Please read and answer

[Mioster]

Hello everybody, my name is Michael. I have been taking about 50-60mg of Hydro's/day for the last two years. On April 15, I took my last pill. My question is about all kinds of WD symptoms. I am having muscle twitches, headaches, and sometimes rapid or pounding heartbeat, mostly in the middle of the night. Also, anxiety is getting the best of me. I do not have cravings for the stuff, but physicaly and mentaly, I am not nearly OK.
Muscle problems and heart is particularly bothersome. Please share if you or someone you know had these.
Thanks a lot for your help.
Michael.

[posteman]

i have been taking oxycontin legally for 9 years...120 mgs a day..does anyone have a success story of quiting ... i sure could use some moral suppport....thanx

[HMF247]

Hey, everyone. I think this website is a great support system. One piece of advice: DO NOT quit cold turkey. Wean yourself off the drug over a 1 week to 8 week period (depending on how much and how long you have been on it). For instance...if you've been doing dilaudid for two years and have recently been doing 50 mg's a day for the last few weeks your program should start with 50 mg's per day and by the fourth week you should be down to 10mg's or so and then by the sixth week you should be down to doing little dust particles of it (three times per day). You may still get some withdrawal symptoms but nothing as severe as quitting cold turkey. Have someone you trust hold the pills for you and have them monitor your wean-off program. There is no reason to go through hell for two or three weeks when you can simply wean off over a period of time. As you wean off you will no longer get "high" from the small doses but you will feel normal and be able to sleep. Sure, the mental craving may be there...that's why you need friends supporting you and making sure you stick with the prgram.  Good luck.

[philly bee]

yes groovy i have let the cat out of the bag.
everybody in my family knows. i was chewing o.c.'s
for about a yr. and 1\2. i was ranging about 160 to 220 mgs. daily and could not go or do anything w\out them.(sick)
i was reading up on this site for 3 months but did not know how to take the time to d-tox w\out work knowing. it took me to getting arrested to come to the conclusion.i detoxed 2 wks. ago, just got back from my 2nd official N.A. meeting. it makes me feel good to go and feel good for myself. so the answer to your ques...........i am not sure if i am an addict or just got to smarten up....when i go back to the cty. i find myself thinking.....ah get a few percs..not the o.c.'s though. i am scared of those M-FR'S. why am i like thinking that way? i still like the feeling but i know what opiates did to my life and my body. i will continue to go to the meetings, one person actually
celebrated his 12th yr. tonight and that moves me. i have an appt. with outpatient therapy councelor on thurs. and i will talk and i will listen. if there is any advice to be shared please don't be shy G-G

PHILLY BEE

[groovygirl]

hi - welcome to the forum.  i wasn't sure from your post if you are taking stuff every day...do you feel as tho you are physically addicted?  or, is it just a sometimes thing?  i was just curious.  have you told anyone your are close to about this?  for me, that was the first step of getting well.

[philly bee]

HELLO EVERYONE,

YOU MENTION ABOUT THE TRAIN WRECK IN YOUR HEAD, THAT ESPECILLY SOUNDS LIKE ME. I WAS LIVING IN THE JUNGLE OF THE CTY. AND HAVE MOVED A COUPLE OF HOURS AWAY FROM HOME. EVERYTIME I GO BACK TO THE ELEMENT I GET THE CRAVINGS AND FIND MYSELF DRIVING AROUND THE STREETS THAT I TOOK WHEN I WAS CHEWING O.C.S. I HAVE GOTTEN THE CRAVINGS FOR THE O.C.'S AND HAVE ACTUALLY HAD THEM RIGHT IN FRONT OF MY FACE BUT NON THE LESS HAVE NOT TAKEN ANY. ALTHOUGH I KEEP THINKING THAT IT IS OK TO CHEW A FEW PERCS ON THE WEEKENDS. I WISH THIS THOUGHT WOULD GO AWAY...............
I HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE CITY EVERY WEEKEND AND IT SCARES ME.
I KNOW EVENTUALLY I HAVE TO FACE MY OWN FEARS BUT I FEEL SO TRAPPED IN MY OWN HEAD THAT I FEEL I AM BEING FORCED TO DEAL WITH THIS MYSELF. I HAVE WENT TO ONE N.A. MEETING AND PLAN ON GOING TONIGHT. I WENT TO ONE LAST WEEK AND IT HELPED. I JUST FEEL THAT MAYBE GOING THROUGH THIS MYSELF WILL MAKE ME A STRONGER PERSON.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY SUGGESTIONS?????????AGNST????HIPPY??????ANYONE

PHILLY BEE

[tex3]

Hi Ernie, and welcome. During my first detox my therapist told me I was "highly functional." Many people thought I was a great person, too -- actually I thought I was pretty damn good myself! Now that I'm finally clean, I look back and see I was not so hot, just fooled myself and most of those around me. Toward the end I wasn't really fooling those closest to me anymore, but I would never admit that back then. It's just now that I've stopped lying to myself and am really coming to terms with it.
I hope you're detox is not too bad. The clonidine seems to help, although for me it was still pretty bad and I had some other meds to help, as well. I wish you the best and please keep us posted. tracy

[jennyfla]

Oh yes, we are all so alike!
I play the role of being a wonderful mom to three beautiful kids.  I do everything right for them, lots of attention, i participate in all their daily needs, etc. etc.
I own a nice house, i have a good job, everyone would think everything is fine.
I'm married to an addict, so this complicates my life tremendouly!
It's hard enough trying to play the game of life being ok when you are an addict, but when you are married to one too, then the games really begin!!!!
Especially when a person is as codependant as i am!
Life is definately 'a ride', but even with my addiction, i try to remember that i am a good soul dispite my illness!
Never forget who you really are inside!!!
Good luck to you!
Lv Jenny

[IrishRose]

Welcome, ernie jr.- when I first cleaned up some people in my life that thought they knew me well were amazed at me admitting I had a problem with addiction. I was very adept at holding it all together and creating a pretty life on the surface. If they only knew what a train wreck I was inside! But my addictions are not me, they are part of me but my affliction is not truly who I am. At times it has threatened to consume me and all I love. I should've gotten an Oscar, I was a pretty good little actress at concealing all the **** and misery going on in my life, but year after year the Acadaemy people ignored me! However, if I had continued as I was, I would've indeed gotten the interest of law enforcement personnel and the like. There is a way through this. It sounds like you have an addiction specialist on your side. Have you checked out anything like NA or AA? Hope to hear more from you. Take care.

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

You wrote a nice and honest post. Having played this addiction game for many years, I am still amazed that all of us are indeed, so much alike. Everyone thinks I'm so wonderful, too! My family members and friends don't have a clue as to how much of a scoundrel I am. My biggest fear presently is that I will "lose it" and be found out...again. The law of averages are heavily stacked against us and we will eventually lose.

At least you've chosen a new road that will take all of those guilty feelings away. Our biggest problem is in dumping the fears we amass daily as addicts and replacing them with something that gives us hope to go on and stay clean. So used are we at doing it all wrong that doing something right for a change is a monumental challenge!

Take care and be well, my friend. Please don't weaken to the point that a few pills will change your chosen course!

J.B.

[groovygirl]

welcome ernie - and congrats on quitting.  the 3rd - 7th day are always physically the worst for me then comes the depression.  i hope you can hang in there - it's great you are being watched by a dr. and you are in therapy.  it is surprising to me how many people choose to go it completely alone - no friends or families knowing let alone dr's.  for me, the more people that know what i'm dealing with the better - it makes it more challenging/scary mentally for me to relapse knowing how many people will know about my failure.

good luck to you - keep posting...

[Ernie_Jr]

It's heartening to see that these posts continue to thrive as the battle of us addicts perpetually continues.  On the surface my life looks wonderful..great career, house, family, financially capable to do the important things in life.  But I love to be high.  Drugs of choice..Vicoden ES, Percocets, Marajiuana, Alcahol, and Zanax.  I used to justify the need for all this ****, and I've always had it somewhat under control.  I'm connected to the medical industry, and my mother has fought cancer for six years, so needless to say, I've been able to swindle, lie, and steal like the best of them to obtain by drugs.
All throughout, everyone whom I deal with thinks I'm just a great person.  Meanwhile I live a life of deceit and guilt.  Imagine stealing from your mother, using the trust of physicians, and faking illness to get high.  I know some of you can possibly relate.

I've used on and off for around ten years.  Quit over two years ago and stayed clean from the opiates for over a year, started drinking, smoking pot, and eventually relapsed.  After my first detox and recovery, I swore I would never get back to this state again.  I saw an addiction specialist at that prior time, and after weeks of therapy I was diagnosed w/ OCD, deppression, and hyper-manic behavior.  We tried a few SSRI's and I finally began to take 20mg of paxil to this day, which really helped me stabalize my mood, as well as some of my obsessive behavior which they think leads me to want to get high... I think we can all agree that getting high is merely the bandage which only temporarily disguises and numbs our true inner pain/struggle.

An old knee injury is what I fall back on everytime I begin to use the opiates again, and it usually leads to a habit of 10-15 vico's,perco's a day.

Typical day:

Wake up @ 5:30 to trade stocks online..jug of coffee and 3-4 vicodin.
Work out of the house or in the field, more vicodin through out the day.
Whenever the business day raps up, I usually smoke a little weed, drink some good scotch(few tall glasses), smoke a little more,spend time with my girlfriend(i'm not married) then usually 1-2 mg.'s of zanax and hit the sack.

I once again realized thst the drugs play too big of a role in my life, and it's time to make some extremely difficult changes.

Yesterday I took my last two vic.'s in the morning, preceeded throwing them up with most of my intestinal lining, and with the help of some good friends, and an addiction specialist, I'm about to exorcice these demons and devils  from my body once again.

Today, I'm clean. The doctor gave me clonodine to dilate the blood vessels, and ambien to help me sleep.  Also taking my vitamins, and I have a few Zanax just in case i feel like jumping off the roof.

Maybe it's because I've been here before, or maybe it's the clonodine, or maybe the worst is still yet to come, I don't know.  But I'm at home, took a few days off work to tackle this, and have ana appointment with my therapist later today.

We'll see what happens.

Just wanted to share my story..Best of luck and God bless you all.

Ernie Jr.

[tex3]

LG -- I'm not sure of the mgs for each med. I threw everything away when I was done with them. From what you posted, it sounds like you were on a very similar regimen. However, I think the clonidine would really help you. It helped me with the "heebie jeebies." I still have some of that left, and it is .1 mg. The phenobarb is similar to Xanax. The Lomotil is similar to the Bentyl or Robinol. I think you could use a muscle relaxant; I took that (Zanaflex) and stomach med longer than any of the other stuff.
As for eating, you have to try. I detoxed at home for the worst of it, and didn't eat for about 4 days, except a bite here and there. I have three kids, and this was really tough. My husband was here, but not a great help, although he did try. I hated my kids seeing me like that. I started tapering on a Saturday, took a very reduced dose on Sunday, went to my doctor on Monday and got the cocktail. Then I took that through the next Saturday. On Monday morning (a week after it all started) my mother came to pick me up. I was doing better by then but was very weak, wasn't eating, was crying all the time. The first day at her house (I was off the cocktail except for the stomach meds  and occasional Zanaflex, which knocked me out) she forced me to eat some soup. Just a little, but I started to feel better. I slept a lot that day. On Tuesday she made me get out of bed. I got stronger every day from that point. We went out to eat on Wednesday, first time I was really out of the house. That day the migraines started. I got them daily until this week, a month later. I took Imitrex, aspirin, Advil. I felt like **** as far as the headaches went, but gradually the depression has lifted. I'm still getting some headaches, but not nearly as bad. I almost overdosed on aspirin one day, it was so awful.
Looking back, I realize how bad things were and how far I've come. I'm 5 weeks clean now. But during my detox I was also recovering from surgery and dealing with surgical menopause. I probably overdid it and should have tapered longer, as my doctor recommended, but I wanted off the drugs ASAP. I'm glad I did it. I haven't made a meeting yet at all; this forum has been my therapy, and it's been great. Physically, I feel normal now. The cravings just hit me last week, and I'm dealing with that. But when I look at how I felt a month ago, I realize that cravings are nothing compared to W/Ds. Mine was pretty bad, but as I've been told it's because W/Ds get worse each time. I did two "official" detoxes (one inpatient) but went through W/Ds many time when I ran out of meds. Those only lasted a day or so, as I would quickly beg or borrow more pills. But they had a serious effect on me.
Sorry this was so long, but I wanted to give you an idea of how my recovery has progressed. It is very tough to be a mom and go through this. You don't have the luxury of focusing fully on your detox or recovery, as your babies need you so much. But as my mom so wisely said, I couldn't be the mom I needed to be when I was in such bad shape. I balanced things as well as I could. Now I play basketball with my girls, watch movies, just have fun. I'm a much, much better mom. I was very lucky that my own mother took care of me at the end, but I did go through the first week of detox basically alone, as my husband was really not here. My house was a disaster at the end of it; I mean truly disgusting. I paid my mom-in-law to clean one day.
I hope you are well. Please let me know how you are doing. You can email me if you like, at ***@****. tracy

[angst]

If you read the other posts, unless some blessed soul reads this,
you can find the recipe.  I am on methadone, so I do not us it.  When I start detoxing, I hope to find it available down south.
Read the earlier and other posts, hopefully you will find it.

[Lostgirl]

The codience ran out in my house on May 1st.  5/2 I thought I was going to dye and couldn't stop crying.  I called NA and a nice lady gave me a regime of Xanax (anxiety) and andidepressant and Lomotil Stomach cramps and diarrhea).  She had me take .50 Xanax every 4 hrs the first day, and every six hrs the second.  I ddin't even need to take it that much the second day.  Now it is .25 same thing for two days.  I refused inpatient as I am a single parent. Last time I had to go to the hospital (not related) my daughter was 8 and is still not past it.  Their father lives in another state and my mother was out of town. I feel better physically. Not as weepy or anxiety ridden,but still have chills, can't eat, diarrhea.

I live in ABQ, NM and did not see a meeting for professionals or related.  Had to laugh! NA has same answering service!  Not sure who to contact to find out.  

As for the "cocktail"  do you know the mgs of each supplement?

Thanks,
LostGirl

[tex3]

Hi lost, this is tlk but with a new nickname. If you go to the NA website (do a google or other search for "Narcotics Anonymous" and it will take you to the site) you can search for meetings in your area. There will be a schedule that will describe the format (non-smoking, etc) and I think you can find some for professionals there, as well. What part of the country are you in?

Although I feel pretty strong, I still think if I had anything in the house, I would take it. The cocktail got me through the worst of the W/Ds. It still sucked, but it wasn't as bad as it would otherwise have been. This is what my doctor prescribed:

Phenobarb (the main thing that helped), 1-2 every six hours
Clonidine (a blood pressure med, but also an agonist that really helped me), every six hours
Skelaxin or Zanaflex (muscle relaxer; very important), every six hours
Bentyl or Robinul (for stomach cramps), every 4-6 hours
Remeron or Doxipen (for sleep)
For the first three days I took a very, very small dose of hydro with the above. For example, I was taking between 150-200 mgs of hydro a day, and for the W/Ds I only took about 15 mgs the first day, then 10 mgs the second day, then 5 mgs the third day. After that I just took the cocktail. I was on it for about six days.

The recipe is a good mult-vitamin, L-Tyrosone (an amino acid that makes your neurotransmitters repair faster, as I understand it; your neurotransmitters really get screwed up when you've been on opiates regularly) which helps with depression; 5HTP, Zinc, Magnesium, and I believe a few other things. Others here are much more qualified than I am to give you this info, and I don't want to get it wrong so I'll leave it to them. Right now I'm taking the strong mult-vitamin, L-Tyrosone (sp?), and feverfew (for bad headaches, which hit me about 10 days into my recovery and have been almost daily; I started the feverfew on Friday and it's really helped). My mental clarity is getting much better, as is my mood. I still hit really low points, but every day seems to get easier. The cravings didn't hit me until last week, but they are manageable and usually pass quickly. Still, if I had hydros I'm afraid I would take them, so I just don't let myself get in that situation; for me, that's just a setup for failure. Others have more willpower than I do, though.

Are you detoxing now, or where are you at? tracy/tlk/tex3

[Lostgirl]

If you don't mind telling what was the "cocktail" that the doc gave you.  I too, went cold turkey.  I didn't not have the luxary of getting to flush 80 tabs down the toilet.  Which is actually a good thing!  I would have just kept on talking them.  I took everything in the house, whether it had my name on it or not!  Just seeing that just made me want them.  I feel better today,(physically) but mentally I am wanting it and it has only been three days.  Where do you get this "Thomas's Receipe"?  I keep seeing parts but it does not give exact mg of each supplement or vitamin.  Also, I too, need to find a confidental meeting for NA.  One for professionals.  Any ideas?

Thx
LostGirl

[groovygirl]

wow - congratulations!!!  two weeks is a BIG achievement.  i've never made it that far....except with buprenex and that doesn't really count.

you are really on your way...good luck to you!!!!!

[Witchywoman]

Nod congratulations on 2 weeks! You're past most of the physical stuff, but now comes the mental battle.  Just know we are here for you no matter what.

JB, thanks for your words.  Wise as ever.  I managed to get clean with a full bottle of 120 vicoprofens in my house. I wanted to be clean so battle they were not a temptation. But I flushed them a few weeks ago, after 8 months clean, when I came extremely close to relapse and realized that I was holding them in my hand....too close a call for comfort, so down the toilet they went.

If I had to put into a few key words the things that help with recovery, at least for me, they would be:

Truth
Unconditional acceptance
Patience
Persistance
Surrender
Faith

Down with Shame!

I'm sure there's more, but those are what strike me right off the bat.

I need you all.
Thanks,
WW

[Nod]

The biggest victory you had was coming clean with your wife.
We addicts live in a world of secrets.  Our own little world, just us and Morpheus.  Its not until we get rid of the secrets will we ever have a chance of coming clean.  After 2 yrs of 150-200mg hydro a day habit I was both dependent and addicted.  Then after my work suffered and I crashed my car (Nod off,) I decided I needed to change or die - I chose living.  I came clean with my wife, my doctor, and thus myself.  No more secrets.  

SO CONGRATS TO YOU!  Your more than 1/2 way there.  You will start feeling better every day.  Just hang in there.  

And by the way I'm officially clean!  Been over 2 weeks!  Yes, still lethargic and get depressed but I'm getting better every day.  A clean head just feels great!  
Take care, you'll be fine!  
Nod

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

The flushing of drugs is admirable, but...maybe not a wise as some would lead you to believe.  That's as "cold turkey" as it gets. Most of the folks here consider this dangerous, but I'll admit I've been away for a while and things may have changed.

You've been taking 50 to 60 mgs of hydrocodone for two years and I wouldn't consider that a "borderline addiction"(my opinion, only).  Flushing drugs or pouring whiskey down the drain?  What does this really mean? Sounds like pure frustration if not desperation to me.  I wish I had a dollar for everyone who's done this! At any rate, the true addict will even find this act another reason to use again.

Welcome and hello from someone who knows a little of which you speak!  Hang around here for a while and you may learn more than you really want to know.  As for myself, I practice unconditional love for my fellow addicts and yadda, yadda, yadda...

J.B.

[angst]

You did more than I could by flushing the pills, even though hydro's were not my drug of choice.  I think people think less of us who had a street addiction to dilaudid.  I know I was crazy at times to go where I went.  Back to withdrawals, I have kicked at home twice off dilaudid.  The usual symptoms are stomach ills, anorexia, the shakes and jerks, and anxiety.  I might be concerned about the heart palps if you have chest pain with them.
I went through rehab twice.  They tried taking me off all  benzo's.  I've been on them for 22 years for some problems and I am asthmatic who takes drugs that hype me.  I had a heart attack even though they put me through what they viewed as a slow phenobarb detox.  
You will make it through the withdrawals.  Especially if you have been off for 15 days already.  Just think how far you've already come.  The klonopin might help, at least at night.  You know that you have a tendency to like drugs, so be careful with the klonopin.   Keep posting.  It does help.

[Phaedrus]

Mi,

You are doing great.  Flushing the pills down the toilet is a sure fire sign that you are serious about this.

Everything you're experiencing is perfectly natural and NOT LIFE THREATENING.  You're probably through the worst of it and each day, for the most part, is going to be better than the next.  

Take it from most who post here: STAY THE COURSE!!!!!

Beat this thing now.  It will only get more difficult with each relapse.  And this isn't any game.  This is serious.  If you're not scared you should be.

You have a bunch of people here that have been through it and can answer all of your questions.  Keep coming back.

And please remember, the time to talk about whether to use again or not is BEFORE you do it, not after.  If you get the urge, please come online and talk to us about it.  We'll be here.

Best of luck to you.  This is so doable.  You can do it.

[tlk]

You flushed 80 pills? That's great! You are very strong. I didn't have cravings until this week, about three weeks after I detoxed. The cravings are scary but not overwhelming. I'm more afraid of living like that again, or taking the pills and feeling like a failure. I know I have a script for 100 hydros but have not filled it. It's what was left over when I tried to get my last script early and the pharmacist would only give me one day's worth. That was on March 29. On April 1 I went to my doctor and he prescribed a "cocktail" to detox with at home. If you need to take the detox stuff, do so. My script was only for three days' worth so I wasn't worried about getting addicted to the phenobarb, but I certainly could if I had an unlimited supply. You will feel better every day. Good luck. tracy

[Mioster]

Thank you all for your fast response. As you can tell, last night really freaked me out. I did talk to my Doc about my drug problem about a week ago, and he gave me Klonopin 0.5mg to take half of pill in the AM and half PM. I did not take any yet, I was thinking about taking only half before bedtime, I do not want to exchange one addiction for another. I know, eventualy cravings will come back, I am propably to sick and to scared to have them yet, today is day 17 since my last Hydro, on April 15, I came clean with my wife and flushed about 80 pills down the toilet. Anymore input is greatly appreciated.