mom needs help!

[n40066]

my 24 yr old son started with weed when he was 17, graduated to cocaine when he was 18, then, when he was unable to come down from the cocaine high, moved on to heroin when he was 18 1/2.  i cut him off completely when i did an intervention when he was 21, which forced him into rehab for 30 days.  since that time, he has relapsed multiple times with heroin and pills.  after each relapse, he managed to detox himself and get clean for a bit.  judging only by his behavior at times and his avoidance of me (he has always done this in the past when he was using) i have reason to suspect he is once again using.  however, i do not want to falsely accuse him.  as you all know, recovery is difficult enough without people constantly looking at your ever move under a microscope!  MOST of the time when we are together, even if his behavior is not quite normal, his pupils are.  my question is....if he were using any form of cocaine in addition to some form of opiate, would one cancel out the effects of the other where his pupils are concerned?  is there anything he could be doing to mask the effects on his eyes?  my gut is telling me he's been using a combination of crack and opiates (pills).....but his eyes are always good!  never pinned or large!  
the other thing is, he is on lithium and trileptal for bipolar.  could either of those drugs possibly aid him in keeping his eyes normal?
this may not be the right forum for asking this question, but thought who would know better than those that have been there and done that.  if no one here can help, perhaps someone could suggest another place to try?  thanks in advance for any suggestions you all may have to offer.
elizabeth

[n40066]

one problem, my friend.....as stated in my first post, my son is 24 years old!!  and trust me when i tell you there was plenty of discipline in his life growing up!  while i was one the strict side as a parent, i was always there for him as a friend.  i was the one he always came to whenever he had a problem.  to a lessor degree, i still am now.  our home was the one kids always came to and his friends always loved me and talked to me.  most still do now!  as for school, he was always in a private college prep school.  i did everything i could as a parent to prepare him for the future.  unfortunately, with bipolar, the majority of these folks DO end up with addictions to one thing or another and my son is no exception to this rule.  he also has border line personality disorder to contend with as well.  it's a tough road to travel and one i wouldn't wish on anyone!  
but thanks for your input....

[teenbs1234]

Parents today find it hard to descipline their children. Some behaviors of their children are uncontrollable. The best thing to do is to use positive reinforcements. Another way is to send them to boarding schools. Boarding schools would teach your kid to be independent and well desciplined. They will learn so much about the value of life. You can choose the best or the top boarding schools that are available in your area.

[n40066]

i never thought to look at his thumbs...thanks!  he is a heavy smoker too, though.  i did notice one day last week that the right finger of his middle hand was stained yellow.....seems odd that someone so young would have nicotine stains on their hands!  will look again if i see him this week.  he has been avoiding my parents and myself as much as possible because he claims he feels like we watch and question his every move.  and some days, we do!  it seems to have the opposite affect on him as it does you.  perhaps it's because he really is dirty and knows that if he spends too much time with us (especially me) we will know what he's up to for sure.
reading thru the list of side effects of the lithium, it can cause him to lose his appetite and cause variations in his mood.  so maybe he is clean.  i just can't be sure at this point if he is or not....but either way, he is not healthy at this point and i'm just not sure how to help him.  i guess we are both struggling right now.....
there are too many questions without proven answers...

[CATUF]

what do his thumbs look like?  when i was stuck on crack i couldn't avoid the thumb callous that comes from flicking the lighter over and over and over.  

i'd try, promise my self i'd wear a glove or light the lighter off a candle, etc., but i couldn't keep it together . . . the need to use without interuption was far stronger than the need to hide the sign of my use.

you said " recovery is difficult enough without people constantly looking at your ever move under a microscope!"  that has not been my experience.  rather, my being under a microscope for a long time allowed me to make it into sustained recovery.  

now i don't need anyone looking closely at me, but i constantly look at myself and when i find my disease trying to sneak back in i immediately "tell on my disease," with the telling being to my sponsor and whatever folks happen to be at the next closed meeting i go to.

at any recovery house, there will be random drug screens and and a host of strict rules designed to HOLD THE ADDICT ACCOUNTABLE.  now, sober living houses are all about recovery . . . they do things that promote recovery and they forbid things that are likely to impair recovery.

CATUF
2050+

[that1gal]

These are some of the side effects:

What side effects can this medication cause?

Lithium may cause side effects. Tell your doctor if any of these symptoms are severe or do not go away:

restlessness

fine hand movements that are difficult to control

loss of appetite

stomach pain or bloating

gas

indigestion

weight gain or loss

dry mouth

excessive saliva in the mouth

tongue pain

change in the ability to taste food

swollen lips

acne

hair loss

unusual discomfort in cold temperatures

constipation

depression

joint or muscle pain

thin, brittle fingernails or hair


Some side effects may be serious. If you experience any of the following symptoms, call your doctor immediately:

tiredness

shaking of a part of your body that you cannot control

muscle weakness, stiffness, twitching, or tightness

loss of coordination

diarrhea

vomiting

excessive thirst

frequent urination

giddiness

ringing in the ears

slow, jerky movements

movements that are unusual or difficult to control

blackouts

seizures

slurred speech

fast, slow, irregular, or pounding heartbeat

chest tightness

confusion

hallucinations (seeing things or hearing voices that do not exist)

crossed eyes

painful, cold, or discolored fingers and toes

headache

pounding noises inside the head

changes in vision

paleness

itching

rash

swelling of the eyes, face, lips, tongue, throat, hands, feet, ankles, or lower legs

[that1gal]

I looked up lithium it states as most Swallow the extended-release tablet whole; do not split, chew, or crush it. SO this medicine will slow the heart down.  His pupils may not be dilating if he is doing cocaine or any other type of medication that keeps you awake.  This is also playing with his heart one medication says heart slow down then the drugs make the heart say go faster this is way it is so common for over dose.  Like I said I have lost 2 in the last 5 years to OD.  Silly kids and young adults think because it is a prescription it is ok to do and with what they are already taking and yet it kills millions every year.

My Aunt was on lithium and when she was taking it regularly she was great when she wasn't she unbearable.  This to also took a toll on her heart and we lost her a few years back.

I have a son in college also dealing with blackout drinking and smoking weed all the time.  He hasn't used anything that goes up or any pain meds.  What he is doing scares me, but if I thought he were using both I would find a way anyway I could to get him in treatment.  I would rather him be mad at me than to die.

Not sure if this has helped have several but 2 close family members with Bi-polar manic depression and their medications are all downers.

Good luck to finding you answers fully there is a place where you can ask a doctor on here I saw probably won't get back til a week day.  I sent one yesterday.

May your day be filled with love, laughter and happiness

[n40066]

he takes xanax but not very often.  he usually sells/trades it for weed.  i even told his dr what he was doing, yet the dr chose to believe whatever garbage my son fed him that what i told him.  unreal how some of these drs manage to stay in practice!  he also take lithium and trileptal, as i stated earlier.
i read the thread about you and this girl.  hope she is doing better!  and you have had some rest!!
thanks for responding, but still hoping to get an answer to my question!!

[that1gal]

I am so sorry to hear about your situation.  I have 2 sons one 20 that I have had a few issue with infact being the town mom I was at the hospital last night with a 19 year old girl that has a 9 month old baby and is coming off Oxy she was snorting it and we are only on day 6 already had to call EMSA and have been to the hospital.

My first question is do you know if he is doing anything else, xanax, klonipin, value anything that brings him down that may include his bi polar medication.  If the meds he is on is meant to slow his heart down and he is doing cocaine any form of upper this can and will cause his heart to stop.  I have lost 1 family member and my son who graduated in 2009 burried a very good friend his 1st year in college.  The mix is deadly they call it a suicide cocktail.

[n40066]

can't believe i forgot to mention this!  i found a container of sugar in his backpack that he take everywhere with him.  i took it out and left it on the kitchen counter, waiting to see if he would take it back or comment about it.  he did not.  i know that heroin addicts crave sugar.  could he be trying to get off dope by eating the sugar?  or just using it to hang on till the next fix?  this is a first for him...

[n40066]

thank you for your responses!  
i do not allow my son to live in our home anymore and haven't for about 2 years.  they don't allow him in their home alone, so when they come to my house to work the store, i have to go to their home so he isn't there alone!  none of us have a life of our own anymore!  however, my 75 yr old mother and 77 yr old father took him in and don't have it in them to kick him out.  they don't trust him not to have other people over and suspect he is dirty too, but won't kick him out because it's a holiday, too cold, too hot.....they feel he needs help but are afraid to to cut him off because one of their friends did that to their daughter last year.  the same day they cut her off completely, she checked into a seedy hotel and od'd.  fear is keeping them from doing what they know they need to do.  as we all know, addicts are the best liars out there and my son is no exception.  he can be very convincing!  he constantly tells us we can test him anytime.  which i would love to do, but know i will have only one chance!  it needs to be when i am sure he's using! his band just broke up because they feel he came to the last 2 practices high.  i was with him just before he left for practice and saw no evidence of it at all.  in 1990 i resigned my position as a narcotics officer to open my own business....so i'm not totally uninformed.  however, i have a rare brain disorder that has erased much of my memory.  and long term has taken the hardest hit.  i do know that he smokes weed every day and cannot eat unless he smokes.  he's down to about 125 -130 lbs and he's 5'11.  i think he may also have an eating disorder OR he could be using that as an excuse to mask the real issue of using crack.  i just cannot find the concrete evidence i need to confront him!  i have searched his room, coat pockets while he sleeps, gone thru his phone messages and checked phone records for consistent #'s that i don't know. (i know all the kids he hangs out with and their #'s) i have nothing to go on but my gut.  when he is around me, he seems to be fine for the most part.  he has the occasional outburst of rage and temper that could be drug induced or simply a bad bipolar moment.  the biggest thing i have noticed are his grooming behaviors.  he gets a shower only once a week!  this is consistent with drug use based on past history.  before i could always tell by these traits but always had confirmation of wonky pupils.  i really need to know if there is something he could be doing that would allow his pupils to stay normal!  in the past, he has always come thru with the truth about his usage if i confront him with concrete evidence.  his pupils have always been the clincher.  
he has been under considerable stress the past 2 months...he broke up with his gf of 3 years because he caught her drinking behind his back.  (she has a problem with booze) but i believe there was more to it than that.  i believe she was using a form of cocaine dues to rapid weight loss, although he has never told me this.  and he lost his new band right on the tail of losing another band the end of this summer.  so the setting is def. there for a relapse!
i know he has to be ready and must be willing to get clean himself and all the wishing in the world won't make that change.  when i had him in rehab in 98, i also spent a week at the betty ford clinic for family and loved ones of addicts. so i know what needs to be done as far as my role goes.  i simply can't do it alone, as he lives at my parents house!  without them, it is a lost cause.  if i can prove to them beyond a doubt that he is using again, i may be able to get them onboard.  it's the only hope i have at this point.  

[Teetime4u]

Oh and if you get that gut feeling, more than likely you are right. Trust the motherly instinct! Maby he is just using alittle to ward off sickness when he visits. Hoping ypu won't pick up on it? Do you give money or anything?

[Teetime4u]

Hello and welcome. First fo all you have to take care of yourself!!! I to am the mother of an opiate/herion addict. She started on weed, went to coke and is now shooting this crap in her veins. I know that with this rollercoaster ride we are on it is normal to doubt, wonder and think they are high,even if their not. There is combo's of drugs to counteract drugs but I am not sure what it all is. My daughter mentioned that to me one time but I was blocking her out. Sometimes I do that for my own sanity!
  Eventually you have to make your self live for you not your addict!! From what I am getting from your post you are trying to save him! Honestly you can't, until he decides to really get clean and want it more than anything else you are defenseless! Trust me like you I have. Been slamming into this brick wall for 10 yrs! And I have detatched from my daughter, but with love. I love her but I can't fix this for her. It is her own demon she must fight. Please keep posting. I am here if you need to talk.  God Bless Tee.

[Katrina81]

Hello and welcome. Im sorry you are going thru this with your son. How are YOU holding up thru this? Are you ok? Im sorry i dont have an answer for ur question but keep checking back. It tends to be quiet here on the weekend. I just dont want u to think ur being ignored. Somebody will be along that can help. Hang in there mom