Crying for no good reason...

[adavisirl]

Well, this peg/riba tx is a strange trip. I'm in week 10, and I notice I'm more and more prone to crying. I know that depression is  a real possibility while on tx, but I don't think I'm depressed. But I'm very sensitive to emotional situations. I finish a task and the boss thanks me - I'm crying. I watch a movie - crying. Walk down the street, think of my father who died of melanoma - crying. But it's more like a welling-up of tears that I can somewhat control, rather than full-blown blubbering! It happens several times per day.

Anyways, I function just fine at work, I sleep fine, my wife and I have a great relationship and she's very supportive, so things are not so terrible. Should I talk with my doctor about this?
It does lube my dry, sore eyes!

Cheers, and thank you all, this forum is excellent,
Andrew

[Mr Liver]

I'm glad you were a good friend and convinced her to act. I'm not an expert on depression, but when someone experiences that many of the warning signs it certainly should be addressed, and the sooner the better, I would think. I wish her success---in most cases there is simply no reason for someone to endure all of the anguish and mental pain that she must feel at times. Thanks for your post.
regards,
Mr Liver

[Mr Liver]

I know what you mean when you refer to 'dark depression". Good description.
The dark part is akin to being on the event horizon of a black hole. At this point, you either work your way back or you get sucked in very rapidly.I can see by your depression score that treatment wasn't exactly a magic carpet ride for you. I'm glad you made it through to the other side and your quality of life bounced back. I think the vast majority of people follow a similar path save for the dark episodes of depresssion that you experienced. And I know exactly what you mean when you said you never want to be in that place again. Thanks for your post.
regards,
Mr Liver

[Lady Lauri]

  Copied your list and just used it for a friend of mine (healthy, no hep or health problems) of 20 years who has been severely depressed for a few years. Have talked to her before too. Her daughter and I (she's 22) have talked about intervening awhile now! She is 43, cute, has no problems and no reason for this depression-has to be clinical??
  Just sat her down, talked to her, gave her that list and told her I see 16 of 17 in her and PLEASE get help. She's agreed.

                                                Thanks!                                           LL

[sunspot]

I was quite teary on tx. When Dr. House lost a patient, there I went, eyes welling up. It did go away post-tx.

Mr L. I was on AD’s before starting my tx, however, I had a few episodes of “Dark Depression” when treating for the Hep. They only lasted a few days each but I never want to go there again. You are right in giving out warnings about major depression although most people will not have that happen to them. It’s a great idea to be on the lookout for signs.
BTW, I scored 12 on your list of 17 while on tx. I’m at a 4 now and a 2 pre-tx.

Treatment is doable but is was a winding road to travel.

[scratchinghead]

I had several Aunt Bees in my life (I was kinda like Opy). Big positive influences. My cheerleaders and I feel sad I never told them that.

[mikesimon]

That was a very good description. And no, I have not cried over the Beaver since then. In fact, I don't recall watching Leave It To Beaver since that episode. I never watched TV much before my transplant but since then I have developed quite an addiction to TV. It started with my first treatment and then after my bike wreck when I could not walk TV was all I had. My head injuries resulted in "benign positional vertigo" which made reading an impossible task - I had double vision - so TV was it for me. I watched Maury, Springer, those insane judge shows, television evangelists and anything else I could find. Now I am much more discriminating in my viewing - I watch the Rifleman nowadays. Mike  

[Lady Lauri]

You guys are too funny. I could cry at 'The Beaver' right now too!

Weepys big time, but not 'depressed'. Pretty d*m positive actually and still 'social' at home.
But as I already tear up easily, tx is making me cry at the dumbest of things.
Agree with some others above, crying can be good for you, as long as you are not also getting depression. Tx just mess's with your emotional state.

                                                                      LL

[Mr Liver]

I think your hep doc characterizes the emotions that many are affected by on tx very well. It does intensify emotions. I've laughed very hard on tx--rarely, but it happened.

Are you in for 24 or 48 ? Either way, congrats on completing this much tx so far, and best of luck for SVR !
regards,
Mr Liver

[Mr Liver]

"including one I dated :) "

LOL--that's too funny !

Thanks for the link I'll check that out. I remember when I did my first treatment in early '00 and pulled out that 2 foot long insert in mouseprint font on both sides from the package. I still have one hiding somewhere. Anyway, to the point- depression was listed as a side effect , but no special attention was drawn to the fact, it even being listed below such things as nausea and myalgia, etc. Of course now it gets top billing in a black box.

You've been around a long time and you know the stories---it doesn't happen often, but every once in awhile someone  has to quit tx due to the mental side effects. If they are online they usually disappear from forums for awhile and then reappear with their tale of a psychiatric episode. I think we'd hear more stories if there wasn't a stigma attached to it.

Major depression is not common,  but if you've ever had a glimpse of how severe it can be, heard the stories from others, or have personally been there as a result of tx, you tend to want to warn everyone. A head's up to someone is free, the only motivation being I really hate to see someone not complete their therapy. Personal investments vary, but everyone will have to alter their lives in some way, and I really hate to see those investments wasted with a treatable problem.

Thanks again for the link--and the laugh.

regards,
Mr Liver

[scratchinghead]

I cry whenever boy meets girl on {mumble}

[jmjm530]

It's the "Arthur Miller" article if you click on "Download Tx Reporter". Free registration to Projects In Knowledge web site may be required to access the article.

http://www.projectsinknowledge.com/Init/G/1700/index.cfm

[jmjm530]

The web site I forgot to mention in the last paragraph is "Projects In Knowledge"
http://www.projectsinknowledge.com/

[jmjm530]

I don't doubt you're correct re shrinks not fully understanding/having experience with interferon-induced depression.

In fact, I think that concept -- no clue of interferon-related symptons -- can be expanded to all of the medical specialties. But no, my shrink didn't seem all that concerned, or tell me to keep a "close eye" on things, but like you say, he may indeed have been clueless -- I've found many shrinks are, including one I dated :)

That said, my main point was that this, let's call it hyper-emotionality, seems very common with the treatment drugs -- so I think it comes down to whether one believes using ADs for most on tx (as btw did my treatment team), even prophylactively -- or does one believe best to leave them alone unless you really need them -- which is the camp I fell into, at least for myself.

Actually I did try ADs a couple of times, but it made my GERD worse both times plus the second time I got quite jittery. Then decided to go without but I was quite isolated from people during tx. Had I worked in an office, for example, probably would have needed ADs to keep from tearing off people's heads on a daily basis.

I'm pretty open on the AD subject, both for myself and others -- but again, just didn't see too many alarm bells here, but your thought about keeping a close eye on mood swings is a good one because there is a per cent of people who can develop the kind of depression that ends treatment.

Not sure if it's still there, but a couple of years ago there was an excellent presentation on interferon-related depression by an oncologist, relating his experiences and conclusions. To oversimply, he identified two types of interferon-related issues often requiring two different drug treatments run simultaneously. One, for what most of us call "depression" -- and in this case he prescribes ADS -- and the other for the interferon type of fatigue that also "depresses". For that I believe he prescribed some sort of stimulant. If I find the presentaion I will post later.

All the best,

-- Jim

[Mr Liver]

To clarify, specifically I was referring to IFN-caused depression. Most psychiatrists will never see these types of cases. I have had some rather up close and personal experience with this fact.
Regards,
Mr Liver

[Mr Liver]

Here are symptoms associated with melancholia , a severe form of depression. For those who have treatment, I'm sure some of these will ring a bell.

low mood
low self-esteem
pessimism
fatigue, reduced energy
disturbances of sleep (insomnia or hypersomnia)
disturbances of appetite (anorexia or hyperphagia)
agitation or retardation
guilt
sense of worthlessness
hopelessness
helplessness
poor motivation
poor concentration
indecision
loss of interest or pleasure in normal activities
low libido
recurrent thoughts of death

[Mr Liver]

Most shrinks are clueless about reactionary depression. Perhaps yours wasn't.
But I would be extremely surprised if he didn't tell you to keep a close eye on your mood during that visit.
Best regards,
PK

[Mr Liver]

I said 'most' not all. "

"I'd bet most of the respondents to your post were on AD before tx or started them for tx".

Depression is not a light switch. It has stages. Crying at the drop of a hat CAN be a classic symptom of depression. You can roll the dice or you can react to it and medicate it . In 70% of those who treat it does not rise to the level whereby discontinuation is necessary. Reactionary (NOT situational) depression can escalate from crying jags to suicidal ideation and pcyhosis in a fairly short timeframe for some. Far too fast to react with medication. This is why almost every tx algorithm calls for psychiatric evaluation and the prohylactic use of AD, not waiting to see if a problem develops.

If depression wasn't a problem then it wouldn't account for the predominant reason for discontiuance of treatment.
I have no theory---I made an assumption.
Best regards,
PK

[jmjm530]

OK, some very *light* sobbing on occasion, but certainly not at "Leave it to Beaver".

[jmjm530]

Just like to add that I discussed this exact issue with my shrink -- crying at things like tv commercials, etc -- and he did not diagnose this as depression or did not think I needed ADs.

I can't say I was breaking down into uncontrollable crying fits, it was more a tearing up in the eyes/lump in the throat kind of thing that if someone wasn't looking at me might not notice. It was not loud sobbing, for example. I assume that is what was being discussed. I wish I could remember the name my shrink gave me for the condition but it translated into something like 'heightened sensitivity'.

Everytime someone posts here about this happening, we have many responses "that's me" responses, so it seems quite normal with the treatment drugs. I'm sure Mike Simon hasn't cried over Beaver since, nor have I cried over a TV commercial since completing tx.

-- Jim

[mikesimon]

I wasn't on ADs before TX, during TX or since TX and I did 3.5+ years of treatment. I have never been on ADs in my long life but, nevertheless I was a crybaby during TX. I stopped that crying at the drop of a hat - or the Beaver - very soon after stopping TX. So I am one who doesn't fit into your theory. Mike

[Mr Liver]

You didn't mention whether you are on anti-depressants ? If you aren't then you should discuss this with your doctor. Crying at the drop of the hat is an early sign of reactionary (chemically induced) depression. I'd bet most of the respondents to your post were on AD before tx or started them for tx. Your symptoms  may or MAY not stop at this level, even if you are on AD. Many people are under-medicated for depression while on treatment, and many times a dose escalation of AD is required. You NEVER want to ignore symptoms such as these. A fast escalation of depression is common when it is reactionary. The largest percentage of those who have to discontinue treatment are from those experiencing severe psychiatric side effects (30%). It's nothing to mess with no matter how many people tell you it's "doable".
Best regards,
PK

[SteveHepC]

I was on treatment and picked up a DVD of the movie ET. I cried with joy when ET came back to life.
Heck.....................even before I got this HEP thing, I cried at Opie and Andy, and even Lassie.

[Forseegood]

well, maybe it's because YOU didn't have a crush on Eddie Haskell like I did...Grandpa on My Three Sons kinda got me goin too....

[Whrose]

'the whistle in the wind....................the boy calling his dog...................
'lassie come save the day"
sobs, sniff sniff, blow)))))) erghh