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Exercise During Treatment
I am not sure if anyone has heard this before but I was speaking with a physician friend who has a PhD in biochemistry and complaining I hadnt felt much like exercising since I started treatment a few days ago. Well, I just had a very interesting discussion with a physician friend of mine who has a PhD in biochemistry. She said that it is better if I dont exercise except easy walking for detox purposes and sleep is good since the liver has more oxygenated blood available to it without having to share it with the muscles. Oxygen is used only for basic metaboic functions. As well, the occasional exerciser like me might have lactic acid buildup and other metabolites to be processed by the liver giving it more work to do at this critical time. She says better to rest and allow liver to process the drug uninterfered with by demands from other organs. Also the kidneys work better in a horizontal position for the purposes of detox. Also there have been studies she said that show liver enzymes are increased with deep tissue massage! Wah! Boo hoo!!! Never thought of it that way. And I got a massage the day after treatment start. Back to meditation and prayer methinks. What does everyone think of this information?
Thanks for the info! I'm going to ask my doctor about my HGB level next week because I have no idea what it is.
Yes Mike I have worked all along and am up to my 30th wk of tx with Peg and Riba. By design I did take the first two wks off to get adjusted. The first few wks were the worst for side effects, but everyone is different. To do continual heavy labor would be impossible for me. My most strenuous task in the day is to carry a tool box to the top of a 25ft tank or to chain up my tanker in the mud. But when my heart feels strained I have the luxury to slow down. These meds give me insomnia and it got so bad a couple wks ago that I drove down the wrong road and got lost for awhile. The funny thing is that I had to drive past a "No Trucks Allowed" sign to go onto the wrong road :-). I also get tired and stressed quickly if there is an unusual problem or dilemma. Good Luck to you.
Do you know what your HGB level is? If you do have "hemolytic anemia" which means an HGB of less then 10, then that would cause the breathlessness you described above.
Anemia can put strain on the heart, so gentle exercise, which doesn't produce breathlessness is the safe route to go with. When we have anemia, it correlates to the altitude, so if you are hiking up into the hills, that would make you feel more dizzy, the higher you climbed.
When I was on Treatment, I had this, so I had to take Procrit shots, also known as EPO, which is what the cyclists (Lance Armstrong and others) use, when they race up steep hills, etc
Anemia can put strain on the heart, so gentle exercise, which doesn't produce breathlessness is the safe route to go with. When we have anemia, it correlates to the altitude, so if you are hiking up into the hills, that would make you feel more dizzy, the higher you climbed.
When I was on Treatment, I had this, so I had to take Procrit shots, also known as EPO, which is what the cyclists (Lance Armstrong and others) use, when they race up steep hills, etc
Tomorrow will be week 13 (today is my last day of Incivek!!). I walk and hike but I did cancel my gym membership because I felt like for me personally that was too much (and I hadn't used it for months before tx so I probably shouldn't start now). My doctor thinks it's great that I'm getting out and being active/doing things. She said you do lose a lot of muscle mass with this tx so if you can get out and do some light exercising then you should, but not to push yourself too hard. There have been some times while hiking some steep inclines that I just couldn't catch my breath and got pretty dizzy (thank you low red blood cells). My body physically felt like I could keep going but my lungs/breathing couldn't handle it. I was a little scared being in the middle of the woods all alone thinking I might pass out. I was told if I did pass out I would wake up within a few minutes, but I shouldn't be pushing myself to that point. I need to listen to my body and rest when it needs to rest but definitely continue to exercise if I feel good enough to do it. Honestly getting outside and out of the house and doing something makes me feel awesome! Some times it takes a little push to motivate myself to do it but once I'm out there walking/hiking I'm so happy I threw my shoes on and got motivated...but other times I am just as happy to be snuggled up with a good book in bed! lol :)
I tried to work but that lasted only about 4 days.My work is also very physically demanding working in busy hospital long hours pushing patients,beds,heavy equipment .My employer offered family leave for 3mont hs while I can keep their group insurance.and now week 14 I start feeling better and thinking of going back soon for shorter hours.This Tx is my priority now and everything else follows at the same time I have to make sure I do not loose my insurance .Stay at home take care of yourself .Check with your employer what they offer,some offer also short term dissability or more
My husband and I were just having this conversation today about exercise and tx. I hope to be able to cont, certainly not on the level I was at when I started tx but when I started thursday I have been running an hour each day and plan to cont as long as I can. That means though I will not push myself hard. I know when enough is enough. I also plan to cont with pilates, yoga and body blast class which is light weights. When I am to tired, I won't go. But for me it's mostly a mental benefit. Clears my head and gets me out of me. I trail run in the woods with my dogs and can not think of a better way to spend an hour. I really want to not have to give in to AD's if it should come to that, and it won't as long as I get outside.
So glad this post popped back up! I work 8-10 hour days n bring paperwork home. After shot 11 last night, I Woke up at noon. My daughter came by n saw my house n literally is storing my furniture n moving me in w her. Hgm 8 - still fighting for procrit etc. Dropped the gym membership n sleep most of the weekend.
My daughter knows me best n she's super energy girl, like me. She's gathered friends n family (who I can fool on the phone) and they ALL said, in chorus: " you're UND. If you're going to work full time, sleep n let us do the rest."
I had 2 weeks of laundry piled up. Lol. I have a large wardrobe n can get by with it.
I'm giving in. And gonna go lay on the couch. I've Never had to be taken care of. Gosh pride is strong. I'm rambling. But my muscle mass is good. I work in a huge building w stairs. I'll get strong again after tx.
Accepting the truth. Ouch. Xo Karen :)
My daughter knows me best n she's super energy girl, like me. She's gathered friends n family (who I can fool on the phone) and they ALL said, in chorus: " you're UND. If you're going to work full time, sleep n let us do the rest."
I had 2 weeks of laundry piled up. Lol. I have a large wardrobe n can get by with it.
I'm giving in. And gonna go lay on the couch. I've Never had to be taken care of. Gosh pride is strong. I'm rambling. But my muscle mass is good. I work in a huge building w stairs. I'll get strong again after tx.
Accepting the truth. Ouch. Xo Karen :)
Willy there are a LOT of good answers to this post. I asked at the beginning of treatment and when they asked me to pick a best answer it was at the beginning for the responses. I didn't think this would generate so many responses. The bottom line is that exercise is good for one undr certain conditions and with certain exercise and not so good for another given another set of circumstances. Which is like saying that my friend was probably wrong. Once you take a powerful drug or drugs it plows through everything depending on your own genetic code whether you like it or not and regardless of most else you do (except maybe drink and do drugs).
I still go to the gym twice a week to do some weight lifting. I am disciplined by my fatigue into being slow and easy plus I'm not very anabolic right now...Exercise has always been one of my best friends and nows not the time to give it up even if I am in slow motion. Triple therapy makes me feel old, and near death, and depressed so I need all the friends I can get right now.....p.s. on this particular issue my post is a declaration rather than a request for others to speculate on what is best for my body. My best. d
Oops. Not even in the sidebar anymore. It's been moved to the bottom of the page and made even smaller.
Your worst 'grumpy' answer still usually beats my best attempt at 'soft'.
Which speaks volumes about both of us ;-)
Agree that the 'best answer' feature is way more noticeable than the fine print MH disclaimer in the left sidebar.
Which speaks volumes about both of us ;-)
Agree that the 'best answer' feature is way more noticeable than the fine print MH disclaimer in the left sidebar.
Almost immediately after posting I wanted to soften my post.
The thing is..... I think the advice is generally good;
maybe walk instead of run, don't push too hard, appropriate diet etc. It's hard to fault that.
I just am a grump about the "best answer" feature since I think it serves to suggest an answer is correct, or the truest or most factual or on target.
I think what it REALLY means is "my favorite answer". It makes me nuts sometimes since in a medical forum one....especially a newbie could easily confuse the "best answer" with appropriate medical advice.
So I felt moved to comment and the are other active threads right now where people try to insert their viewpoint when opinion becomes dressed up as fact. Anymore..... I'm just used to knowing that whatever we think we understand today will be proven false tomorrow.
Anyway......I didn't have so much issue with the advice on exercise or diet other than that it should not be taken to be universally appropriate for all of us. I just wanted to add some qualifiers.
One other think that came up recently was I heard of an all oral trial participant that was becoming anemic. It makes sense, and I don't know why I expected all oral to be a cake walk but it just points out we all respond differently and that even the new trials may have some tough side effects.
I also wanted to add that I think it is possible to over exercise while on TX. Seems like I read a little on it when a past member kept doing marathons while on TX. I know; sounds incredible.
I also wanted to mention what I thought I understood was that extreme exercise can also raise LFT's. Exercise after all tears down muscle and I thought that I understood that this tissue destruction could cause a brief raising of LFT's. I believe that this was one of the reason they used to detect heart attacks w/ (I think) ALT. For this reason remember.....if you are getting some blood tests (like LFT's) no extreme exercise first since it could skew your results. I looked into this after running a competitive 5K race and then getting my blood drawn a few days later. Not the best idea.....
My apologies for being grumpy, but it was in the interest of qualifying things a little.
best,
Willy
The thing is..... I think the advice is generally good;
maybe walk instead of run, don't push too hard, appropriate diet etc. It's hard to fault that.
I just am a grump about the "best answer" feature since I think it serves to suggest an answer is correct, or the truest or most factual or on target.
I think what it REALLY means is "my favorite answer". It makes me nuts sometimes since in a medical forum one....especially a newbie could easily confuse the "best answer" with appropriate medical advice.
So I felt moved to comment and the are other active threads right now where people try to insert their viewpoint when opinion becomes dressed up as fact. Anymore..... I'm just used to knowing that whatever we think we understand today will be proven false tomorrow.
Anyway......I didn't have so much issue with the advice on exercise or diet other than that it should not be taken to be universally appropriate for all of us. I just wanted to add some qualifiers.
One other think that came up recently was I heard of an all oral trial participant that was becoming anemic. It makes sense, and I don't know why I expected all oral to be a cake walk but it just points out we all respond differently and that even the new trials may have some tough side effects.
I also wanted to add that I think it is possible to over exercise while on TX. Seems like I read a little on it when a past member kept doing marathons while on TX. I know; sounds incredible.
I also wanted to mention what I thought I understood was that extreme exercise can also raise LFT's. Exercise after all tears down muscle and I thought that I understood that this tissue destruction could cause a brief raising of LFT's. I believe that this was one of the reason they used to detect heart attacks w/ (I think) ALT. For this reason remember.....if you are getting some blood tests (like LFT's) no extreme exercise first since it could skew your results. I looked into this after running a competitive 5K race and then getting my blood drawn a few days later. Not the best idea.....
My apologies for being grumpy, but it was in the interest of qualifying things a little.
best,
Willy
The benefits of an easy yoga class is profound. The whole mind body connection.
Just read the book " ph miracle" it is alot of greens but I eat it like it's going to save my life. You couldn't pay me to eat fried food but do crave steak and salmon just small perfect fist sized portions. I also drink ph water (9.5) from health food store, I fill 1 gallon containers for about 2 bucks. I drink 3 liters a day. Again it's medicine. Just drink it. <3 to fellow tx ers.
Just read the book " ph miracle" it is alot of greens but I eat it like it's going to save my life. You couldn't pay me to eat fried food but do crave steak and salmon just small perfect fist sized portions. I also drink ph water (9.5) from health food store, I fill 1 gallon containers for about 2 bucks. I drink 3 liters a day. Again it's medicine. Just drink it. <3 to fellow tx ers.
I think what Willy and desrt are saying bears repeating, Everyone's treatment regimen is different. This is even more true now than it was when I treated.
The patients themselves are all different and unique. They have different pre-existing conditions, and different levels of liver damage. More and more, there are patients who are repeat treaters and they may have issues due to previous treatments.
It's unrealistic and unreasonable to expect all comers to tx to respond in the same manner when talking about any aspect of tx.
And there are many types of healthy exercise and many types of healthy foods that can comprise a diet. All of that is also very individual. And all of it may fly straight out the window if you're too weak to get out of bed, or if your sense of taste and smell changes during tx.
The patients themselves are all different and unique. They have different pre-existing conditions, and different levels of liver damage. More and more, there are patients who are repeat treaters and they may have issues due to previous treatments.
It's unrealistic and unreasonable to expect all comers to tx to respond in the same manner when talking about any aspect of tx.
And there are many types of healthy exercise and many types of healthy foods that can comprise a diet. All of that is also very individual. And all of it may fly straight out the window if you're too weak to get out of bed, or if your sense of taste and smell changes during tx.
Agree with Willy. This is one of those things that should be discussed with your Rxing physician - not taken as a "one-size-fits-all" recommendation off an internet message board.
I did a *brisk* 45 minute walk 3 or 4 times a week strictly as a way to try control my serotonin levels. But my red and white cell counts barely budged out of normal range during tx and I was getting plenty of other types of exercise from my job. To suggest what worked for me would be appropriate from someone like Billy or someone who faints just standing up, would be sorta silly.
I did a *brisk* 45 minute walk 3 or 4 times a week strictly as a way to try control my serotonin levels. But my red and white cell counts barely budged out of normal range during tx and I was getting plenty of other types of exercise from my job. To suggest what worked for me would be appropriate from someone like Billy or someone who faints just standing up, would be sorta silly.
BTW - I am now 6 weeks post tx, the muscle tone is returning and I climbed a good sized hill Saturday. What you lose during tx is not gone forever so don't beat yourself up if you can't continue with your routines.
I couldn't agree more. As I said in an earlier post, I had the best of intentions to stay in shape, eat well, and get through with minimal side effects - after all, I was in top physical condition. Well that grandstanding lasted until the day after my first shot !!!! HA HA . You can't, CAN'T really even walk across the yard with your HGB in the 8"s and I don't want to see people on this forum feel badly or like they are a failure because they can't do what "Joe" can. I was like your friend. I fainted in my boss' office on the first day of a new job.
We are sharing our personal experiences, strength and hope. There is great information on this forum, however, while there are many similarities, we are affected so differently. If I at 125 pounds am on the same dosages as "Joe" who is 210 pounds, then I am presumably going to have a tougher time. Sorry if there is actually a "Joe" out there.
This is not one size fits all
We are sharing our personal experiences, strength and hope. There is great information on this forum, however, while there are many similarities, we are affected so differently. If I at 125 pounds am on the same dosages as "Joe" who is 210 pounds, then I am presumably going to have a tougher time. Sorry if there is actually a "Joe" out there.
This is not one size fits all
When I read this I see a lot of opinions, but little that provides substantiated fact. The "best answer" annoying feature of MH seems to sanctify that answer and comes as close to providing medical advice w/ a MedHelp seal of approval. After all...... it's the "best answer" is it not?
It *must* be true.
If the friend has a PHD in biochemistry, they must be right?
The way I look at it is this;
Many people are on VERY different forms of treatment, Yes? How does one assert what type of exercise and how much is appropriate for all? Keep in mind some of these trials could even be discontinued; I've seen some withdrawn from FDA testing. And yet.... not knowing what side effects one may experience one is prepared to suggest a course of action without any real knowledge of the drugs one is taking, the condition of the person on TX (what stage, what other extrahepatic conditions or co-morbidities).
The best answer also seems to suggest alkaline diet as part of the "best answer".
Good grief!! How do people who "know" these things end up coming to know them?
I don't mind using the forum to voice opinions, but this thread comes a little close to providing them as a one-size-fits-all FACT.
IMHO...... some people who are really anemic should not embark on walking for exercise. I have a friend who was on TX who passed out just standing up and broke out her front teeth.
Regarding exercise....there is evidence on both sides, but keep in mind; not all data transfers to people w/ HCV, or people w/ advanced liver issues, or people on TX in various conditions, or people on new experimental therapies. I would try to make a more clear distinction between opinion and presenting things as fact, even if it is possibly good advice and well intended.
my 2 cents.
willy
It *must* be true.
If the friend has a PHD in biochemistry, they must be right?
The way I look at it is this;
Many people are on VERY different forms of treatment, Yes? How does one assert what type of exercise and how much is appropriate for all? Keep in mind some of these trials could even be discontinued; I've seen some withdrawn from FDA testing. And yet.... not knowing what side effects one may experience one is prepared to suggest a course of action without any real knowledge of the drugs one is taking, the condition of the person on TX (what stage, what other extrahepatic conditions or co-morbidities).
The best answer also seems to suggest alkaline diet as part of the "best answer".
Good grief!! How do people who "know" these things end up coming to know them?
I don't mind using the forum to voice opinions, but this thread comes a little close to providing them as a one-size-fits-all FACT.
IMHO...... some people who are really anemic should not embark on walking for exercise. I have a friend who was on TX who passed out just standing up and broke out her front teeth.
Regarding exercise....there is evidence on both sides, but keep in mind; not all data transfers to people w/ HCV, or people w/ advanced liver issues, or people on TX in various conditions, or people on new experimental therapies. I would try to make a more clear distinction between opinion and presenting things as fact, even if it is possibly good advice and well intended.
my 2 cents.
willy
" The drugs are going to do their job one way or another or not"
I much agree which is why I continued thruout tx and post to exercise
according to comfort level.
There is zero proof that exercise has any negative impact on SVR
however there is tons of proof that exercise improves overall health
including strengthening of immune system.
My philosophy was to be in the best shape coming out of tx as possible
with or without SVR. Life goes on...
As a result I am in better shape after 60wks of a beefed up tx
than a lot of "non-HepC" people.
:-)
Cheers
b
I much agree which is why I continued thruout tx and post to exercise
according to comfort level.
There is zero proof that exercise has any negative impact on SVR
however there is tons of proof that exercise improves overall health
including strengthening of immune system.
My philosophy was to be in the best shape coming out of tx as possible
with or without SVR. Life goes on...
As a result I am in better shape after 60wks of a beefed up tx
than a lot of "non-HepC" people.
:-)
Cheers
b
I posted this question some time ago just as I was initiating treatment. My only real side effect from my all oral is fatigue and it is occasional. I occasionally work out and occasionally nap. I went undetectable at Day 12 or 13. I now don't think it matters if you exercise or sleep or have a good diet or bad, xcept for comfort level, The drugs are going to do their job one way or another or not.
I say listen to your body. My muscles get very fatiqued during treatment. I was doing 40 mins of Zumba 4 days a week and told myself I would continue thrtu treatment. Wrong I just can't do it. i walk a little and I also live in a 2 story home and my washer and dryer are in the cellar so that's my stair climber. My goal is to just make it 48 weeks and clear this damn virus.
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alkaline diet is great....i do as best as I can for the same reasons.....wean yourself slowly...your body may freak out.....it is alkaline versus acid....best to consume between 65-70-80% alkaline foods and 35-30-20% acid foods.....you'll be amazed at what is acid, and what is alkaline.....it took some time, but I like it.....gluten-free mostly....and it's very delish...:) surprise. if you look online you can find lists of foods, or if you send me your email, i can scan mine and send it to you :)