Terrified to start detox

[cutie pie]

I have been addicted to vicodin and norco for 4 years, i didnt know untill the first time i ran low that i would have withdrawals.I have to take 8 to 10 pills a day just to not get the withdrawal symptoms.I'm 58 years old. do you think i should go as an in patient to try to detox. How long untill i will feel normal again. Please help, i'm terrified. Thank you Lois

[StrengthBeyondStrength]

I have a serious addiction to norco. It started when I was hospitalized two years ago after a botched surgery and was inpatient in the ICU for six months. The hospital was pumping me intravenously with dilaudid and feeding me oxycontin for breakthrough pain through a stomach tube. I had nothing to eat or drink for over a year and was on a feeding tube. At 30 years old and almost dying my only friend was that rush that the drugs gave. I was sent home on delaudid and then cut off cold turkey by the doctors, I had withdrawals so bad they felt like seizures, I didn't sleep for days. I started to buy any kind of pain pill I could find Vicodan, Percosets, Methadone, Dilaudid..literally anything. I would crush these pills and shoot them through my feeding tube. I could not eat so all my money went to drugs. I learned to walk again (muscles died from laying on my back all that time). I eventually got off the feeding tube and could eat again. Last month I had a major abdominal wall reconstruction and had two ribs removed. Last week I took about 180 norco. The past few days I have had to ween myself down because no doctor will write another script for me, I am cut from breast bone to belly button and have no pills. However, I became so pissed off that I am in this spot. I never took even aspirin before that botched surgery. I have decided to quit, the first two days I really wanted to kill myself because my legs tremored so bad, my stomach cramped like I was going to give birth to a whale and I had a strong paranoid anxiety. Oh and very vivid nightmares. Tomorrow I go back to work...with no pills. I read some of the posts on here and got some courage to face this addiction. I know many people I can buy from right now but I am doing my best to resist.
Someone called oxy's the white devil well norcos are my yellow devil...I have never relied on something so much. I need to be free of this crutch, I want my freedom. I don't want to plan my life around these pills anymore. I am done.
The ironic thing is I am a mental health psychologist who also treats those with substance abuse issues, so I truly understand the struggle.

[xBettyJox]

I'll tell you what, this is really going to suck when i stop the hydrocodone!  Whats sad is i dont take near as many as you guys and i feel like a real whimp.  As far as the tapering off, its not going to work for me.  Ive already tried it and i just end up wanting more.  The sad fact i was only taking 1 a day but in the last few days i been taking 3 or 4.  Ive been on it for about 2yrs mostly 1 a day though. I dont think i should be going through major withdrawals and its got to be easier then the ultram withdrawals i had.  Yea went to hydrocondne to help with the ultram withdrawals lol.  Im sick of not being able to live without a pill!  Its going to have to be cold turkey for me when i get brave enough to say no more.  OMG i dread it so bad, im not even giving it a chance cause ive only gone mabe 2 days without it.  I got to get a plan together and im going to have to force myself.  This ***** so bad!

[WakingSiren]

As a certified pharmacy tech and chemistry minor in college, I was well aware of the evils and perils of hydrocodone. It is far more addictive than codiene or any other "semi-natural" opiate due to the synthicizing and manipulation of the extra molecule that turns it from "codiene" to "hydrocodone".

In my younger years, I had taken just about any drug available for fun and loved LSD and any "downer" out there. I was never addicted to anything and went many years withouttouching anything stronger than an aspirin. Then, in 1978, a "wonderful and perfect" drug called Percodan showed up and I had a doctor who believed it's hype. Before I knew it, presto! My first addiction run! I have always believed that it takes a real professional to really turn you into a true junkie...and that's what happened.

I had no idea I was addicted to the stuff until I went to Madrid, Spain to live for a while. When I ran out, I popped over to the local doctor who was shocked that I was taking the stuff! He said he would write me one script but no more because, in Europe, they were already aware of how dangerous it was!

I was so addicted that I FLEW BACK TO THE U.S. JUST TO GET ANOTHER SCRIPT!!! I still can't believe that one! After a month of some wicked withdrawal, I was back my my usual youthful self and truly amazed at the damage done in the wake of that 6 month addiction!

Then time and tide turned and I ended up with a huge bone spur in my shoulder and no insurance for sugery. Well, guess what boys and girls? You got it! Once more with feeling! Only this time it is Norco!
I am 52 and a diabetic. I KNOW what toll detox plays on my body but I am fed up with being a slave to a damned pill!

Just for the record, ANYTHING over 4000 mg of acetametaphen a day is toxic to your liver. Each pill of Norco contains at least 350 mg. of it. It is the ONLY drug in which an overdose will simply kill you...there is NO counter drug! Our friend who was doing 75 of them a day was so much into the toxic level it is really amazing that his liver still functions. The Tylenol effect is even more dangerous than the "endorphen sleep" caused by the hydrocodone. (Your endorphons actually shut down or "sleep" while you are on the drug.)

The pharmaceutical companies who make this stuff knew all along that they were creating the perfect vehicle for addiction. Until the late 1970s, many of the current drugs weren't even available and doctors didn't hand out scripts like candy. In other countries, they have figured out these dangers and the ones who have "socialized" medicine seem to be the ones in the best control (not so much money to be made?!)

Please consider just who is really pulling the puppet strings, my friends!
We can stand together and really rise against the ones who desire to make us all slaves. It won't be easy, but we can find strength in one another and we can survive and thrive!

Good luck to us all!

[Astal]

Hi, I started taking tramadol. I was only taking it for 1 week give or take a few days. 2-3 pills 4 times a day for back pain and i noticed that when i woke up (not taking while sleeping) i was getting sick flu like symptoms ect. Im diabetic also. Well yeah i guess im addicted. I tried going cold turkey and simply couldnt do it. I was so sick, beyond sick. I was having a mental break down. Shaking, crying, horribly pain all over my body. So as of now im slowly lowering the amount im taking, im so scared though. I still am extremely emotionally unstable. I wish I would have never taken anything for the pain because when i think about it, it was nothing compared to this. People that went through this and are still around you have all my respect. Can you recommend anything for me to do to make this process easier. Im going to try valerian root like I read in the one post above.

[Zakk169]

Hello Sirs/Mams,

I am Zakk. My white devil is 40mg oxycodon HCL. 5 years now and I am at a breaking point. Let me elaberate.

I am prescribed by the VA (veterans admn). I started with percocets (5/325) back in 2000. I was injured from an airborne jump that went horiibly wrong. (US Army). As I said, I started with percs and went upward all the way to 40 mg oxys. I have been reading your posts and I must say, I am willing to detox asap! I need someone,anyone to email me asap at:
***@****

so I can get some help.

I am feeling like my life has taken a u-turn to hell. I can't concentrate. I have no sex drive. I feel like **** night and day, except about 1 hour after I swallow my white devil (my own name for this drug) up to about 2-3 hours after I take it. Then I feel I need more. I am somewhat self contained and most of the time I stay on schedule. After the oxy fades away I sometimes say to myself...a half won't hurt...and I take it...Well, halfs become a shortage around a week before refill time...sound familiar. I also sometimes bite my pill in half for faster relief. I also have been known to find outside recourses when I am feeling withdrawls. By the way, I am almost sure that death is better than withdrawl...??!! I am not suicidel, but lord, I need help.

I am sure there are people far more seriuos than me, but I am getting worse. 5 years is a realy long time. When I do find outside recourses, it is not the same as mine (meds). I will take, for example, 5-6 percocets and 4-5 vicodans in a day and not feel like I do as far as pain reduction as my 40's. I am prescribed 3 40 mgs a day and I take 4 some days.

I even tried to get my doctor to up the dosage, but he said no way! I've tried almost everything to get a higher prescription, and you know in a way, I am glad he denies me.

I can go on about the effects of this medication, but I am sure most of you know.

I would really like it if someone or all of you can talk to me and tell me your story so I don't feel alone anymore. These days I feel like I have no life and I miss my old life before my marriage to the "White Devil"...

In case your wondering how I got that name, I used to attend church religiously, no punds attended, and remember the surmons about the devil and how if you let him he will rule your life...Well, needless to say I got the "Devil" part because the oxy rules my life. Now, as far as the "White", I started this ****** addiction with white percocets, so thats where that came from...

I am a musician and I plan to write a song about it when my addiction is over.

Anyway, thank you guys and gals for letting me **** in your ears. I need help and I believe you are my only hope...????

Please email me at the email address I gave earlier in this post. If not, I will await someone's reply to this post eagerly...

Thanks again,

Zakk

[lady209t]

hi all ive been on norco for 3 years now and i want off these things i no its going to be very hard from what i read but im going to do this i took my last meds about 7;00am to day and i do feel ackie and i no its going to get real bad in a few more hours i want to say thanks for you all here i no that at the end of this that there is life thanks to all of you

[Savas]

First, check the dates on the thread you reply to. This one is from 2001. But hey, that's okay, lots of good stuff in it, always good to see old stuff.

Well, it depends on how they do it. Is this an at home/ self detox, or with a doctor's aid?

If he's going to try taper, the best way to do it is to cut your dose by no more than 10%. He'll suffer mild symptoms for a week, possibly two. So the best way to go is by how long the symptoms are. How ever long they last, he should spend at least a week or two feeling "normal" before dropping again.
I'm at the end of a taper. At first, I dropped quickly, every two weeks for three months. By the third month I was stressed, tense and exhausted. So I switched to the above method to get some relief. The symptoms are minor, but without a respite, the stress builds over time. It's like having a bad cold for months on end.
Anything quicker, and you may as well just stop abruptly and go to an alternate medication therapy like clonidine. Fast tapers are generally torture, and not worth the trouble. The failure rate is incredibly high.

[Kay64]

Hi - My boyfriend is going to start detoxing from Norco shortly.  I don't understand but am trying to so I can help him the best I can.  There seems to be a LOT of good advice on here but how does he start?  He is taking about 6-8 a day and has been for at least 4 years.  Does he weekly lower the amount he takes or should it be every few days?  Anything anyone can tell me to help would be great - thanks!

[Flaco]

Tom is right on the $$$.......same situation here.....what he says is the TRUTH

[pat for tom to Annie]

tom wrote:

While I still feel the obligation to be actively working a program before posting on this forum, my "valet" pat will, from time to time, relay a message or two.

One suggestion for anonymity,

Type your posts in Microsoft Word or the equivalent, then highlight, copy and paste the entry into the forum window at the last moment. That will make your efforts less visible and improve the accuracy of your prose - not that yours needs any special help (mine often does).

[PS >>>>Annie]

......Just in case you miss it, I have a post for you under Ultram law.

[Annie to TOM]

I just read your above 2/11 post about "do you have family."  I think you may have taken it wrong.  I can remember wanting to ask you that many times.  I can recall trying to post and having to exit out quickly, because my kids walk in or husband.  He knows I visit here, but is very concerned.  He is scared that I may give out to much info.  I feel like I know you all and I am not afraid of posting.  Any-way, there could be one million reasons why that happend.  Dont read to much into it.  I have family, but dont feel comfortable talking to them.....I just feel like they get tired of my problems.  This forum has given me a lot.  I think everyone here connects so well because we all have somthing in common.  Dont quit posting.........we will miss you.

[Chas]

I dont know if any of you have read my posts, but Im the one using the oxys and vicodin.  Well the sh*&t hit the fan and i broke down and told some people who care about me and they decided to send me to the hospital er and try to get me a bed to detox.  Well it started off good.  I was taken about 50 miles from where I lived to one hospital, then was taken by ambulance (can you believe it?!!?) 20 miles to another hospital for a bed to detox.  Well I was really ready to do it at first.  As soon as I got there I felt like I was in jail.  They didnt have a bed in the detox section so they put me in the mental health unit instead.  They told me they would detox me there.  They took my vitals and told me that I wasnt in withdrawl but I felt like ****! No MEDS. Wow it was a rough night.  The bed was like a wooden board and i hardly slept.  As soon as i woke up i wanted out.  They gave me some tylonol in the morning when i told them how I was feeling.  I desparately got on the phone trying to find someone to pick me up and get me outta there.  I finally did (against doctors orders so i may not get insurance coverage)
and i left that night.  Now im staying at a friends house who is very supportive.  Im turning my finances over to my dad so that im not tempted to get more pills and ill be on a strict budget.
But....  Today i conjered up a reason to go to my apartment and I chewed up two vics that I had leftover.  Now i dont know what to feel.  I was just coming out of the withdrawls and now im worried that ill have to go through em all over again.  I really dont want to use but its like uncontrollable and once i start thinking about it theres no turning back.  Im gonna keep trying though.  If anyone has any advice let me know.  Oh yeah and thanks tom for all of the pointers from someone who is experienced with all this.  These doctors dont know anything.

Chas

[tom to Cutie Pie]

I have resigned from participation on the forum, but if you'd liked to talk to me privately for an answer to your question,
use
***@****

[cutie pie]

To Tom, How are you doing today. I really care. I will send good, and positive thoughts your way.

[cutie pie]

To Mikey Dee, and leases. I also am new to this forum and am ammased to find how many people are in the same boat as i am. I never thought i would go hopping from Dr. to Dr. to get pills. And the panic when time to refill is there all the time because sometimes their refused. we all know that feeling. (PANIC.)I honestly think if i could get all the pills i want without having to go through all the work of getting them  and didnt worry about the damage i may be doing to my liver and what ever else i probably would never try to stop.The problem i'm sure we are all facing is, how eventually every so often we have to increase the dose because of the tolerance our bodies are getting used to, it just makes it that much harder to make the rx's that your able to get last.Good luck to you both

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

To Mikey Dee and Leasing:  You are to the point where you don't need anybody preaching to you so I won't start.  Yes, we gradually realize what is happening and the pain and insanity of it all makes us want to "do something" about the pill problem.  The point is that even us so-called oldtimers can still fall into the trap of addiction.  I'm one of them.  In the past few months I even went so far as to say that I had my addiction problem under control and could continue using narcotic pain meds safely.  I ended up drug seeking as usual and eventually back in NA/AA meetings.  I'm still counting the days since my last Vicodin/Lorcet and still uneasy but still determined to stay clean one more day.  I'm "buying time" by not using in the hopes that I have one more recovery left in me before the end of my life!  One of the best things I ever did was come clean with my wife and family about my "secret problem".  I found that it wasn't such a secret after all anyway, and the big ball and chain was removed so that they finally felt comfortable enough to start supporting me.  J.B.

[Mikey Dee]

Yes Cutie Pie.  I wake up feeling that I'm getting sick because of the length of time since I last took Vicodin.  This is my first time on this board.  It confirms what I guess I already knew.  I'm addicted big time to Vicodin.  I've been taking it for 2 years.  I don't really use an awful lot more than I'm prescribed (using 5-6 per day).  But I definately determine how many pills I need when I go out, based on my schedule.  I also have prescriptions for Zoloft, Buspar, and Fioricet.  I usually mix the pills for "cocktails" as I like to call them.  I can't continue this.  I'm afraid that I'm damaging my liver.  I get stressed out when refill time comes (always too soon for my insurance to pay) or I need to go to the Doc to explain how much pain I'm in to get my refills.  I get 120 Vivodin ES's with 3 refills.  This has to stop.  I've lost weight (190 to 170 pounds)and am generally no longer "healthy" the way I was before this all started.  I came to this board to see if I could detox myself.  I wanted to know what to expect and how long it will take.  I think I can do it alone but I'm not sure if I should tell my wife (and get her help).  Anyway, thanks for all the info everyone.  It's good to know that I'm not alone and it can be done.  Now if I can just take that step.

[Leases (new)]

All I have to say is WOW...I have been floating in and out of this forum for a few months, reading what has caught my eye, and today I felt the need to write.  I can understand what you all think about almost every waking moment.  I have been taking Vicodin ES for a few years for migraines. Slowly but surely becoming addicted, and now wanting to get off them, but the withdrawals make you want to go crazy.  Even though we all dont know each other...we know better what we all are going through better than our family and friends.  Thats why I am going to frequent this board, because if I get just 1% of strength from here, that may be all I need to succeed in beating the addiction we are all fighting.  Good luck everyone, and just do it.

[tom to Cutie Pie]

since you asked me to tell you how I'm feeling, perhaps you can interpet this for me:

on the Lortab thread, somone, unsigned of course, posted this to me:

"...Do you have family??"


It's bothered me all night for some reason. The double ?? seemed intentionally derisive. Am I making enemies on this site rather than friends when I try to say what's really going on inside of me? Are they saying they're tired of my posts and would rather I asked for support from my family than bother them with any questions or concernes? Perhaps I'm on this forum too often and they're emplying I've got no where else to go. I wish they had replied to my answer and had the courage to leave a name. Loneliness is what drives me to this site so often. I wish I undestood what it was they were really implying.
It's dominated my thoughts and made me question just how much family I really do have. I thought by starting my taper I'd at least legitimize my being here by honestly trying to clean up. I seem to be in a vulnerable state of mind and that question and the way it was put really got to me. Of course, they didn't leave a name, just lobbed the question out the side window as they drove by.

I'm also deeply troubled because I had had some correspondence with Maryanne recently which she ubruptly terminated and for the life of me I can't understand why. I feel I made a big mistake giving her my home e-mail address and street address. I now wonder who it was I was really talking to and what they plan to do with the information I gave them. I am not involved in anything illegal but "Maryanne"'s abrupt disconnect from me makes me wonder if someone just co-opted her handle for some purpose I still cannot fathom.

I'm going ahead with my tapering program but I don't know how much of it I should make public on this forum anymore. Something happened with the Maryanne connection and it's got me worried that I shared personal informaton with someone who, shall we say, does not have my welfare in mind.

Well, that's about all I have to say tonight, unless someone asks for my help, which I will always give willingly and unconditionally.

Perhaps "...Do you have family??" was more incisive than I first thought. Perhaps the answer is no.

[tom to Maryanne]

PLEASE CHECK YOUR AOL E-MAIL ACCOUNT FOR MY MESSAGES.

[J.B. to Brian and Vicky]

I hope you read this and know that I am concerned about you.  Please keep posting!  You know what we tend to think when people suddenly stop visiting here.  Forgive me but I didn't know that you had a problem with Darvon and Xanax.  As you know, I recently stopped my Lorcet.  This site has helped me a great deal when I got lonely and felt like using again.  The first week was pretty tough but now after two weeks, things look pretty rosy again.  You can do it, too.  J.B.

[Gina]

I know how you feel about the abrupt disconnection with Maryanne. Hopefully, she will se your posts and explain why. We tend to get paranoid when things like this happen. Just like my drs visit the other day when I heard the 2 nurses whispering and then the nurse to the dr. I felt my heart sink. I just knew it was about me. Sometimes your body reacts before you even process the info. Your "GUT" feeling is usually right, however. Please realize that you haqve ALL of our total support during your detox. Don't let a few spoil all the great things you have done for us on this site. I always find myself quoting things your have written to others. We are behind you 100%! May God be with you!

[tom to J.B. and Gina]

thanks, so much, friends, for your timely responses. If either of you are interested in the taper schedule in detail, mail me at ***@**** and I will send you a copy. I believe, if followed assiduously, it can get me where I want to go. It reflects my experience with my own usage and dosing patterns and doesn't introduce any radical changes.

If you want to know more about the Maryanne "incident", I'll fill you in on a strictly confidential basis. I want to assure you that it had no personal or sexual aspect, only the basic "business" of this web site.

Naturally, being frozen out by her, hurts my pride, but my real concern is for her. When people stop posting, as J.B. notes, it frequently means they're on a bender of one kind or another. More than anything, I just want to be assured that she hasn't let that happen to her. The service she volunteered to do for me is, in light of my taper decision, now academic and is not an issue. I just want to know she's OK.

Thanks J.B and Gina for your personal loyalty and support. I will keep in contact, especially when the tapering gets down to the "nitty gritty" of dosage reduction.

I X'd off my first "square" on the chart, and look forward to seeing this plan through to its conclusion. Take care. Give my best, J.B., to that guardian angel you have in Marty. I pray every night that the tamoxifen is working and that she's getting better.