Aa
Being drug free "clean"
I have been noticed this alot lately and I have choose not to say anything for a long time but I deside that was not helping anyone who truly whats to live a drug free life.
I see alot of members that stop there drug of choice. I am absolutely proud of everyone that can get off there drug of choice.However they are still taking other drugs benzos ,drinking ,smoking pot and stating they are drug free."clean"is that clean?
Recovery and staying clean for me a big part is being brutally honest with myself .If you are using other drugs are you clean truly clean?These are questions you have to ask yourself and figure out what you consider drug free .
I see alot of members that stop there drug of choice. I am absolutely proud of everyone that can get off there drug of choice.However they are still taking other drugs benzos ,drinking ,smoking pot and stating they are drug free."clean"is that clean?
Recovery and staying clean for me a big part is being brutally honest with myself .If you are using other drugs are you clean truly clean?These are questions you have to ask yourself and figure out what you consider drug free .
Some people just have addictive personalities, have you talked to a anyone during your process of recovery? Sometimes it's better to work with our flaws instead of fighting them, and turn those addictive impulses into postives. For example, go for a run everyday and make that your addiction (its good for endorphins)! Also I'd suggest talking to someone to lift some weight of yourself. We all have our reasons for self-medicating, and the only way to stop is to find the reason why we do it. Recovery is not suppose to be an easy process, we have to go through therapy, we have to cry, we have to uncover the underlining reasons for why we use, and lastly we have to bury it and forgive ourselves!! I know it's dark now, but I promise there is a light at the end of the tunnel.... I know there is, you just have to keep believing that :)
Good luck, god bless
Good luck, god bless
I feel that finding this place has helped me so much! I'm so much better than i was 3 months ago...and hopefully getting better by the day. I've tried to be honest with what i've posted so far...i could just say what i think would be the right thing...but i usually don't. I'm not looking for an easy way out...in fact, if you had told me 3 years ago that i would be here, and dealing with this, i wouldn't have believed it. I've heard there's a reason for everything, maybe this is about coming together and helping each other thru such things that do not discriminate. People from all walks of life, at some time or another, are dealing with some form of escape or self-medicating. When i wasn't using, i was shopping, or doing something else to the extreme. I've often wondered why, why some people don't appear to be dealing with such things...but i'm pretty sure we're all working thru something. I'm a work in progress...i want to stay positive about the journey.
PS- To Avisg...
I think you should be really proud that you were able to break the cycle of addictive behavior, and thats awesome. However, I think its important to note that not everyone is as strong as you. We are each going to have to fight our own battle. Some people have a harder time getting through withdrawals and thats why they keep using.... so I say we all should do what is best for us to get past the WD's and end it. Not everyone can go cold turkey as you seem to have done, and thats ok too so long as we don't give up. Whats more important is being Honest, as you had said and not lieing to ourselves thinking we are clean until we are totally drug free....
For me its been a bit of a struggle doin it cold turkey so yeah I have smoked pot to try to sleep or taken a sub to ease the process and I realize this may not be for everyone but hey it got me to stop taking oxys and thats something I am proud of!! Noiw its time for me to seek medical help and speak to someone and stop all the drugs (FOR ME this has been the only way that I can do this)
Good luck, and congrats- I hope you understand I am on your side with the honestly but I dont think we should knock others for there methods so long as we are working toward a drug free life
I think you should be really proud that you were able to break the cycle of addictive behavior, and thats awesome. However, I think its important to note that not everyone is as strong as you. We are each going to have to fight our own battle. Some people have a harder time getting through withdrawals and thats why they keep using.... so I say we all should do what is best for us to get past the WD's and end it. Not everyone can go cold turkey as you seem to have done, and thats ok too so long as we don't give up. Whats more important is being Honest, as you had said and not lieing to ourselves thinking we are clean until we are totally drug free....
For me its been a bit of a struggle doin it cold turkey so yeah I have smoked pot to try to sleep or taken a sub to ease the process and I realize this may not be for everyone but hey it got me to stop taking oxys and thats something I am proud of!! Noiw its time for me to seek medical help and speak to someone and stop all the drugs (FOR ME this has been the only way that I can do this)
Good luck, and congrats- I hope you understand I am on your side with the honestly but I dont think we should knock others for there methods so long as we are working toward a drug free life
Hey all, this is an interesting post and I thought it would be fitting to respond since I probably am one of those people saying I'm clean when not completely so. I completely agree with the fact that we SHOULD NOT replace one addiction with another by taking other medications. However, taking suboxone or methadone is a different story. If these medications are taken under doctor care with the sole purpose of getting off drugs all and all, than I am for them. Personally for me "being clean" was stopping opiates even if I was taking suboxe to ease the process. With that said I realize that being on subs is not "being clean", but recovery is a process and stopping "your drug of choice" is A BIG DEAL and we should all be proud of that. I don't feel it is anyones place to judge the means at which we go about "getting clean", so long as we are DOING IT!! Still, I understand that replacing one drug for another is NOT the answer. Part of recovery is being honest with others and OURSELVES, and I would hope we will all be understanding with eachother. So I do apologize If I was someone who stated "I was Clean" when I was in the "process", and I DO think it is important to adress that being clean takes on a different meaning for each individual! The important part is that we support eachother, and keep in mind that this is a LIFE LONG DISEASE, so is anyone really ever cured??? No its a battle, and the keys to beating it (as I am learning) is that we start with HONESTY, SUPPORT, and NEVER GIVING UP! We ALL deserve a good life, without drugs dictating how we live.
I hope everyone understands that I DO NOT encourage anyone to replace one drug for another, and I understand that saying "we are clean" when really we are not is only hurting ourselves. So this is me saying I AM NOT CLEAN but, I am WORKING ON IT and wont ever stop the fight!! Lets all keep fighting it out, and remember honesty it key and we are only lieing to ourselves if we are lieing on here. Good luck to all- u all have my support in my heart!!
I hope everyone understands that I DO NOT encourage anyone to replace one drug for another, and I understand that saying "we are clean" when really we are not is only hurting ourselves. So this is me saying I AM NOT CLEAN but, I am WORKING ON IT and wont ever stop the fight!! Lets all keep fighting it out, and remember honesty it key and we are only lieing to ourselves if we are lieing on here. Good luck to all- u all have my support in my heart!!
Thanks for the great post. Are we not all here to learn healthy ways to get better, seek help, support & encouragement, and give back the same when possible? I totally agree with your “bottom line” statement. Congratulations on 8 days. I hope you get some sleep soon
I was on prescribed meds a few years ago due to an injury and ended up taking a newcomers key tag not because I abused the meds or even took more then prescribed but because of my intent,,it wasnt because of pain but a desire to get "that" feeling again.The program absolutely works for me when I work it.
I dont think anyone here his judging anyone .I went 4 nights 0 sleep and no it was not fun and I worked as well has well closed on my house and moved .I new for me it was time to do it .Without using the same cycle I had been for years that always lead me back to using .I also got recovery care.So its not about judgment it about breaking addictive behaviors .One can take it as judgemental but that would be to bad because they would be missing what I am trying to say.
I don't think anyone here is advocating that anyone be in pain..or "tough it out" through depression or schizophrenia. The ultimate precursor is addictive behavior. Most NA people don't consider antidepressants an addictive mood altering drug. I know people in NA that take opiate medication for chronic pain. Life happens. Are they clean? Not my call and none of my business. They are in recovery however and not abusing the medication. It's also for a true illness.
That came across a little harsher than I would have like. What I mean is this. I know a guy who's had three hip replacements in recovery. He HAD to take opiates and didn't change his clean date, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I was listening to an NA speaker tape today and a guy shared about cracking 17 vertebrae and his doctor gave him nothing - just told him to pray, started to walk away but turned around, and then said pray hard. Obviously that guy didn't change his clean date either, and there's nothing wrong with that. I don't believe in the marijuana maintenance program, and I never considered myself clean on suboxone. But what about people with schizophrenia and bipolar disorder? They HAVE to take mind/mood altering substances to lead a healthy productive life, and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. To judge people when they are down and out isn't what NA or Recovery is about. I think it has to be an outside issue to avoid contention. They also say that clean days are by your count, not ours. Not everyone has years clean in the program. I definitely think sponsors should be handing out tough love, otherwise we're never going to grow in recovery, but it needs to be based on the principles of the program.
Here's (part of) what the NA Booklet "In Times of Illness" (page 3) says on the subject:
"
Medication in Recovery
NA as a whole has no opinion on outside issues, including health issues. We are concerned with recovery from the disease of addiction. Although our recovery is complicated when we experience disease or injury, this does not have to lead us away from recovery.
The ultimate responsibility for making medical decisions rests with each individual. If we choose to accept it, however, a great deal of support is available to help us make these decisions. For instance, we can practice the Twelve Steps, maintain frequent contact with our sponsor, write about our feelings and motives, and share at meetings. With the support of others in Narcotics Anonymous, we find the strength we need to make healthy decisions for our own recovery.
The use of medication in recovery is often controversial. It's good to remember that the Basic Text recommends consulting professionals concerning our medical problems. When we remember that the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop using, we as members can set aside our judgment of others. Clean time is an issue for each of us to resolve individually with our sponsor and our Higher Power. An attitude of judgment on our part could cause great harm to another addict.
When someone we know has been taking prescribed medication, we can help them by offering support and by sharing our experience, strength, and hope. We fulfill our primary purpose by supporting another addict's recovery with an attitude of care, love, and concern.
"
End Text
Bottom line - I don't think it's beneficial to judge people because they listen to a health professional. What the hell are we doing on this forum if we're going to throw western medicine out the window just because we happen to be addicts? Real life still happens in recovery. I got two hours sleep last night because I'm 8 days clean off a 2 year run. Think I've relapsed because I want to get three hours tonight and I'm working with a doctor on exactly what doses I should take of Mirapex, Trazadone, Ambien, whatever they happen to prescribe to keep me from ending up in the ER hallucinating again from lack of sleep? That's ridiculous.
"
Medication in Recovery
NA as a whole has no opinion on outside issues, including health issues. We are concerned with recovery from the disease of addiction. Although our recovery is complicated when we experience disease or injury, this does not have to lead us away from recovery.
The ultimate responsibility for making medical decisions rests with each individual. If we choose to accept it, however, a great deal of support is available to help us make these decisions. For instance, we can practice the Twelve Steps, maintain frequent contact with our sponsor, write about our feelings and motives, and share at meetings. With the support of others in Narcotics Anonymous, we find the strength we need to make healthy decisions for our own recovery.
The use of medication in recovery is often controversial. It's good to remember that the Basic Text recommends consulting professionals concerning our medical problems. When we remember that the only requirement for membership is a desire to stop using, we as members can set aside our judgment of others. Clean time is an issue for each of us to resolve individually with our sponsor and our Higher Power. An attitude of judgment on our part could cause great harm to another addict.
When someone we know has been taking prescribed medication, we can help them by offering support and by sharing our experience, strength, and hope. We fulfill our primary purpose by supporting another addict's recovery with an attitude of care, love, and concern.
"
End Text
Bottom line - I don't think it's beneficial to judge people because they listen to a health professional. What the hell are we doing on this forum if we're going to throw western medicine out the window just because we happen to be addicts? Real life still happens in recovery. I got two hours sleep last night because I'm 8 days clean off a 2 year run. Think I've relapsed because I want to get three hours tonight and I'm working with a doctor on exactly what doses I should take of Mirapex, Trazadone, Ambien, whatever they happen to prescribe to keep me from ending up in the ER hallucinating again from lack of sleep? That's ridiculous.
COMMUNITY LEADER
i would like to add something else to this wd thing........there is NO easy way out...if there was we would of all done it. The only way not to go thru wd is to not use.......plain and simple.
I agree with so much of what IBK said recommending one addictive substance to get off the addictive substance they are all ready on one if what you really want to be sober. not only does it not make much since and it totally addictive thinking and behavior.I did the same thing for years until I was really ready to quit.I would take one thing to get off another and I never really thought of it as a negative it was just helping me staying in denial how severe my issues were because I went threw very little withdrawal so what was the big deal.l I finally realized I was just repeating the same cycle over and over and if I kept it up someday it will kill me .WD without benzos and sleeping pills and other drugs is much harder but I really dont know why WD should be easy and comfortable it is what it is . .
I totally agree with Ga Guy. I can't honestly say that I'm clean because I'm on sub but what is different this time is that I'm using it as a tool rather than the solution. I'm working the steps and I am very active with my sponsor, couseling and getting to the route of why I want to use anyway. I don't feel any guilt about not being "clean" because I know I'm getting there. I'm slowly weaning of the sub (which I should have done the first go around) and I'm adjusting to life in the "clean" lane....Great post!! I guess we are all different in our thinking of what being "clean" is...
COMMUNITY LEADER
Without my aftercare i would of had no recovery. I would of just been going thru the motions. I will always be in some sort of aftercare as i am still and always will be a work in progress.......sara 475 days clean!!!
thats correct. true clean is no alcohol,pot,sub,methadone,xanax and whatever.
I can say now I am totally pill free, but not truly clean........
I can say now I am totally pill free, but not truly clean........
What a great post and a sad one to boot.
After two years of being here and 20 years in the fellowship, I thought I had heard it all but I am still surprised by the people who ask "Can I take Methadone during withdrawal?", or "Can I take Benadryl and Xanax and alcohol to sleep?".
It is about getting off of all mind or mood altering substances for me.
I have also met thousands upon thousands of people since I have been here and I don't know a handful who got into aftercare and are still clean today. That scares me.
That is why I do not push the fellowships of NA or AA on anyone. It is a program of attraction, not promotion and it is not for everyone. I always suggest aftercare and that can come in many forms.
I wish everyone would "get it" and get and stay clean but that is not possible. I only hope that maybe I have helped one person in my short time here.
Thanks for the post Avis and I pray people at least read this. I don't believe that anyone is hopeless.
After two years of being here and 20 years in the fellowship, I thought I had heard it all but I am still surprised by the people who ask "Can I take Methadone during withdrawal?", or "Can I take Benadryl and Xanax and alcohol to sleep?".
It is about getting off of all mind or mood altering substances for me.
I have also met thousands upon thousands of people since I have been here and I don't know a handful who got into aftercare and are still clean today. That scares me.
That is why I do not push the fellowships of NA or AA on anyone. It is a program of attraction, not promotion and it is not for everyone. I always suggest aftercare and that can come in many forms.
I wish everyone would "get it" and get and stay clean but that is not possible. I only hope that maybe I have helped one person in my short time here.
Thanks for the post Avis and I pray people at least read this. I don't believe that anyone is hopeless.
I agree avisg. Even if you use Sub you will have to come off to be "clean"
I also gave of nictione as well. I think I am squeaky clean lol It is a really hard road and we all hit bumps it is how you handle the bumps.
I think recovering is better word for some of our addict buddies. Never give up and Congrads to all fighting the fight.
Terry
I also gave of nictione as well. I think I am squeaky clean lol It is a really hard road and we all hit bumps it is how you handle the bumps.
I think recovering is better word for some of our addict buddies. Never give up and Congrads to all fighting the fight.
Terry
You know, for me, being clean means less for me than for someone to tell me they're working their recovery. I personally took Sub while in NA. I never considered myself clean, but I was working my recovery. Now, I'm both. But, I agree, for someone to be able to say they're clean...then it means from all mood altering drugs..including pot, alcohol, and benzos...including Ambien and Lunesta. I've been in recovery and clean for a few 24 hours now and I feel truly blessed to be so.
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