What do you think? Do I have to start from day one?

[taperme]

So...I haven't been around much the last few weeks because things have been crazy. I've been sick, and had back to back out of town trips. As a reminder of my situation, I tapered off of 10+ norco per day 50 something days ago. I've been doing pretty great with it. However...I've been dealing with health issues just about the whole time. I've been running low grade fevers since I withdrew. I've been seeing several doctors and have had a slew of testing done. At first they thought it was a chronic sinus infection. I'm waiting for tests to come back, but they now think it is some type of bacterial infection that they can't figure out. ANYWAY--my fevers rose to 102 over the weekend. I couldn't get tylenol or anything to get them to come down at all. In my head I KNEW that a norco would help (forgot to mention the migraine level head ache I haven't been able to shake). Finally yesterday afternoon I just had to test out my theory. I was just so sick of feeling so sick. By the way...blood tests confirm there is some type of infection my body is fighting. So, I took two norco and bingo...normal temp. I haven't taken any since. I don't have a craving for them...just a craving to find out what on earth is going on, to get rid of my fever and headache. I originally took them for chronic pain/fibromyalgia and got off of them so that I could get a handle on my pain. In my head, I wanted to reevaluate at 2 months whether to stay off of them forever or to see if my pain still warrented them at all. The good news is that I don't think it does...my body pain has been really pretty manageable with OTC stuff. Even the low grade fevers have been tolerable. But the 101+ with headaches not so much. Again, although I am still running a temp and have a miserable headache I haven't taken anything besides tylenol and motrin today. We are waiting (probably till end of week) for blood cultures and other tests to come back. I know I probably shouldn't care what everyone's opinions are, but I do. And I wouldn't want to post offering help to others without being completely honest here. Thanks for reading...I'm interested in what you guys think.

[taperme]

Actually, I was justifying NOT using, for what that's worth. And I am justifying NOT using because I know I've walked a fine line between addiction and dependence. As for caring about what others think...you are right, what is important is what I think and know about myself. But, I've found it helpful in this situation as well as other situations to get feedback from other people, and especially from people who are not close to me. I think we all get stuck in our own heads sometimes and getting opinions from other people can be useful. I've found the feedback from both the people who agree with me as well as those that don't to be extremely helpful in this situation.

[avisg]

I have to say this you are spending alot of time justifying using if you are not addicted why justify your use .Normally its addicts that justify there using .It does not matter what any of us think it matters what you know and you think .I am not trying to be mean so plz dont take it that way . I hope they figure out what is wrong ....

[taperme]

Sara I meant to tell you earlier...at one point a few weeks ago we thought I might have to have sinus surgery for the "supposed" chronic sinus infection. One of my biggest concerns and one of the reasons I've been digging deeper for answers to this was NOT wanting to have to take any pain meds. I had already discussed with my husband so that we would have a plan in place. I was going try to request that whatever pain medication that was given to me was not any form of hydrocodone...no vicodin or norco. And was going to have my husband dole them out. The good news is I don't need the surgery. The other good news in looking back over the last few months since coming off of the pain meds is that I haven't used the mystery "illness" as a reason to ask any of the many doctors I've seen for ANY kind of narcotic. And believe me, I've had reason to.  I just realized this today because I hadn't even considered or thought of it. It may sound silly...but that is very reassuring to me.

[taperme]

Thanks to everyone for your thoughts. Ultimately, I decided to just get rid of the tracker. I found my way here when I googled "tapering". I actually didn't realize when I started posting that it was an addiction forum...stupid me. I got so much valuable and knowledgeable advice here and so much support with what I was trying to accomplish I decided to stick around. In reality, I definitely got more info than from my doctor who had prescribed the meds! And when I was done with my taper and through the withdrawals I continued to stick around and post to those who were in similar situations in the hope that I could repay the kindness that had been shown to me.  I'm sure it must be confusing to some why I have been counting "clean time" if I don't think I am a true addict. One of the reasons that I had been doing this was because one of the goals in coming off the meds was to reevaluate the pain I was having in 2 months. So I've been keeping track. I actually got my answer sooner and do know that I don't need to be on any kind of opiate daily for pain. Thus, I can get rid of the tracker. It has served its purpose. I know in my own head that I quit taking the drugs that were prescribed to me on March 7. And that I took one dose a few days ago for the reasons above. I also know that if having them in my house continue to tempt me or test me (which they haven't at all besides that one time) I will need to reevaluate my position on me and addiction. I am a pretty self aware person so I am sure I can do that. Hopefully I will get some answers soon as to what is going on with me...if not it isn't for lack of trying! Thanks again to all who responded with their thoughts.

[avisg]

I guess i am confused you dont think your addicted but you are counting clean time ? If you are not addicted and you dont have a problem there is no need to count clean time if you have a problem then you do need to be counting.You did use so that would be back to day one I would not have them in your home and i would get into a program *if you are addicted of course *

[refusingbondage]

Just an fyi - My boyfriend who is not an addict gets really HIGH fevers when he is even a tiny bit sick. High enough to hospitalize him.  Tylenol alone does NOT take his fever down. Advil alone does NOT take his fever down.  What we have to do is use 2-3 tylenol and 3-4 advil plus cold cloths on his head.  Try this combo to bring your fever down if it gets too high. Also, I've heard infection is very common post withdrawal.  Try the amino acids - specifically ones designed  to boost your immune system.  Hope you feel better soon.

[dominosarah]

I really hope they get to the bottom of what is going on....Please keep us posted.

Thank you for your honesty also~~~~~~~sara

[dominosarah]

I dont think you have to start at day one if you need pain meds for surgery and have taken all the necessary precautions.  Usually we have someone hold the pills for us and dole them out.  Im sure most of us at one point in our life will be faced with this situation and we have to have a plan in place.        sara

[LeaAnn807]

You are so right.  That is why I don't really get too caught up in how many days I have.  I know it is over a month, but I am unsure of exactly how many days.  When I go to NA meetings everyone seems to know their EXACT sobriety/clean date, and I don't!!! : )  That is what has me thinking about it!

Good point though!  We have today!  Making it from the time we wake up until midnight is all that really counts!  And sometimes I have to take it 5 MINUTES at a time on a bad day!

Thanks for the reminder!  

TH

[worried878]

Starting from today is often best....it doesnt really matter if it is day one of day 365...we may only have today....(:

[LeaAnn807]

Hmmm.....I think I disagree with abritt....sorry!!!  (BIG smile!)  I think if you take something when you are clean and working a program of recovery, which I am, then if you take something responsibly it should not put you back to day one.  I even had my hubby give them to me.  I never had possession of them.  I took very few after major surgery, and we threw a bunch away.  I never felt high, nor did I take enough to feel high.  Only enough to take the edge off of the pain.  

Anyway, I wanted to hear someone else's opinion.  Maybe I'll think about that one for awhile and change my mind!!! : )

[taperme]

I sort of agree with you. AND I sort of don't as far as starting from day one. Since I wasn't told by a doctor to take it, I probably do agree with you. Although I really did try everything else that I know of. Where I don't is if you have a procedure or surgery that you know will force you to take painkillers. When it isn't really your choice. Especially for those that are truly addicted vs dependent, I think if they have to start from day one that will give license to use until they are done with the doctor prescribed stuff. Does that make sense at all? I think when counting days, it should be from not using for non legitimate reasons not the legitimate ones. I'm beat right now and need to get some sleep. I will try to articulate this better in the morning. Thanks again!
Oh...but you are right in that yes, I took one and I have no desire for another. I didn't feel a craving today, no withdrawal feeling, nada. So I guess that is a good thing.

[abritt121222]

and also in my honest opinion i quit even worryin about how many days i was clean and all of that because no matter if its 200 or 2 months you are clean both ways so i dont even keep count of the days i have been clean i mean i have an idea about it like i know its been around 2 months for me but dont know the exact day because i just dont think it matters that much because of that reason i mean if i have to have surgery and i have to have the meds im not gonnna take it as a bad thing because i had to have them and now i have to start my days over because that means you did something wrong when you didnt but u did take the meds so if you are keeping count you would have to start over its kinda a lose lose situation to keep count in my opinion for that exact reason because i cant help it if i get hurt and need pain relief i know that is confusing cause it is kinda confusing to me to read it over again haha but i understand what im saying so maybe yall will haha


ABritt

[abritt121222]

yea then you would def have to start from day one again i would say cause no matter how you take them either for the high or because you really need them for pain they are still goin into your body so ya gotta start over no matter what the reason for taking them was
and there is no reason to beat yourself up at all you are doing GREAT i mean its not a big deal at all that you just took one as long as it was one and you are done and not taking any more again so there is no reason to beat yourself up now the feeling guilty i know exactly what you mean because i felt the same way and i did beat myself up for a couple hours until i told myself hey look its no big deal you took one woopty doo and i turned it into a positive by saying hey look i took one and was able to quit just like that because i am not my old self that used to never in a thousand years be able to take one and then walk away from them for any more than 4 hours so yea so what i took one becuase i did it and dont even want another one and am not going to take another one so try that turn the negative into a positive by knowing you did it and didnt have to do it again and again

GooD Luck

ABritt

[LeaAnn807]

I would like to know the answer to that one too.......I was clean for a few weeks before I had surgery, and I gave someone the pills to give to me.  I did not abuse them, and we even flushed a few of them when I wasn't hurting anymore.  So......do I start over or count from the day I stopped a few weeks before?  

Good question!!!  Now stop feeling guilty and move on.  Those days weren't spent in vain.  You got something out of them.  You see that you can live without Norco, right?  You even said that your pain is tolerable, so......YOU DO NOT NEED THEM daily like you used to.  You are over that.  No guilt trips here.  Learn a lesson and quit feeling guilty!

That's my input for the day!! : )

[taperme]

That is exactly why i had to post on here and ask. I wish there was a way to just subtract a day from my time. And I know how ridiculous that is! But I worked darned hard for my 51 days. At any rate, I know that my tracker isn't the be all end all in this journey. Just part of the ride. I will probably set up another tracker in the morning and start it at day one.

BUT-here is another question for you all. What happens if you need a surgery or procedure that requires pain meds. Legitimately. Do you have to start from day one again?

For what it is worth, I feel a little guilty about this. But am not beating myself up about it. That is truly how badly I felt. I tried everything else I could think of. And I know that pain medication is there for a reason. The fever was making me crazy and causing me a lot of pain at the higher level. AND I wanted to know if I was right that it would work. That's it...

[abritt121222]

I would say that is up to you do you want to tell yourself that it is day 56 and not day 1 even tho deep inside you will know that you will know that you used and it is day 1 i would be completely honest if i were you and go back to day 1 i mean its not a huge deal being it was only 1 so its not like you are gonna have withdrawals or any of that i just know i have done the same thing before and used even tho it was just one every time i would tell someone how many days clean i was i just had a guilty feeling and just finally said ok quit lying to myself you know its only day 10 and not 2 months so its not what other ppl think but its lying to yourself ya know

ABritt

[taperme]

Thank you! I chose to be here to keep myself hyper aware of the risk of addiction. That is why I continue to come back. Reading people's posts about their experience just re-affirms that I made the right decision in getting off of the pain killers before they got their hooks in me any further. I haven't gone on pain management forum because I don't WANT to be on narcotics. This use was a trial...simply to see if I could get the fever down. I understand your confusion. Maybe I shouldn't be posting here. But thought I had some good experience to offer others who became or were on their way to becoming addicted due to chronic pain issues. I appreciate the apology and if I was short with you I apologize as well. It has just been a long couple of really bad weeks. Thanks.

[taperme]

I think I am not communicating with you very well. I know that the pills will not cure whatever is wrong with me. They will not cure an infection. However, for whatever reason they got rid of my fever of 101.5 yesterday and it didn't return until today. I can't explain it. I won't even try. I have been honest with ALL of my doctors about getting off of the Norco to try to see if there is a correlation with my symptoms and bloodwork. The elevated white count predates me withdrawing. ALL of them agree that there isn't. I have had my sinuses cultured, CT scanned THREE times, and had a camera stuck up my sinuses yesterday. Sinuses have been ruled out. But the blood counts point to bacterial infection. Now we just need to find out where it is coming from. The current concern is that it is systemic and in my blood which would mean an immediate trip back to the hospital...the last think I want. I am worried that if the tests they've run so far don't pin point it, they will be doing a bone marrow biopsy and am a little freaked out. I've been scared to even research it because I am worried this would require some kind of pain pills and I don't want them. There was talk of sinus surgery which I fortunately fought because I don't want to have unneccessary sugerry that would put me back on pain killers. This goes beyond withdrawals. i am not in withdrawal anymore. I'm not convinced the pills are my friend or are making me healthy. I honestly am ill beyond withdrawal and am doing my best to get to the bottom of it. I've seen 3 doctors since yesterday in an effort to figure it out. And I didn't ask a single one of them to give me anything for my headaches or the pain I am in. I don't want it. I won't find out about the blood infection thing till at least Thursday...maybe Friday. And yet, I will not use that as an excuse to take another pill. I know I sound like I am rationalizing, but really I am not. I just a) wanted to know if it would work and b) really needed to feel a little better for a few hours. Not in an addiction kind of way. But in the way of feeling overwhelmingly lousy, with chills and sweats that kicked any withdrawals I went in the butt. For what it is worth, if I truly thought the norco was making me "better" I would have taken it again today. I know it just alleviated symptoms and high fever for a while and I am ok with that. Now that I know it works, I don't need to try it again. Does that make any sense?

[worried878]

I am sorry..I just saw ur post that u r not an addict..only physically dependent..guess since u sought a forum for addiction..i misunderstood
there r great medical forums here on medhelp for all types of things...a pain forum as well...it may be better to seek advice there cos we are addicts and always look at the situation thru an addicts eyes..as we have had bad experiences and abused our DOC..u have not....again apologize for misunderstanding ur post

[worried878]

agree with domino..if u kept pills within reach and possession..u had doomed urself to failure//just about..from the get go
I know alot about medications ..and I do believe the narcotics are making u feel better...they would make anyone feel better who is in wd...stress alone can cause fever... but there is absolutely nuttin in narcotics that cure any infection known to man...but staying down and sick after wd is physical and when a person is immunocompromised ...wbc's can go up..have u had ur sinus's cultured?  if not I would ask cos the right anti-biotic is crucial to getting rid of the infection
I wish u luck...but I can not agree with any theory that narcotics are crucial to keep ur infections at bay...i do agree they make u feel better cos ur brain/body feels they need them to survive..it is a spider web we weave//or the pills weave with our help..in our brains..and it is real ...pills will weave their own web and try to protect themselves and stay in ur life when u throw them out..they make us believe we need them like food or water...people will choose pills/DOC/over food or water in some cases...addiction is a complicated disease...but i do not beleive they are making an addict healthier...they eat away at us slowly...and take ur life away from us while we r convinced they r our friend

[taperme]

I haven't been doing anything about aftercare. My belief was/is that I was dependent and not addicted. I told myself and my husband that if I had a problem staying off of the norco that I would see a substance therapist. I wasn't really testing "myself" just my theory. Also...this was after 3 1/2 days of 101-102 fever that tylenol alone wasn't helping. I got my answer. And will not take any more. I hope they get to the bottom of it as well. And am hoping that more invasive (painful) testing isn't in my future...which I think it may be.

[dominosarah]

I hope you get to the bottom of why you are sick.  Hopefully the blood work will show something.  What bothers me the most is you decided to "test" yourself.  Addicts dont do well with these type of tests.  Having pills around will stir the beast that lives within you.  Are you doing anything about aftercare?           sara

[taperme]

Regular tylenol did not help! And believe me using for life is not an option for me. And I am also aware that abusing narcotics will mot make keep me well or happy. Also not an option. I fully thought that I was feeling lousy due to withdrawals at first. That was BEFORE I went to a doctor who confirmed a bunch of stuff with testing. I actually posted to this group to not put everything off to withdrawals. People get sick too. And as I said above, I've been fighting whatever this is since before I quit taking the norco. As I said earlier, I don't plan to take anymore...and am committed to that. Thanks for your input.