Curious --- Clean or not Clean if on Suboxone

[candothis247]

If a person got off oxycontin, and used suboxone to get off the oxys. Would that person on suboxone be considered clean or not clean if they were in AA and/or NA.meeting? They talk clean and sober in those meetings. I am currently going to the meetings because I have the desire to stop using oxys. I do feel funny sometimes, like I should wait till I'm off of them completely, before I attend meetings, but I can say in my heart,  I believe 100% that the meetings are helping me stay on track with my taper. I'm thinking the answer is "not clean"

[tommm70]

I understand completely. I suffered a long and horrible w/d from subutex, and this is after my doctor told me initially it would be very mild.
It did however allow me to get some things straightened out in my life. I did relapse on Norco and told myself enough is enough and went into an outpatient program.

I wish I would have chosen that route first. I undstand addiction so much better, and it is helping in my sobriety.

I ahve been writing step 4 for a week now, and I can tell you, the cleansing from that alone has been remarkable. I can only imagine what it will be like when I shasre it with my sponser.

Best of luck to all those on Sub.

[imanaddict]

Thank you! And I feel the EXACT same way you do about sub and long term usage. I've been on them for over a year and a half now, and have fears of the WD's because I keep reading (on this site) how awful they are, even with tapering. I had my sub dr. appt this past Monday, and I mentioned that that was my only concern. She said not to worry, that they do it VERY VERY slow and it'll be okay. I don't know if she was just trying to put my mind at ease because I highly doubt she would physically know what WD's from sub are like. OR if she has been doing this long enough to have seen many many sub patients through it. I guess I should have asked..LOL!

Sub, for me, saved my life! I would probably be in a really bad place right now had I not went the sub route. Probably even dead! BUT, like you said, I would recommend short term use.

[xru11]

You ARE on the road to recovery.  And Subs appear to have been quite effective in facilitating you efforts.  My only point is that I was completely ill-prepared for what happens AFTER Subs!!  Foolishly I let a Doctor get away with telling me only half the story and never bothered to do any independent research until a year later (of regular Sub maintenance) when I was 4 days into quitting Subs.  I couldn't understand why it was so damn miserable physically and emotionally.  That's when I got on here and read of similar experiences others had or were having.  I failed to appreciate that Subs were only part of the solution or in keeping with the metaphor, a possible path to recovery and healing, not quite the promised land itself.

[xru11]

My point actually is that I was missing the point!  A doctor convinced me that Subs were all but the promised land.  He failed to properly apprise me of the both the benefits and disadvantages or consequences of taking Subs particularly over a one year period.  I convinced myself they were nothing more that the equivalent of daily "maintenance" vitamins allowing me to function without opiates.  They were my "magic pill"  It was only when I tried to quit or wean myself down did I realize my predicament.  I am not anti-subs!  They have their place in the pharmacopeia of recovery.  But I confused them with recovery.  I know others who are still on Subs.  They are so scared to get off them after trying for a few days that they are actually considering weaning themselves off by switching back to moderate use of hydrocodone!!  If I had to do it all over again, I would have taken the Subs for no longer than a month at most, quickly weaning throughout that month to as little  as I could manage and then immediately quit altogether.  But that's just me and my own experience.  Honestly, I should have just muscled though going cold turkey off the pain killers without the Subs.  The interim step of relying on Subs only prolonged the ultimate price I would have to pay for being drug free after abusing pills for so long.  I suppose If you don't have the luxury of being non-functional for a couple of weeks and can't afford to put your life on hold, maybe Subs are a way of avoiding that in the short run.  In the long run though, I had to pay the piper anyway.  And I did.  Look, I am no expert.  I just reflect my own PERSONAL experience and perception here.  I'll leave the advice giving to some of you folks who know a lot more about this subject than I do.

[imanaddict]

I consider myself clean even though I'm on sub because I AM clean from 40 to 60 Norco 10/325 a DAY, and proud of it! It doesn't matter to me what others think, if they think it's clean or not, what matters is what I think and how it affects my life and my sobriety. It's been over a year and a half since I have had any Norco, I don't abuse my Sub and I have been on the road to recovery ever since. It turned my life around, and THAT is what matter to me.

[refusingbondage]

I go back and forth on this.  

When I was on SUB the whole time on it, I considered myself clean.  

Now that I am off it, I know that *now* I am truly 100% clean.  I do not think of myself as being clean as of March 2006 (when I began sub maintenance) but as of Sept 2008 (when I quit using sub).  

That's my personal belief though and I certainly would not take anything away from anyone who considers themselves clean while on sub maintenance..Its a great tool in recovery.. It's all a matter of how you feel personally.  Do I think its a substitute - no, not necessarily.. but I know it can be.  In a purely scientific sense (which really doesnt matter in the grand scheme of things) if your addicted to opiates and putting an opiate in your body every day, even if its not your drug of choice, your not 100% clean.  I would say sub is a recovery tool and a great step in working towards being 100% clean anyone who is using it properly and working their recovery is doing something to help themselves and I wouldn't argue with them if they considered themselves clean.  It's their feelings and I'd accept it and I applaud their efforts!  Whatever you have to do to help yourself is exactly what you must do.