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Doctors Without Borders Calls US Bombing Of Its Hospital A War Crime
Doctors Without Borders says there were repeated attacks, about every 15 minutes, over the course of more than an hour. Neighboring buildings were unharmed.
Why did the US launch an airstrike on a hospital run by Doctors Without Borders in Afghanistan, killing 22 people, including three children?
The Pentagon changed its story today, and the humanitarian group demanded an independent international inquiry.
Doctors Without Borders is calling the incident a war crime, an assertion that rankles some experts and has provoked a spirited discussion on Reddit.
“Under the rules of international humanitarian law, a hospital is a hospital and the people inside are patients — to target a medical facility in this way is a violation of that, whatever the circumstances,” Vickie Hawkins, executive director of the UK branch of Doctors Without Borders, tells The Takeaway. “The statements that have been coming out of the Afghan government in the past 24 hours would lead us to believe that there was some kind of intent behind the attack. We can only presume, on this basis, that that constitutes a war crime.”
The US says the strike in Kunduz, which is under investigation, was issued after Afghan forces came under fire near the hospital and then called for help.
“An airstrike was then called to eliminate the Taliban threat and several civilians were accidentally struck,” the American commander in Afghanistan, Gen. John F. Campbell, said during a press briefing Monday. “This is different from the initial reports which indicated that US forces were threatened and that the airstrike was called on their behalf.”
Though the aid group repeatedly said that there had been no fighting around the hospital, the building was hit over and over again, despite the fact that Doctors Without Borders sent the US military the precise GPS coordinates so the hospital could be avoided.
“When the bombing started, we were indeed in contact with military representatives in both Kabul and in Washington, but the bombing continued for another half hour to 40 minutes after those initial calls were made,” says Hawkins.
The hospital is the only facility of its kind in the northeast region of Afghanistan, and Hawkins says the compound where it sits was “precisely targeted,” adding that the intensive care unit and the emergency room were hit the worst. For four years, Doctors Without Borders has been using this facility to provide free high level trauma care to civilians in the area.
RELATED: How does a relief worker in the world’s worst war zone find hope?
“For our medical staff, it was an absolutely terrifying experience,” says Hawkins. “The hospital itself had been very busy over the previous days [before the airstrike] — there’s been an uptick in the conflict around Kunduz, and we’ve had 400 patients over the last four days or so.”
According to Doctors Without Borders, more than 22,000 patients received care at the hospital in 2014, and more than 5,900 surgeries were performed during the same time period. When the hospital was hit, medical workers were in midsts of caring for patients.
“After the attack was over, we found one of our patients that was killed still on the operating table,” says Hawkins. “You can imagine for the medical staff that’s going about their night’s work, this is an absolutely a devastating experience for them.”
The group is now planning to leave the area, something that could be devastating to civilians in the area — Hawkins describes the trauma center as a “vital lifeline” for the community.
“A hospital should represent a place of sanctuary — it’s where people come when they’re at their most vulnerable,” she says. “Given the fact that the intensive care unit was targeted, we can presume that the most sick and vulnerable of our patients have been killed.”
But a war crime?
“I don’t think we know yet,” says Charlie Dunlap, a former Deputy Judge Advocate General for the US Air Force. He’s now a professor and director of the Center for Law, Ethics and National Security at Duke University’s Law School. He says even in war time there should be a presumption of innocence until proven guilty.
“What surprises me,” says Dunlap, “about what Doctors Without Borders is saying — an organization I previously had a lot of respect for — is they’re making conclusions before the facts have even been gathered.”
“In war zones there’s a lot of complexity about the application of force,” adds Dunlap, “and (about) what’s going on on the ground. We’ve all heard about the chaos, and fog and friction of war. And that’s what’s going on.”
“We need to assemble the facts before we start making very, very serious accusations against people.”
Doctors Without Borders says there were repeated attacks, about every 15 minutes, over the course of more than an hour. Neighboring buildings were unharmed. “That would seem to indicate that they were deliberately targeting that building,” says Dunlap. “But I don’t know if that means they’re deliberately targeting because it was a hospital.”
“International law does not prohibit conducting an attack, even when you know for an actual fact that civilian casualties will occur. What international law only prohibits is that they not be excessive in relation to the military advantage anticipated. And that’s to preclude incentivizing parties to actually use civilians as human shields. Unfortunately though we’ve seen adversaries who nevertheless do it, and I think that is really one of the complications of 21st century warfare.”
“One of the things we need to look at, is of course whether it (the hospital) was being used in any way by the Taliban as a military position to shoot or launch attacks against Afghan and other allied forces.”
“Then we also have to explore whether a mistake was made,” says Dunlap. “In other words, it’s not a war crime if people are acting reasonably and doing the best they can in what we would all agree would be a very chaotic and difficult situation, and something you don’t want to happen, happens.”
“If a hospital is being used for military purposes, it can become a target. You still have to do a proportionality analysis. In other words, you have to make a determination that the anticipated military advantage you’re going to gain will not cost excessive civilian casualties.”
http://www.mintpressnews.com/doctors-without-borders-calls-us-bombing-of-its-hospital-a-war-crime/210104/
Why did the US launch an airstrike on a hospital run by Doctors Without Borders in Afghanistan, killing 22 people, including three children?
The Pentagon changed its story today, and the humanitarian group demanded an independent international inquiry.
Doctors Without Borders is calling the incident a war crime, an assertion that rankles some experts and has provoked a spirited discussion on Reddit.
“Under the rules of international humanitarian law, a hospital is a hospital and the people inside are patients — to target a medical facility in this way is a violation of that, whatever the circumstances,” Vickie Hawkins, executive director of the UK branch of Doctors Without Borders, tells The Takeaway. “The statements that have been coming out of the Afghan government in the past 24 hours would lead us to believe that there was some kind of intent behind the attack. We can only presume, on this basis, that that constitutes a war crime.”
The US says the strike in Kunduz, which is under investigation, was issued after Afghan forces came under fire near the hospital and then called for help.
“An airstrike was then called to eliminate the Taliban threat and several civilians were accidentally struck,” the American commander in Afghanistan, Gen. John F. Campbell, said during a press briefing Monday. “This is different from the initial reports which indicated that US forces were threatened and that the airstrike was called on their behalf.”
Though the aid group repeatedly said that there had been no fighting around the hospital, the building was hit over and over again, despite the fact that Doctors Without Borders sent the US military the precise GPS coordinates so the hospital could be avoided.
“When the bombing started, we were indeed in contact with military representatives in both Kabul and in Washington, but the bombing continued for another half hour to 40 minutes after those initial calls were made,” says Hawkins.
The hospital is the only facility of its kind in the northeast region of Afghanistan, and Hawkins says the compound where it sits was “precisely targeted,” adding that the intensive care unit and the emergency room were hit the worst. For four years, Doctors Without Borders has been using this facility to provide free high level trauma care to civilians in the area.
RELATED: How does a relief worker in the world’s worst war zone find hope?
“For our medical staff, it was an absolutely terrifying experience,” says Hawkins. “The hospital itself had been very busy over the previous days [before the airstrike] — there’s been an uptick in the conflict around Kunduz, and we’ve had 400 patients over the last four days or so.”
According to Doctors Without Borders, more than 22,000 patients received care at the hospital in 2014, and more than 5,900 surgeries were performed during the same time period. When the hospital was hit, medical workers were in midsts of caring for patients.
“After the attack was over, we found one of our patients that was killed still on the operating table,” says Hawkins. “You can imagine for the medical staff that’s going about their night’s work, this is an absolutely a devastating experience for them.”
The group is now planning to leave the area, something that could be devastating to civilians in the area — Hawkins describes the trauma center as a “vital lifeline” for the community.
“A hospital should represent a place of sanctuary — it’s where people come when they’re at their most vulnerable,” she says. “Given the fact that the intensive care unit was targeted, we can presume that the most sick and vulnerable of our patients have been killed.”
But a war crime?
“I don’t think we know yet,” says Charlie Dunlap, a former Deputy Judge Advocate General for the US Air Force. He’s now a professor and director of the Center for Law, Ethics and National Security at Duke University’s Law School. He says even in war time there should be a presumption of innocence until proven guilty.
“What surprises me,” says Dunlap, “about what Doctors Without Borders is saying — an organization I previously had a lot of respect for — is they’re making conclusions before the facts have even been gathered.”
“In war zones there’s a lot of complexity about the application of force,” adds Dunlap, “and (about) what’s going on on the ground. We’ve all heard about the chaos, and fog and friction of war. And that’s what’s going on.”
“We need to assemble the facts before we start making very, very serious accusations against people.”
Doctors Without Borders says there were repeated attacks, about every 15 minutes, over the course of more than an hour. Neighboring buildings were unharmed. “That would seem to indicate that they were deliberately targeting that building,” says Dunlap. “But I don’t know if that means they’re deliberately targeting because it was a hospital.”
“International law does not prohibit conducting an attack, even when you know for an actual fact that civilian casualties will occur. What international law only prohibits is that they not be excessive in relation to the military advantage anticipated. And that’s to preclude incentivizing parties to actually use civilians as human shields. Unfortunately though we’ve seen adversaries who nevertheless do it, and I think that is really one of the complications of 21st century warfare.”
“One of the things we need to look at, is of course whether it (the hospital) was being used in any way by the Taliban as a military position to shoot or launch attacks against Afghan and other allied forces.”
“Then we also have to explore whether a mistake was made,” says Dunlap. “In other words, it’s not a war crime if people are acting reasonably and doing the best they can in what we would all agree would be a very chaotic and difficult situation, and something you don’t want to happen, happens.”
“If a hospital is being used for military purposes, it can become a target. You still have to do a proportionality analysis. In other words, you have to make a determination that the anticipated military advantage you’re going to gain will not cost excessive civilian casualties.”
http://www.mintpressnews.com/doctors-without-borders-calls-us-bombing-of-its-hospital-a-war-crime/210104/
I agree regarding Jeb's comment. Regardless, imo he has been unimpressive, heck a disappointment so far, I expected better.
At least our current fearless leader apparently thinks everything is hunky dory.
Always time for campaigning(as Rome falls).
-President Obama will visit Seattle on Oct. 9 to raise campaign money for Sen. Patty Murray-
http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlepolitics/2015/09/19/president-obama-will-visit-seattle-on-oct-9-to-raise-campaign-money-for-sen-patty-murray/
At least our current fearless leader apparently thinks everything is hunky dory.
Always time for campaigning(as Rome falls).
-President Obama will visit Seattle on Oct. 9 to raise campaign money for Sen. Patty Murray-
http://blog.seattlepi.com/seattlepolitics/2015/09/19/president-obama-will-visit-seattle-on-oct-9-to-raise-campaign-money-for-sen-patty-murray/
Well since my post was removed FOR NO REASON i will write it again.
Jeb's "stuff happens" comment was very out of context, stop believing the lie spoon feed to you by the media.
Jeb's "stuff happens" comment was very out of context, stop believing the lie spoon feed to you by the media.
Not to mention what Bernie Marx Sanders would have to say.
I'm dreaming there is dark horse who will pop up from somewhere onto the stage and truly be able to lead this country.
Where is David Petraeus hiding?
I'm dreaming there is dark horse who will pop up from somewhere onto the stage and truly be able to lead this country.
Where is David Petraeus hiding?
I agree that it's a tragedy, not a war crime. McCain said it best, "To call that a war crime distorts the definition of a war crime." McCain was the last Republican I voted for. The last Republican I will ever vote for. He has good common sense, experience, and up until he let the GOP foist the Trailer Park Queen off on him, I thought he had integrity. He had the potential to be just as good a President as our current 'Fearless Leader', if not better. Probably much better on foreign policy. Economy? We'll never know.
But I digress. (Sorry Vance. Get someone to explain 'Fearless Leader' to you and we can have a Rocky and Bullwinkle thread,) Can you imagine what Jeb "Stuff happens" Bush would have had to say on this as Leader of the Free World?
But I digress. (Sorry Vance. Get someone to explain 'Fearless Leader' to you and we can have a Rocky and Bullwinkle thread,) Can you imagine what Jeb "Stuff happens" Bush would have had to say on this as Leader of the Free World?
I did not attack you.
Anyway, I am thinking everyone can agree that it is a shame that the hospital was bombed. I can't imagine anyone thinks that is okay. Never more is it driven home how the people of that organization put themselves in harms way to help others. I don't think it is a war crime but is a war tragedy, most definitely.
The topic at hand is never a presidency that ended nearly a decade ago, but mention something about Obama and that old presidency almost always "becomes" the topic at hand very quickly...
" the topic at hand " LOL! :) sorry, but I didn't see "the topic at hand" being a presidency which ended closing in on a decade ago.
Although I think we have no business being in Afghanistan, at least Obama apologized which won't mean much to those who's lives and loved one's lives have been lost.
What he should do is get our military out of there, yesterday.
What he should do is get our military out of there, yesterday.
Please lets stick to the topic at hand instead of attacking me.
WASHINGTON - The top U.S. commander in Afghanistan says the recent airstrike on a hospital in the northern city of Kunduz was a mistake.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-commander-mistake-bombing-afghan-doctors-without-borders-hospital/.
Again, my opinion is we need to get our guns out of there and put that military money to work at home.
WASHINGTON - The top U.S. commander in Afghanistan says the recent airstrike on a hospital in the northern city of Kunduz was a mistake.
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/us-commander-mistake-bombing-afghan-doctors-without-borders-hospital/.
Again, my opinion is we need to get our guns out of there and put that military money to work at home.
So Obama admitted to the war crime. He needs to be brought up on charges. When will all the anti-war liberals stand up and march for his prosecution?
OH-What is the obsession with Bush? What about Clinton bombing Serbia? War crime?
And then we have the resident Obama lap dog with the article to support his war crimes.
OH-What is the obsession with Bush? What about Clinton bombing Serbia? War crime?
And then we have the resident Obama lap dog with the article to support his war crimes.
Not sure if anyone is interested but I just saw this article, could not link it but I am sure the title will bring it up
Obama Issues Rare Apology Over Bombing of Doctors Without Borders Hospital in Afghanistan
Obama Issues Rare Apology Over Bombing of Doctors Without Borders Hospital in Afghanistan
Thank you for information. I don't know how anyone can justify the loss of innocent children, probably doctors and nurses and other innocents killed as well.
I saw the film after the bombing and it was really frightening.
I saw the film after the bombing and it was really frightening.
"though I do think Bush and Cheney should do so as well."
You're like a addict, you continue to lean on an irrelevant crutch of the past.
You're like a addict, you continue to lean on an irrelevant crutch of the past.
http://www.newsmax.com/Newsfront/john-mccain-doctors-without-borders-afghanistan-hospital-bombing/2015/10/07/id/695109/
"Armed Services Committee Chairman Sen. John McCain on Wednesday blasted the classification of the deadly bombing of a Doctors Without Borders hospital in Afghanistan as a war crime.
In an interview with NPR's "Morning Edition," the Arizona Republican called the deaths of 22 people in the accidental strike Saturday a "terrible tragedy" that "would not have occurred if the Taliban had not attacked the place to start with."
"I find it ludicrous and insulting that people would say because of this terrible accident that somehow war crimes are committed," McCain said. "To call that a war crime distorts the definition of a war crime."
The medical charity has condemned the attack as a war crime.
McCain, a former Navy pilot, also defended the use of the AC-130 gunship striking in an urban area.
"The right weapon to choose is the weapon that … most efficiently kills the enemy," he said, adding "I have seen these gunships in action, and they have saved American lives by being able to suppress the enemy and enemy fire."
McCain said the Taliban was in Kanduz, where the bombed hospital was located, and that "it's pretty obvious that fire was coming from the Taliban in the city."
"I'm not saying there was anything but a terrible tragedy, but to think that everything we do is with pinpoint accuracy is a fundamental misunderstanding of what warfare is all about," he said."
"Armed Services Committee Chairman Sen. John McCain on Wednesday blasted the classification of the deadly bombing of a Doctors Without Borders hospital in Afghanistan as a war crime.
In an interview with NPR's "Morning Edition," the Arizona Republican called the deaths of 22 people in the accidental strike Saturday a "terrible tragedy" that "would not have occurred if the Taliban had not attacked the place to start with."
"I find it ludicrous and insulting that people would say because of this terrible accident that somehow war crimes are committed," McCain said. "To call that a war crime distorts the definition of a war crime."
The medical charity has condemned the attack as a war crime.
McCain, a former Navy pilot, also defended the use of the AC-130 gunship striking in an urban area.
"The right weapon to choose is the weapon that … most efficiently kills the enemy," he said, adding "I have seen these gunships in action, and they have saved American lives by being able to suppress the enemy and enemy fire."
McCain said the Taliban was in Kanduz, where the bombed hospital was located, and that "it's pretty obvious that fire was coming from the Taliban in the city."
"I'm not saying there was anything but a terrible tragedy, but to think that everything we do is with pinpoint accuracy is a fundamental misunderstanding of what warfare is all about," he said."
That was one of the comments in the article made by Charlie Dunlap in assessing whether a mistake had been made, or if war crimes had been committed... If the Taliban were using the hospital as a military position to shoot or launch attacks, then not everyone was innocent and as a military position it would be subject to attack.
If there were Taliban in the hospital would that make it okay to bomb it and kill the innocent ?
And yes, Vance, I have nothing against Obama going up for war crimes though I do think Bush and Cheney should do so as well.
Personally, I want us to take all that military money and get out of those countries, bring that cash home and improve the US, with jobs, including improving our infrastructure and education.
And yes, Vance, I have nothing against Obama going up for war crimes though I do think Bush and Cheney should do so as well.
Personally, I want us to take all that military money and get out of those countries, bring that cash home and improve the US, with jobs, including improving our infrastructure and education.
“One of the things we need to look at, is of course whether it (the hospital) was being used in any way by the Taliban as a military position to shoot or launch attacks against Afghan and other allied forces.”
It's a war, wars are messy.
So you would be for the prosecution of Obama for war crimes?
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