RYAN

[fd11]

YOU GUYS ARE STILL LISTENING TO HIM.  WATER TITRATION IS THE WAY GO...........

[OneScaredBuckeye]

Thank you and good luck, Dominick.  I have no doubt you'll make it as you've already accomplished some very difficult things.  I think finding a good doctor is going to be one of the keys.  Best of luck to you and your family.

[fd11]

Hey ryan,

I know you came off the Klonopin, but are you on any other benzo and if so do you like that one better and what is it.  I need to get off this stuff.

Thanks
Dominick

[fd11]

Ok, I will discuss those two options with my doctor.  Now since I am affected by the Klonopin side effects, can I take .125 in the morning and .25 at night only because I have to drive to work and sometimes it can take me up to two hours?  

As for now, I have been having a really hard time breathing everyday since my Panic Attack a week ago.  Do you recommend that I go up to .375MG until I see him, because I have a huge project at work coming up and I need to start prepping for this tomorrow?  

Also, I heard that Valium is the worse thing to take.  I brought it up to my doctor and all she said was “well I wouldn’t recommend that because back in the 60’s people had an extremely difficult time coming off that stuff.”  

Thanks Again
Dominick
  

[fd11]

As of now, I am doing that water titration.  What would you say I need to do to start cutting and weaning off?  Do I go back to .375 MG and start to go down again or do I start at .25MG (maybe cross-over to another med?).  Either way I want off; I feel I am mentally strong enough to deal with this naturally (If I even have a Panic Disorder?). I have been at or below .375MG for the last 2 months now (6 weeks of dry cutting and 2 weeks of water titration).  What would you or anyone else suggest I do to get off of Klonopin?  Thanks

[fd11]

I wish you all the best as well.  Thanks

[spade22]

I count the time I started studying chemistry at  university as experience, lol.  I have 8 years - post PhD experience in chemistry.  Im certainly not a medical doctor, but contribute to this forum where I can.

[OneScaredBuckeye]

I mean to only took two Ambien.  They didn't work.

[OneScaredBuckeye]

To answer your question, no nothing else at the time, just the Paxil, 40 mg. at bedtime.  I did take Ambien after I stopped the Paxil because I had a hard time sleeping for more than three hours at a time, but I think I only took took pills because they didn't help much.  After two weeks, I was fine.  I think this is the exception rather than the rule, though.  I think most people have a harder time and I'm lucky where drugs are concerned.  

And I wasn't judging you by any means.  I don't judge anyone unless they really do something terrible, like deliberately hurt another person or something similar.  I understand that you were only trying to help a very terrible problem.  I'm glad to hear you managed to stop smoking and drinking and taking diet pills.  To me, that shows you're very strong and can overcome this latest problem, too.  It might be hard, but I have no doubt stopping smoking and drinking is very, very hard.  If you can do that, you can do just about anything.  I wish you the best.

[Mark TX]

It is nice to see everyone getting along.  I think what we all need to remember is that we all share a common problem.  We might disagree on the exact nature and causes... and very likely that's because it's a little different for each of us.  No doubt my anxiety was triggered by some factor different than what triggered other's.  And perhaps treatment that works well for me might not work well for others, and vice versa.  And I've had my own share of misinformation coming to this site.  I'm grateful for those who've helped me clarify my misunderstandings.  But I'm still skeptical of every post I read, no matter how qualified any of you seem.  I visited my GP today and it was pretty apparent that she has no idea how to wean someone off klonopin, but she has little problem advising me to take it, or refilling the script.   So I think it's wise to ask questions... and keep asking if you don't understand or don't agree.  Because very often disagreements are based on lack of information, or incomplete or erroneous information... and the best way to sort it out is to keep talking like adults.

mark

[Raine9]

You have 14 years of experience?  You're 32 right?  How old were you, when you earn your PhD?  Goodness...

[spade22]

I don't know what some of those abbreviations mean, but from the list you provided it looks like Klonopin is available in 1/8 and 1/4 mg doses.

Another point to discuss w/ your doctor is the "accuracy" of the method.  Simple ask how you are supposed to obtain the required precision of measurement when the instruments (measuring cylinder or syringe) have a high error associated w/ them; take it from someone with a PhD in chemistry, 14 years experience, and over 5 years teaching gen chem and organic chemistry.  Then of course bring up the fact klonopin (and the inactive ingredients) is insoluble in water - this makes it impossible to obtain a uniform suspension which makes the method even more inaccurate.

Finally, Ryan wrote:
"He likely knows that titrating Klonopin via water doesn't actually work, although I doubt that he'd admit it. I think his main goal is to take your money, and get you out of his office ASAP"

I agree with part of this statement - the psychiatrist  is probably just out to get your money.  In terms of him "knowing" the water titration method doesn't work?  This is debatable.... he didn't know what dosings of klonopin were available which leads me to believe he isnt as intelligent/book smart as one might assume.

[Raine9]

He likes vintage muscle cars.  

[fd11]

It is getting so happy in here i might have to send Ryan some roses.  LOL

[fd11]

“The mere fact that he wasn't aware of the existence of Klonopin (and generic Clonazepam) wafers is disturbing, particularly given the fact that he is the "director of pharmacology". Any major pharmacy would stock these. The purpose of the wafers is two-fold: (1) They may be used as-needed for anticipatory anxiety (or during a panic attack), and (2) To aid in the discontinuation of the tablets. I wasn't aware that the tablet form is available in dosages under 0.5 mg, but that is good to know.”

^End quote

I couldn’t agree more.  He, believe it or not is highly recommended and this scares me.  As for the tablet, I am pretty sure there is a lower dose in a tablet form unless I am mistaking.  The pharmacist gave me an information sheet that reads exactly like this:

# Drug Description
1 Clonazepam 0.5 MG Tablet APO
2 Clonazepam 0.5 MG Tablet IVX
3 Clonazepam 0.25 MG DIS TAB PAR
4 Clonazepam 0.25 MG DIS TABLBRR
5 Clonazepam 0.5 MG DIS TABLEBRR
6 Clonazepam 0.125 MG DIS TABPAR
7 Clonazepam 1 MG DIS TABLET PAR
8 Clonazepam 0.5 MG DIS TAB PAR

Now what the above info means, I have no idea.  Also thanks for the link; I will be bringing this to his attention.  My wife is actually coming with me so there is no police activity - LOL.  I am sick of getting jerked around by these doctors.

Thanks Again
Dominick

[Raine9]

Glad you kids are finally getting along :)

[fd11]

They have the klonopin tablet and the wafers in smaller doses.  

[fd11]

I just got back from speaking with the pharmacist and I asked him about the lower dose of Klonopin wafers and he gave me a print out to give to my doctor.  Also, I know your are all going to nuts but I asked him about the water titration and if he thought is was ok to do and he said that is fine.  So this is why I am confused; doctors and pharmacist telling me that the water taper is ok and everyone else is telling me that it is not.  Where can I get concrete information regarding the taper is not valid so I can show them.   Thanks

[suzi-q]

Very true...if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[fd11]

Hey if you are comfortable, then that is all that matters.  

[fd11]

I have a question for you, where you on Xanax, Klonopin or any other SSRI or Benzo at the time or after the sudden stoppage of Paxil?

Everyone is different.  I smoked cigarettes and drank you to 3 cups of coffee a day and one morning decided to quit and never went back.  That never bothered me, but my aunt tried to stop the coffee and she would break out in sweats and get dizzy.  Maybe this is why I feel the way I do today – LOL.  That was a year and a half ago.  You are extremely lucky because I have never heard of someone just stopping a drug like that and they were fine.

[suzi-q]

I guess I am just not ready to go through any types of withdrawals...I am also scared that I will go back to feeling like I did before medication.  Of course, if there was a health reason to stop, I would. and then deal with it if I had to...

[fd11]

I agree with you 100%.  I need to find a new doctor.  That is a great idea, I will ask the pharmacist.  Thanks.  

[OneScaredBuckeye]

I don't understand all the problems over Paxil withdrawal.  I was on 40 mg. every bedtime and I had to stop cold turkey because of a medical problem.  I didn't even want to stop.  The Paxil was working so well, I had to stop, no "if," "ands," or "buts" about it.  For two weeks, I could barely sleep, even with Ambien, and when I did sleep, it wasn't good sleep and was filled with vivid dreams (not nightmares, but strange, unsettling dreams - I'd heard Paxil, itself caused that, but it never happened to me while on Paxil).  I felt a little "down," but nothing significant.  In two weeks, I was back to myself again.  My little sister stopped it by slowly reducing the dosage and she, too, had no problems.  She was on it for probably a year or more.  Are you sure you all aren't giving up too soon?  I can attest to the fact that Paxil leaves no permanent problems.

Maybe it's me who's the anomaly.  I've never had any significant trouble stopping any drug and never craved one afterward.  I don't think people should stop cold turkey, but it seems to work for me.  I think you're going to have to accept the fact that stopping any drug is going to feel bad for awhile.

[tanns]

No offense but you need a new doctor.  If you just google Klonopin wafers, all sorts of info is out there.  Plus, any pharmacist can confirm that they exist.  Your doctor is not only misinformed but he doesn't seem to be doing you any good.   I'd start searching for a new one, unless you want to wait until after Friday when you can kick the s**t out of him first!  Kidding, of course.

I wish you the very, very best of luck in over coming this, it is hard and frustrating.

Take Care, t.