reprisal. What I mean is parents who are afraid to access treatment, afraid that if they admit to an addiction issue it means losing their kids. We also don't want to see people continue to go to jail for using drugs...both from a cost perspective and because it doesn't really do anything to rehabilitate. We all know stats can be skewed somewhat depending on the reason for them.
There are for sure pro's and con's to everthing in life. I guess just in my opinion in this situation, the pro's outweight the cons. As always, just my opinion.
Sweetpea...I'm not sure how to respond except that the courses I have taken on it show differently. The only thing I can think of to exlain is that we are coming at it from two different angels as a high percentage of my clients do have some sort of addiction issue. Part of what we want to see is easier access to treatment without fear of reprisal. What I mean is parents who are afraid to access treatment, afraid that if they admit to an addiction issue it means losing their kids. We also don't want to see people continue to go to jail for using drugs...both from a cost perspective and because it doesn't really do anything to rehabilitate. We all know stats can be skewed somewhat depending on the reason for them.
There are for sure pro's and con's to everthing in life. I guess just in my opinion in this situation, the pro's outweight the cons. As always, just my opinion.
What I am curious about is this. Alcohol is legal but only under restriction. You cannot drink just anywhere and you cannot drink and drive. So, if they make pot legal, what happens with smoking it number one( society has all but made smokers of tobacco a lesser class somehow), and legalizing it and decriminalizing it to me are two different things. So if they legalize it, and people consume it in places or ways that it is restricted, it leads to great revenue, over and above the taxation or sale. In other words, if you get caught drunk driving, you get your car towed to a tow yard, so it generates revenue for them and probably lose your drivers licence, have to retest and go to rehab,generating revenue for them and you pay lots in fines and probaby do community service as well or even serve jail time. So I guess from the politicians point of view making pot legal is their way of creating jobs, ensuring jobs and sharing the wealth among all those entities involved when one person gets a dui? I really have no problem with legalizing it but if we do then lets call it what it is. The courts will be no less busy then it is now and more revenue raised legally.
I don't know about other countries, but looking at statistics from different US states can show a lot, just like the example above with alcohol in Calif vs Oregon. There are also a bunch of others in other states with alcohol and cigarettes. With easy accessibility, usage increased. I wish I had links to it all, but it was from my Determinants of Health Behavior class I took last semester.
If a drug is legal and there is high accessibility, then there will be an increase in use. I stated before on another entry about the statistics of California and Oregon in alcohol use. California sells alcohol almost everywhere(gas stations, grocery stores, etc) while Oregon only sells alcohol at liquor stores. And guess what, California has a horrible problem with alcohol use, underage drinking, drunk driving, etc. When will we learn? Don't make the drug legal and don't make it easily accessible.
But if you look at it, it's no different now. Your right, there is no effective way to test for someone being high and driving. There isn't now. I think really the argument is will it increase usage, and it doesn't. Not here, and not in other countries where it has been decriminalized. There is just no evidence that it does. I understand what your saying and do understand your concerns. But look at the stats in countries where drug use (not dealing) has been decriminalized. No increased usage. Not so far anyway.
I will never understand why people think it's a great idea to legalize a drug. People bring up tax revenue stating alcohol as an example, but really take a look at the numbers. Yes we tax alcohol sales and it makes some money, but the money spent in hospitals for alcohol related problems along with the money spent to police drunk driving is wayyy over the money earned by taxing the product. We really don't earn anything off of it. The same goes for cigarettes. Hospital bill costs far outnumber the income we get from taxing cigarettes. So in truth, what we get are more stoned citizens and less money because like alcohol and cigarettes, we won't make any money on it. And do you really want a bunch of stoned individuals to be driving around on our streets? The police have no way to test drivers for being intoxicated like they do for drunk driving. For alcohol, they can do a Breathalyzer and use that evidence against them. We have nothing to use against those who are high, since there is no test for them. I really hope everyone can see that and can learn from other legal drugs. It's a horrible idea to legalize drugs.
hahahah I wondered if you would be following to put in a remark you are hillarious ..I think you are correct and thats what they will do ....
They will smoke it, eat it, do all kinds of illicit things with it and lie in wait for all those that dont smoke but act like they do, to come out of their houses and go Gotcha! I wonder if the left wingers will act hundreds of times worse than the right wingers after smoking, eating, or whatever they gonna do with it? Or maybe it will only be legal for left wingers! I am fed up! Appalled! I wonder if smoking pot will heal my lung damage from smoking tobacco? Hmmmm!
Has anyone not considered that their children will be using it, and how will they use it, isnt pot smoked? So are all advocating smoking is okay again after the vilification it got,Make it legal and surely cigarettes are back , may I ask how else folks will use it,baked into cookies ? LOL Don't we teach our children by our behavior so if parents smoke pot, their children are certainly going to ...
Well my goodness, since they took everything else away from us, they do owe us something eh? But it is a no brainer that if the politicians are getting together and suggesting it, it is more a matter of how it padd their pockets and not ours, but is a way to hoodwink us again, with our cooperation of course. Getting us to think how its all about making us happy. You betcha!
It would just be better if they legalized it..We all know a majority of the American people and politicians have tried, are still smoking or have smoked for whatever reasons. The absolutely can make a killing by legalizing it..I don't see what the big deal is..
Yeah, the gateway drug thing is a bust. If anything, alcohol might be the gateway drug. I guess you could say that in my case regarding my younger years. I drank before I even thought of smoking pot.
And as for the resources being used.... the financial cost of chasing, catching, and prosecuting pot heads has to be unfathomable.
And as for the resources being used.... the financial cost of chasing, catching, and prosecuting pot heads has to be unfathomable.
Let alone all the police resources, jail & court costs saved by not pursuing this as a crime. We have not officially made it legal here, but if you are caught with a personal amount and aren't trafficing, they leave you alone. And usage isn't up. People choose to do it or they don't. There is absolutely no evidence that making it legal increases usage. I don't use it, but could if I wanted without risk of any kind of penalty. And alcohol is far worse then pot. I have never ever seen anyone get violent on pot. As for it being a gateway drug? I think that has been pretty much debunked. The argument is still made, but there is no evidence.
I'm pretty conservative with the exception of my religious beliefs and about everything that surrounds that. I believe a woman has a right to abortion, obviously making me pro-choice. I am for gay rights and or equal rights for every American citizen..... there are a few more that make me closer to center than a far right conservative.
Legalizing pot to me is a no brainer. The amount of revenue that could be generated would be astronomical!!!! Look what prohibition did for alcohol... same things happened with pot. People are making and growing their own.... get rid of prohibition and make the money off alcohol sales taxes.... do it with pot, the black market eventually peters out in regards to marijuana.
As for today's politics.... it isn't all Obama's fault. It's politicians faults.
Legalizing pot to me is a no brainer. The amount of revenue that could be generated would be astronomical!!!! Look what prohibition did for alcohol... same things happened with pot. People are making and growing their own.... get rid of prohibition and make the money off alcohol sales taxes.... do it with pot, the black market eventually peters out in regards to marijuana.
As for today's politics.... it isn't all Obama's fault. It's politicians faults.
@ Hahahahahaaaaa!!!! it's ALL Obama's fault.. No one but him. He did it ALL..SMH
The sky is falling ....the sky is falling.......and it's all Obama's fault. lol
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