Is cheapness a sign of unappreciation?

[Amiaskingtoomuch]

Ladies and Gentlemen please, PLEASE, help me!!!!

Ok SO- I am so confused. I have been with my boyfriend for 2 yrs now and I have such mixed feelings. He is very polite, family oriented (they love me), has a good job (paramedci/FF), takes care of his body (super attractive), very financially responsible (good credit/home owner/nice truck that is paid off), and loves children (therefor will be a good father). So he appears to have everything a woman strives to find!!! There is one problem though. He is SO STINGY when it comes to spending money.

I have tried NOT to take it personal up until this point, but the more I talk to my friends and family about it the more I am starting to let it get to me. He admits he is very frugal and a "saver not a spender". GREAT, I am all about watching your funds so you don't fall into debt. But since we have started dating he has increasingly become more hesitant with getting out his wallet, for ANYTHING. Dinners out are SO awkward. I pay half of the time just so I can get it over with, but then I am left feeling irritable afterwards since I was raised a true gentleman will never expect the lady to pick up the tab. He used to bring me "just because" flowers when we first started dating or a coffee in the mornings but that came to an end after about 6 months- which was when we moved in together. Too soon...MISTAKE, I know. Our first xmas he spent 30$ on me, our second one he suggested skipping presents so we could go on a vacation. It didn't happen until 7 months after xmas after I begged him about 20 times to go somewhere together. My bday is 2 days before Valentines Day- the first bday he spent about 20$ on me... and the other bdayhe skipped and Vdays he got me a chocolate bar 3 days AFTER it passed.

To wrap this up, it's not about the amount he spent on me.. okay well maybe it is a little. It's more about his lack of thought that really bothers me. He hasn't got me a "just because" gift since we moved in together. If I bring it up or try and say in a cute playful voice... "I used to love the coffees you would surprise me with" he gets very annoyed and tells me he doesn't have a money tree. YET after we moved in together he has been on 2 trips with "the guys" totalling about 1200 dollars and buys himself new outdoor fishing poles, kiyaks, workout machines, recently some hunting property, etc.... but still claims he id sorry he "just has no extra funds to take me out".

I don't consider myself to be a bad catch at all. I am very independent (as far as fixing things on my own, paying my own personal bills on time, and just holding myself accountable for my actions). I feel I'm an attractive woman,I workout everyday, I'm extremely goal driven with my career, responsible, funny, family oriented, and selfless. I buy him little things here and there and have also said "Hunny get ready I'm taking YOU out to a nice fancy dinner tonight, let's get dressed up and try somewhere new", with hopes he will reciprocate in the near future. Nope, nothing!

Do you think he is just not into me or is this just his personality and he will never change? Should I try I different approach?? My stomach turns even asking him to open his wallet and it is really making me consider if I want to have a family and marry someone like this. I guess I just assume if a guy really loves his woman he would sacrifice his personal wants in order to make her happy. It's not like I am EVER cheap with him, I have a job, am still in school, and in a few years I will be making double his salary... but I have told him that I was raised that the man is the financial provider and the woman is the homemaker and nurturer- even though I am not a sit at home and bake cookies housewife type by all means.

[Londres70]

Glad I could make your day and gave you a chuckle.  :<))  The silly things we put up with in the name of "love."

You are by NO means "nuts" or "crazy" or "being over-dramatic" and don't let anyone tell you that you are including HIM.  And consider this PERSONAL because it is.  

Do not start any garden for "us."  Hey, if he wants to do it....let him do it by himself.  If he wants to "beautify" HIS house....let him.  Yeah, I don't know what the deal is with having a "garden" with these no-good men.  Is he that inconsiderate and clueless in regards to the fact your week is heavy and you have very little free time?  Sounds like he is.  A garden is ALOT of work and who says you want to be taking your free time dealing with/working in a darn garden?  

BTW:  You know you have "true love" when both parties DO sacrifice and compromise when they need to......unfortunately, you DON'T have this now.

I shared my story with you because I wanted you to know that you AREN'T alone.  I am very embarrassed that I actually let this situation happen to me, but it did.  

This guy you are with is definitely NO great match for you and don't waste anymore time dealing with this.  I can tell you there are GREAT ones out there that like to pamper and value the woman they are with.  I found one and married him.  I spoil him a great deal and it is ALWAYS reciprocated.  These men DO exist and you are WORTHY enough to have one.  

[Amiaskingtoomuch]

Ohhhh your post just made my day! Your situation in the house where you were doing all of that plus had a 12 hour day sounds identical to mine! I laughed out loud when you mentioned a garden.. he has been asking me to start one for "us", like I have a ton of free time. I do 13 hour days between school and work Mon-Fri, and work most weekends also. Thank you thank you thank you! All this advice is great. I think I already know what I need to do deep down inside, it just helps a lot hearing it from an outside point of view. I just want to make sure I am not crazy or being over-dramatic about how his actions reflect that I am more of an option to him. I have always thought "true love" is when both people are willing to sacrifice their wants in order to fulfill their partners wants. I've been trying to do all I can but I'm feeling a little left out in the cold here! It's hard not to take it personal when I know I am doing my best.

[Londres70]

Somehow I missed reading the important bits in your initial post.....shame on me.  

The situation with him purchasing a home without your thoughts or consideration FURTHER away was a big red flag after you both had been in an apartment for ONLY 5 months.  You should have stayed in the apartment and let him move into his house.  

I have also experienced or had woes with a relationship where it was more about the money than the relationship/love.  I was living in an apartment and dating a man who owned a home.  Well, we finally agreed that I should move in and pay him the rent that I was paying for the apartment which was more than generous.  He also agreed that I didn't have to pay for any utilities and that he would use my rent money as he saw fit in regards to maintaining his home.  Everything was ok for about 5-6 months.  Then, all of a sudden he wanted me to pay for groceries for both of us, electric bills, gas bills, water bills, etc. and the rent money too.  Plus, I was doing most of the household chores and he was doing really NOTHING.  I mean, this was HIS house.  Hell, I was working in his garden, doing household chores, cooking, baking and don't forget my 12 hour work days. Then, he was proposing I help him out with his mortgage.  What?  My name wasn't even on the deed. The straw that broke the camels back was when we went to McDonald's for a sandwich and a coffee.  After I ordered my sandwich, he said....."Why do you ALWAYS have to order the most expense sandwich on the menu?"  What?  We are talking McDonalds.....I thought is he kidding?  The sad thing was he wasn't.

I finally broke things off and never saw him again.  Come to find out he was late paying "this and that," had refinanced his house 2x trying to help his GROWN son obtain his Master's degree and figured I was his buffer.  Hey, I didn't want to be any "home owner" yet and I wasn't going to "bank roll" a bf due to the fact he was in debt up to his eyeballs trying to financially help out a GROWN child that wasn't mine.  Plus, this bf would go out and buy lavish things for HIMSELF and skimp when it came to me or situations that weren't worthy of his money.  

Moral of the story......make sure you are COMPLETELY compatible when it comes to finances and money.  If you aren't, it isn't going to change or work out.  

I can't really say cheapness is a sign of unappreciation.....I can say that how someone spends money has alot to do with if he/she thinks the situation or person is WORTHY of their $$$$.  I mean, he purchases a house, but has a difficult time getting his wallet out to pay for a meal in a restaurant?  Buys you a chocolate bar (a measly chocolate bar) after Vday is passed?  Buys himself thousands of dollars of things for himself and tells you he is no money tree?  Skipping Bday gifts?  Dear, don't walk, but RUN.  Sounds like he doesn't think much of you.  

You don't need to pay a "psychic" to tell you what this means or where this is leading.....it is crystal clear.  He just doesn't value you.  After 2 years and the situation is reduced to this.......it's not going to work.

You know you got it good when a man spends the same amount of money on himself on you or even more.......that's what I recommend you look for; someone who VALUES you and enjoys pampering you.  

[Londres70]

Amen!

[TTinKKerBBell]

Dear Amiaskingtoomuch,
Yes, I think You ARE Asking Too Much.  I don't think Your wishes and desires are wrong, NOT AT ALL!! - but I do think it is a Mistake to ask it of SomeOne who doesn't Operate/Think/Feel the same as You.  His traits sound very admirable and I think that's wonderful - BUT, if He cannot fulfill Your OTHER Wants/Needs/Desires - then He is NOT "the" one for You.  He's NOT wrong to feel the way He does - it works for Him.  And You are not wrong to Desire what You Desire but, apparently He cannot/will not provide what You are wanting.  You need to have a Relationship with SomeOne You are more compatible with.  He knows what You want - You've told Him - if there has BEEN no change then, there will BE no change.  Don't make YourSelf and Him unhappy over this - just find SomeOne more compatible.  Love is a CHOICE - so, CHOOSE SomeOne who makes You happy.  In fact, that IS what we ALL should do - Love SomeOne who has the same Values,Wants,Desires,Wishes,Goals, etc., etc., that we have.   Anything short of that is not CHOOSING wisely.

God Created Dating So We Could Discover The Bad News About A Man BEFORE We Get Involved With Him - Not AFTER!!

I think You would be wise to move on.
Regards,
Tink

[Amiaskingtoomuch]

I loved what you had to say. Thank you!

Sadly, you are right when you say that I am more like a roomate. That's kind of how I feel. It is crazy though the fact that he talks about wanting to have kids soon and be a family, yet can't even take me out once a month without making me feel like I am asking too much. Children are NOT CHEAP... and he is. There is NO WAY in the world I am going to have children with someone that can't even make me feel like they could take care of me if something were to happen, heaven forbid.

I can admit, I am frugal too. I watch what I spend, know how much is coming in and how much I can afford to put out. But since I have met him I have allowed myself to splurge a little more when I see something I know he would like. It is just natural for me and it makes me feel good. But when I don't feel like a thought ever crosses his mind that I would like something nice every once in a while.. it makes me question why. Like I am not worth spending a little extra on. I'm not trying to ask for a diamond necklace here, just even a pair of sandals or a picture frame with us in it would make my heart flutter!

I never ever would marry someone that wants mine and yours accounts.That's just how I was raised. I know I am going to make more than him, and I'd give him access to everything I had in it if he would show me now that he thinks I'm worth thinking about. The thing is, I have told him. I have send him links from AskMen.com on what little things guys can do to make a woman's day. I get laughed at! I'm trying to do it, excuse my language, in a non bitchy way. Nothing seems to work though. Maybe I should just take a step back and get my own place again. If he wants me he will fight to keep me. If not, I'll find another fish in the sea as much as it will break my heart.

[Amiaskingtoomuch]

Thank you so much for taking the time to read my issues. It really means a lot. I know my friends are tired of hearing me stress so that's why I reverted to this. I hate being a debbie downer but I am to the point where I am about to go see a Psychic to see if she can give me some light here!

I have never lived with a guy and my gut feeling was not to move in with him that soon. It was convenient however because both of our leases were up and we were driving 40 minutes to see each other, yet worked in the same exact area. We picked out an apartment together. About 5 months later though he put an offer on a house- without me even seeing it in a town that was an hour away. He got the house and that is where we live now. I refuse to pay him rent due to the fact that I was not ready to be a homeowner, I am not gaining equity b/c my name is not on it- nor will it be unless I am married, and I now have to drive an hour to work and school every day. I told him both before the move and once we were in the house that I was not going to pay for anything in the house that could not be sold and liqiudated if anything were to happen between us. I have paid for ALL groceries, his and my toiletries, internet, decorations, new furniture,etc.. but no rent whatsoever. Maybe that has made him resentful to spending anything on me?? I don't know. I have asked him before if he feels I am not entitled to his money being spent on me because I don't make as much as him. He said "ya kinda."

His parents make great money. They make jokes all of the time how [the mom's] side of the family has a reputation of being cheap... but THEY don't seem to be stingy ever- they always are going on vacations, out to dinner, having people over, etc.  So I really don't know where my bf gets it from.

As far as his other characteristics, he is a warm, loving person to a certain degree. He is not at all affectionate unless it is just me and him in the house. I am not a 'come on over here in the middle of the restaurant and lay one on me' type of person either, but I do long for a hand on the knee or an arm around the waste when entering or exiting a room... which he would never do. If other people are around even a hug is awkward to him.
He is pretty quiet by nature which is completely opposite of me. I am a very confident person, love socializing, and making new friends- which that could explain our personality differences. I think we balance one another though.

He often cooks before I get home from work if he is not at the station that day but when he picks up around the house it is only his stuff.. he will leave mine for me to do... even though I do his laundry and dishes if he hasn't got around to it yet.

Those things though don't even really bother me... it's more just the money! Am I wrong for wanting him to spend money on me??Please be honest with me. I know we aren't rolling in the dough here but I want to be shown off. I want to get dressed up and go walk around the town or heck, even be taken out on a nice little picnic. I told him I would love a picnic by the lake the other day and he started laughing at me. I think you are right... I'm screwed! The more I write the more I realize I think you are dead on. I need to just tell him and if he doesn't want to budge, I'm going to need to put it in reverse here.

Thank you! You're reply made me laugh and at the same time gave me some wonderful advice.

:)

[Londres70]

"Do you think he is just not into me or is this just his personality and he will never change? Should I try I different approach?? My stomach turns even asking him to open his wallet and it is really making me consider if I want to have a family and marry someone like this."......I would lean towards this is how he is and he isn't probably going to change, however, he may compromise in regards to this.  

Have you tried taking to him about this?

I don't think "cheapness" is a always a sign of unappreciation.....people can view money and finances so differently.....sounds like your situation.

[4slenderthread]

Hi there!

I have to say that specialmom had some very good points. I too am married to a 'frugal' husband - but then, so am I ... although my kids just say I'm cheap ... so be it! :-)  I am truly sorry for the predicament that you are in.It doesn’t surprise me that he stopped ‘courting’ you after you moved in together. He no longer feels the need to impress you; not that he was all that impressive to begin with, based on what you wrote. Do you know if anyone else, his mother or father for instance, behave the way he does?? I ask because I can’t help but wonder if this is ‘learned behavior’ on his part.
I honestly have to admit that I don’t see him changing his ways. It sounds as though you have made all the right comments and dropped all the right hints … and zip, nothing. Specialmom appears to be correct. He does see you more as a roommate rather than a girlfriend. I can’t say how sorry I am … there is nothing worse than trying to get something from someone and they just won’t give it. I have been where you are now, believe me, I understand your situation. However, you didn’t mention how he treats you the remainder of the time. For instance, when you aren’t dealing with money issues, how does he make you feel? Is he warm, considerate or affectionate? You wrote about his being responsible, his job, and how attractive he is … but nothing about how he treats you or whether he tries to make you feel special and cared for. Personally, those trips he takes with his buddies would be the short end of the straw for me. That and how he isn’t cheap with himself it seems, just with everyone else!
Do the two of you ever have conversations about where your relationship is going?? If not, I can understand why you are all mixed up! Did the two of you move into a place you picked out together? I’m curious as to whether you moved into his place. I have a personal saying that I really believe in: Don’t listen to what people say … watch what they DO.  Words can be just as cheap as your boyfriend …  but a person’s actions (or lack of them) will show you exactly where they are coming from. But after reading your post a second time, I think you have your own concerns when it comes to your future together and you have every right to be worried.
Personally, I would sit him down and tell him exactly how his behavior makes you feel. But I would be prepared for him to ‘close up’ on you. The truth is, I also would not have a conversation with him unless I was completely prepared to move out. If that doesn’t bring him around, then you haven’t loss a great deal – in fact, you will have saved yourself a great deal of heartache and frustration over time. I wish I had different advice to give, but I am concerned for you, and I hate to see anyone being taken advantage of!
I hope you will please feel free to message me if you need someone to talk with …
I am wishing you the very best. Take care sweetie!    

[specialmom]

Hm.  Well, when I started dating my now husband, I paid half the time.  I was a career woman and why wouldn't I?  I think in this day and age, when both people work, women do pay their fair share.  I expected to without feeling like my boyfriend at the time wasn't a gentlemen.  We were equals.  

My husband is also not great at gifts.  He never did the 'just because' gifts.  His idea of birthday and Christmas was different than mine for sure.  

I tell you this because of what our relationship has evolved into.  Before marrying, we had a 'business' discussion about marriage.  We agreed that I worked until we had kids but that we would try to live on one salary.  We agreed that when we had kids, I'd stay at home with them (which I now do).  We agreed to share finances and to be a family (which we are).  

My husband now pays all of our bills.  I also am able to buy myself things as I need it ---  my own 'just because' gifts.  No big deal.  He just doesn't operate where gifts say that much and shows me love in many other ways.  For christmas and birthdays----  I give him exact details of what I would like (sometimes complete with pics, price and where to get it).  He loves that as he is not a shopper and frankly, whew . . .  what he gets on his own is scary.  (I could tell you about our first married Christmas which is pretty funny actually).  He is generous in every way to our children and I need nothing.  If we want to go to dinner as a couple, we do.  

My husband is very frugal but says that we are a good match because I spend less and he spends more due to our relationship.  I like the financial security I have with him to be honest.  He will never overspend.  That is a good thing in my opinion.  (because I might)
But let me tell you the red flag that I am seeing with your story----------  you live together and he treats you like a roommate.  He doesn't want to go out with you.  I would have a problem with that.  It sounds like bills are seperate.  You don't seem like a couple.  

Your guy is willing to spend money on friends trips and outings and 'extras' for his hobbies.  My frugal husband doesn't spend much money on himself either.  

Honestly, I'd move into your own apartment and just date him.  Maybe he'll see you as a partner at some point but for now, he sees you as a roommate.  

good luck and sorry this is a tough situation dear.